Video: 441 vs 440/460 vs 681

blsnelling · Dec 28, 2009

While out running the 441 today, we also ran my 440 w/460 top end, and my 681. Unfortuantely, we ran into big knots in the wood the really scewed the times. None the less, here they are for your viewing pleasure

Slamm · Dec 28, 2009

Just going by the video clock here is how I have them timed:

441 ---------- 13.5 secs 14 secs 15 seconds
440/460 top -- 13 secs 14 seconds
381 ---------- 17.5 secs 15.5 secs 18.5 secs
7900 --------- 25 secs

Sam

blsnelling · Dec 28, 2009

Slamm said:
Just going by the video clock here is how I have them timed:

441 ---------- 13.5 secs 14 secs 15 seconds
440/460 top -- 13 secs 14 seconds
381 ---------- 17.5 secs 15.5 secs 18.5 secs
7900 --------- 25 secs

Sam

You are correct, but the knot in the bottom of the log greatly hurt the cut times on the last two saws especially. Even the last cut of the 440/460 started getting into it. Otherwise, I would have posted all the times in the video. Never the less, the 441 is right there at the heals of a good running 440/460. I'm impressed with that 441. Nothing wrong at all with a ported 441 :clap:

Slamm · Dec 28, 2009

I knew in time others would see the light, LOL. Good work Brad and thanks for the videos which showed what I have been saying for awhile now. The 441 is right there in the mix with the 460, yet gets much better fuel mileage, better AV and better air filtration. In my mind there really isn't any knock against it.

Did you do a pop piston or just simple port work and muffler modd?

Is the 440/460 top ...... a pop up piston??

Basically are we comparing apples to apples in the work that you performed?

Also I think you will get better with the 441 as you do more and get some tricks down pat.

What are your thoughts on advancing the timing by one full key slot on the crank?

And if you didn't do a pop piston, what are your thoughts on that for a working saw??

Thanks,

Sam

stihlboy · Dec 28, 2009

Slamm said:
Just going by the video clock here is how I have them timed:

441 ---------- 13.5 secs 14 secs 15 seconds
440/460 top -- 13 secs 14 seconds
381 ---------- 17.5 secs 15.5 secs 18.5 secs
7900 --------- 25 secs

Sam

man, by those times that 681 is straight slow..... pretty good for a stock saw i wonder how well it responds to porting :cheers:

blsnelling · Dec 28, 2009

stihlboy said:
man, by those times that 681 is straight slow..... pretty good for a stock saw i wonder how well it responds to porting

What the video close Fred. The 681 didn't make one cut in clean wood.

blsnelling · Dec 28, 2009

Slamm said:
I knew in time others would see the light, LOL. Good work Brad and thanks for the videos which showed what I have been saying for awhile now. The 441 is right there in the mix with the 460, yet gets much better fuel mileage, better AV and better air filtration. In my mind there really isn't any knock against it.

Did you do a pop piston or just simple port work and muffler modd?

Is the 440/460 top ...... a pop up piston??

Basically are we comparing apples to apples in the work that you performed?

Also I think you will get better with the 441 as you do more and get some tricks down pat.

What are your thoughts on advancing the timing by one full key slot on the crank?

And if you didn't do a pop piston, what are your thoughts on that for a working saw??

Thanks,

Sam

Neither saw has a popup. Both have straight porting and muffler mods. I don't care to advance the timing on a customers saw. I know, the taper should hold it, but I don't want to risk that on someone elses saw. I've not uet got around to tuning the timing on any of my saws besides the 681. I really need to do that. BTW, a full key width would be a lot. I'm thinking more like 1/2 key width.

stihlboy · Dec 28, 2009

blsnelling said:
What the video close Fred. The 681 didn't make one cut in clean wood.

oh, you need some cants!

willsaw4beer · Dec 28, 2009

So I'm about the last AS member in NY running stock saws these days it seems..

STEVEGODSEYJR · Dec 28, 2009

I agree with Slamm...I knew people would finally take a liking to the 441 Stihl. I have had one for over a year now and it is the best saw I have EVER owned. It is only muffler modded. Glad to see you have the porting down on the new style engines, Brad. You do good work!!!! :cheers:

Steve

2000ssm6 · Dec 28, 2009

The 441 and hybrid 440 look great. That 681 needs some attention though.

the westspartan · Dec 29, 2009

2000ssm6 said:
The 441 and hybrid 440 look great. That 681 needs some attention though.

The 681 was cutting through a SERIOUS knot in the wood. The 681 really shined when burried in dead dry oak.

2000ssm6 · Dec 29, 2009

the westspartan said:
The 681 was cutting through a SERIOUS knot in the wood. The 681 really shined when burried in dead dry oak.

Knots or not, it needs some porting to hang with those other 2. They are impressive against a stock 440 or 441 though.

blsnelling · Dec 29, 2009

2000ssm6 said:
Knots or not, it needs some porting to hang with those other 2. They are impressive against a stock 440 or 441 though.

The 681 has been ported. But to be honest with you, we were all rather disappointed with it today...until we had the 32" bar buried in some serious hard Oak. Then it started to shine. But, it still wasn't what I expected against the other saws. So...The P&C has been back off of it tonight, some more massaging done, and back together for another go at it. I'll give it another run tomorrow.

In all fairness to the 681 though, watch it through the top half of the log. I don't think it's as far off as it seems.

WoodChuck'r · Dec 29, 2009

That video is sweet.

I love them all.

2000ssm6 · Dec 29, 2009

blsnelling said:
The 681 has been ported. But to be honest with you, we were all rather disappointed with it today...until we had the 32" bar buried in some serious hard Oak. Then it started to shine. But, it still wasn't what I expected against the other saws. So...The P&C has been back off of it tonight, some more massaging done, and back together for another go at it. I'll give it another run tomorrow.

In all fairness to the 681 though, watch it through the top half of the log. I don't think it's as far off as it seems.

Dang, I thought it was stock. :dizzy:

I watched the vid 3 times now and you are right, looks good until the knot(s). If that is all my ported 681 would do, I'd leave her on the shelf though. It just took a beat down from a 441, LOL. Post the updated vid when you get it back together.

blsnelling · Dec 29, 2009

I'm feelin' what you guys are feelin'. That's why I tore it back down looking for more. Let me put it this way. It'll defintaly be faster...or slower, lol. I made some definate changes.

Slamm · Dec 29, 2009

blsnelling said:
I'm feelin' what you guys are feelin'. That's why I tore it back down looking for more. Let me put it this way. It'll defintaly be faster...or slower, lol. I made some definate changes.

Brad, will you or do you still have the 441 around to retest it against the reworked 681?

Let us know how it goes,

Sam

blsnelling · Dec 29, 2009

Slamm said:
Brad, will you or do you still have the 441 around to retest it against the reworked 681?

Let us know how it goes,

Sam

Dan took it with him yesterday. They'll both be at the GTG Saturday though.

Meadow Beaver · Dec 29, 2009

There's been a few people who have ported 681's.

Video: 441 vs 440/460 vs 681

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