I've Been Screwed!!!

blsnelling · Dec 6, 2006

I've Been Screwed!!! MS 440 Rebuild

OUCH! I bought this MS 440 of eBay and got it today. LINK All it was supposed to need was a coil and a starter rope, per a dealer's inspection. It's also only supposed to be two years old. Check out what I got.

I put a different coil in it, fixed the starter and tried to start it. It tried to fire but would not start. The enging was very noisy when I pulled the starter rope. I finally removed the muffler and found that the piston is extremely scored. I then removed the cylinder to find that it is ruined as well as the crank. There are deep gouges in the cylinder wall. The connecting rod bearing cage on the crank is all busted up. This is what was causing all the noise. This saw is toast. You can see that the saw has been apart before. The cylinder has been honed and the piston sanded. You can also see pieces of old rings embedded in the cylinder head and piston top. These did not come from the piston in the saw. It's rings are not broken.

I sent an email and offered to reassemble and return the saw as is or discuss replacing the crank, cylinder/piston, and gaskets. I even sent links of the best deals on a used crank and cylinder/piston. I haven't heard back since I just sent it. What's your take on this?

You can find all the high resolution pictures HERE

cuttinscott · Dec 6, 2006

those pieces embedded in the top of the piston are needle bearings from the conn rod failure

Scott

oldsaw · Dec 6, 2006

hosejob.

You done been had, IMHO, of course.

Wow, sharp eye, Scott. You would be right.

Mark

Trigger-Time · Dec 6, 2006

All I can say is, Yes you have!
And all the luck to you in the world.

blsnelling · Dec 6, 2006

It's amazing this thing didn't explode. The crank side bearings still seem to be good. Will an 044 crank drop right in?

begleytree · Dec 6, 2006

email ebay dispute resolution tonight! any time on it and he can say you ran it without mix or someother BS.
-Ralph

Just Mow · Dec 6, 2006

psssssssssst,
you got screwed :cry:

Reason number 204I on why not to buy a chainsaw on line. :cheers:

outdoortype · Dec 6, 2006

You're correct

I am by no means an expert. But I didn't think it would be possible to gouge a cylinder as deep as shown in pick #4. Or see a piston as beat up as in pick #1. Did the seller offer a return/refund policy? I bought a used 025 from Ebay that was supposed to be in real good shape. I would hate to see their definition of poor shape. Good luck and I hope you get compensated.

SmokinDodge · Dec 6, 2006

Nail them to the wall. Politely.

04ultra · Dec 6, 2006

Everything I went through to get you the service manual and IPL... I feel like I'm part of this project now...Bring me my hammer ..

Anything I can do to help you got my email..

.

Four Paws · Dec 6, 2006

Too bad about your bad luck, but I think he has your money. The seller's description was very well written to free him of any obligation to the grenaded saw (which I would bet a cold one he knew about). His bases were covered on that listing...best of luck, but I would say you should chalk it up as an expensive lesson. Look on the bright side, that goofy "incredi-pull" handle is worth a cool $35 bones. Now, you are only out $230. Start parting it out...you'll make your money back!

Josh

blsnelling · Dec 6, 2006

04ultra said:
Everything I went through to get you the service manual and IPL... I feel like I'm part of this project now...Bring me my hammer ..

Anything I can do to help you got my email.

Man, you've gone above and beyond to provide me with the documentation I need.

One month ago, I owned one saw. The 039 I bought 12-13 years ago. Then I found this forum trying to fix my bro-in-laws old 041 FB. Now look at me. I sold the 039 and bought a 360 pro. I bought a 026 Pro that had been rebuilt. I then decided to start fixing others up for fun and bought this 440, a really bad older 026, and now a 260 Artic project saw. I'm not sure about this new hobby that was supposed to make me a few bucks to pay for my saws.

I emailed the guy and also filed a complaint with PayPal. The complaint also contains the same text as in the email. I would normally give more time for the seller to respond, but I think prompt action is called for in a case this extreme. PayPal even has the link to the pictures. I don't see how he can not loose this. I had a buyer report that they never received a $300 item I shipped them. I did not have a tracking# to prove that I did. PayPal took the money from my account and gave it back to the buyer. It was totally out of my control. I thought I had learned all my lessons with buying online. I guess it's just risks you take.

blsnelling · Dec 6, 2006

Four Paws said:
you are only out $230. Start parting it out...you'll make your money back!Josh

With shipping, I'm out $284. Assuming I'm stuck, should I part it out, or find a good crank and put a BB kit on it for $99 from Baileys:hmm3grin2orange: I'm still confused why I'm not fuming mad. Maybe it's all this "group therapy" we have going on here :heart:

I was planning on fixing her up, giving her a good cleaning and selling it again. I'd even bought a 24" Stihl ES bar for it! If I fix it up, it will be pristine and be "right" when I'm done. I don't do things half way. Learned that from my Dad years ago. What would a super clean 440 Big Bore bring?

Got any leads on a good 440 crank? Is a 044 crank with a 12mm piston pin the same?

Lakeside53 · Dec 6, 2006

This one is likely to end badly... Unless you can prove he mispresented the saw, you're likely to eat this one... His description gives him every out.

Definitely go though dispute resolution, but.. You will at least get his phone number etc and call him. Ask for the dealer name... They'll remember him...

You'll need more than a crank - you'll need bearings too, and they aren't cheap.

04ultra · Dec 6, 2006

blsnelling said:
With shipping, I'm out $284. Assuming I'm stuck, should I part it out, or find a good crank and put a BB kit on it for $99 from Baileys:hmm3grin2orange: I'm still confused why I'm not fuming mad. Maybe it's all this "group therapy" we have going on here

I was planning on fixing her up, giving her a good cleaning and selling it again. I'd even bought a 24" Stihl ES bar for it! If I fix it up, it will be pristine and be "right" when I'm done. I don't do things half way. Learned that from my Dad years ago. What would a super clean 440 Big Bore bring?

Got any leads on a good 440 crank? Is a 044 crank with a 12mm piston pin the same?

Talk to Freak he might have a parts saw.. not sure..

..

blsnelling · Dec 6, 2006

Lakeside53 said:
This one is likely to end badly... Unless you can prove he mispresented the saw, you're likely to eat this one... His description gives him every out.

Definitely go though dispute resolution, but.. You will at least get his phone number etc and call him. Ask for the dealer name... They'll remember him...

You'll need more than a crank - you'll need bearings too, and they aren't cheap.

I think the solution would be a case with a good crank already in it. CheapStihlParts has one for $100 right now.

I got the guys initial response.

"I bought the saw used and CLEARLY stated in the ad that the saw had 100%
NO GUARNTEE, I am not a mechanic and can only take the word of the saw
shop I have here. I am happy to work with you, but as the AD STATED NO
GURANTEE at all. I had a $99 starting price and no reserve, that is
why, I had no gurantee that the saw was any good, everyone knew that who
bidded, including you."

I replied:
So how do you want to handle this? We're talking about $230 to put the saw in the condition it was advertised in. I'm not implying you did this intentionally. However, now that the facts are known, it's not as described in the auction. Do you want the saw back or do you want to refund me for the parts?

So how much of this saga do you guys want to follow? It's liable to get interesting.

computeruser · Dec 6, 2006

If you decide to part it out I might be in the market for a fair number of major parts.

Tree Sling'r · Dec 6, 2006

outdoortype said:
I am by no means an expert. But I didn't think it would be possible to gouge a cylinder as deep as shown in pick #4. Or see a piston as beat up as in pick #1. Did the seller offer a return/refund policy? I bought a used 025 from Ebay that was supposed to be in real good shape. I would hate to see their definition of poor shape. Good luck and I hope you get compensated.

I didn't either until I started modding my own saws.

SmokinDodge · Dec 6, 2006

blsnelling said:
So how much of this saga do you guys want to follow? It's liable to get interesting.

Don't need the blow by blow, just the highlights.

blsnelling · Dec 6, 2006

My better judgement is telling me that I don't have a saw to repair here. I mean, no crank, no cylinder, and no piston. This is truely a parts saw if there ever was one. Lets see what I have here.
1. Top engine cover
2. Filter cover - newer
3. Bar/clutch cover
4. Carb
5. New HD air filter
6. New rim sproket
7. Clutch
8. Oil pump
9. Good tank
10. Starter has too much wear to sell
11. Top handle
12. Muffler

I don't think this will even come close to recouping my money. Which leads me back to getting a new case/crank for $100 and a BB kit for $100. I'd then have about $550 in it with the coil and new 24" ES bar I already bought for it. I'd enjoy the process and likely get good money for it when I was done.

I've Been Screwed!!!

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