?????? About Hiring a Freelance Climber

[YUKON 659]

I have a few questions about freelance climbers....can anybody help? The first question is....do they work by the hour, day or job? The next is about insurance...do I need insurance (other than my own liability) for them to work with me on a job? Is there anything else I should be concerned with before hiring someone...references maybe?

Thanks, Jeff

 

[Joe]

Originally posted by YUKON 659
Is there anything else I should be concerned with before hiring someone...references maybe?

Thanks, Jeff

If you appear too elusive when you advertise, or too aggressive with your replies, in spite of what qualifications you require of the climber and what those qualifications may say about you, you're likely to lose the climbers' interest for employment and a few potential climbers who get wind of it.

Joe

 

[Treeman14]

Most freelancers will have a daily rate, although some will work hourly with a minimum of perhaps four hours. Some will have their own insurance, most won't. If they cannot provide a valid certificate of insurance, YOU will be liable for premiums on any wages paid to them when your insurer conducts its annual audit. This is true of any subcontractor you hire. References are a good idea if you take the time to check them out.

 

[treeclimber165]

In response to your first question, yes. I work by the hour, day or job. I normally get $200 or better per day and/or $25 per hour with a $75 minimum. Most guys usually just give me the $200 for the day even if I get the job done in 5-6 hours. Practically all my work is from referrals and networking in the industry.
I've been freelancing for almost a year and need to get my own insurance soon. I have lost several jobs because I didn't have it. Many guys have me sign a waiver of some sort for medical liability. Right now I'm just looking for a paycheck to live on but I'm positive that having insurance would enable me to work for a higher class of tree guys. No offense to the guys I'm climbing for now but I could move up a few notches with insurance. I don't know of too many climbers with their own insurance but that could put me in a class by myself around here.

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

If the climber is not insure then he becomes and agent of your company. Thsi can include vehicle accidents btween multiple jobs.

As far as taxes are concerned there are several requirments to fill, they should have their own equipment, company name, and writen contracts with you to cover all bases.

The contractor should have very wide latitude in the way the work is performed.

The way i work it is we agree on standards of work prior to strating, then I work the tree and you provide the cleanup staff. Maybe qualified assistance in rigging, but I'm giving directions.

How is the law written in your state for W/C, some allow a 2 employee company to not carry it.

As far as compensation I will negotiate that prior to agreeing to do the work, it could be hourly, dayly or weekly, travel time is often included. Many times I will lower the hourly fee and charge an equipment rental for the day for companies would be exposed to W/C coverage for my work.

I've looked into W/C, but they wanted around 25% of my gross. I am not comfortable getting a policy with a self exclusion just to make it look like I'm covered.

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

By free lance employee, you mean uninsured, cash paid.
To have proper insurance, including workers comp, he must be a business, probably a corporation.
If he is a sole proprietor, he won't be able to get workers comp on himself, only his employees, at least in my state.
So who insures this cash paid employee? First you, then the homeowner.
Uninsured employees hurt everyone, the employee and his family, the home owner, the legitimate contracrtors, and anyone who pays insurance.
The question you should be asking is: How much to hire a legitimate, insured, subcontractor?
It depends, but expect to pay between $50 and $100 per hour.
The only other possibility, I know of, is to hire an employee. Expect to pay a climber $15 to $40 per hour. Your related costs will double that figure.

 

[treeclimber165]

Mike,
I am not a corporation, nor do I wish to be a corporation. I am a sole proprietor.
I went down to the federal building several months ago in order to get my Worker's Comp. exemption certificate. It costs $50 for the application and I wanted them to help me fill it out so I didn't screw up. The guy asked me what I did for a living and I told him I was an Arborist. He asked "What's that?" and I said "I climb trees to trim or remove them." He asked me if I PLANTED trees, and I said no. He told me that I was already exempt BY LAW and he would not accept my money or application. The only way I could submit an application for an exemption certificate is if I were a corporation.
I still have people who won't hire me without a Worker's Comp. exemption certificate, but I cannot get one because I am already exempt. This FUBAR has cost me some jobs. Does anyone else here know something about a SOLE PROPRIETOR getting a Worker's Comp. exemption certificate? Do I need to lie and tell them that I plant trees even though I do not own a shovel?

 

[YUKON 659]

Sorry about the confusion....I'm not sure "who" or "what" I wanted to hire My question should have been....I'm looking into starting a small tree removal business, I will be doing the work myself, except for the jobs I need a climber. When I do need a climber who should I look to hire? Freelance, sub-contractor etc. I will have liability insurance. I guess what I'm asking for is some kind of advice with this issue.

Thanks Jeff

 

[treeclimber165]

Most do not advertise and will want cash the same day. There are a lot of old drunk climbers out there who can still do the work well but cannot manage to hold down a regular job for one reason or another. 15 years ago I used many climbers who couldn't wait to finish so they could go buy their 12 pack of beer. I knew of a house where several old drunk climbers lived (and a few others within a couple blocks) so I would have to drive over there to find one who wasn't too hung over and willing to work that day.

If you do not care for this type of climber, you will have to pay more for someone who is fully equipped, shows up on time and might be insured. Climbers like myself may be booked a week or more in advance. If you can find a good climber, try to schedule the job several days in advance.

I'd locate climbers by networking with people who would normally interact with a lot of climbers. This would include saw shops, stump grinder guys, other small tree/landscape companies and your local Vermeer/Sherrill dealer. When you find someone, best advice I can give is to ask for and check references and follow your gut.

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

Yukon,
What if your climber falls and hurts himself. Let's say he has $275,000 in medical bills and can't work for 2 years.
These costs will not be covered by your liability.
Without worker's comp, where will the money come from?
I would recommend working at a successful tree service for some time, to learn the ropes, before setting out on your own.

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

I would say that if you are going to have a company that with any employees, having W/C is good for your peice of mind. So you know your people are covered.

So if you hire a freelnace or whatever then you just need to account for that percentage extra you need to cover the premium. Just think of them as a part time worker for W/C and bid accordingly.

If you can find the fully insured contract climber then he will bill you according to his risk.

So you find the a qualified climber/arborist to help you out as you get started.

Insurance is risk management. I have health coverage I will use for on the job injuries. I charge more because I am accepting the risk of injury/disability myself.

One thing to remeber is that anyone can sue anyone else. The safest thing to do is to find a tree company to come and help you, but it may not work finacialy.

One of the best ways to find good climbers is to go to the chapter TCC's and talk to them.

 

[YUKON 659]

Guys, thanks for the info., I made a call to N.Y.S. Workers Compensation Board.... hopefully they'll return my call. Mike I know it would be a good idea to work with an established tree service but, I have a full time job and I'm just getting into my own tree work on a part time basis. I'm going to take it slow and I'm sure with the help of you guys things will work out

Thanks, Jeff