Another 361 Question

[manual]

Ok now before you start telling me to use the search fuction I did.
What I would like to know is . What is the true High Rpm on the Ms361
also if it is the same cc as the 359 do they both run the same rpm ?

 

[Lakeside53]

The 361 max RPM is 14,000, max torque is at 9500, and it's 4.6bhp. I don;t have the exact numbers for the 359.

 

[manual]

Thanks Lakeside, I just read that in another post you replyed to (my bad)
Why doesnt Sthil put the rpm in the sales info like other brands do?

 

[West Texas]

A 361 that has been modified for "woods" use, runs at 15,000 rpm. Both of mine are tuned to run at 14,800 rpm.

 

[Lakeside53]

Why doesnt Sthil put the rpm in the sales info like other brands do?

Because it's bascially meaningless as the basis for any comparision or analysis, and has little to do with the cutting performance of the saw.

 

[coveredinsap]

The 361 max RPM is 14,000, max torque is at 9500, and it's 4.6bhp. I don;t have the exact numbers for the 359.

According to the 2005 Stihl catalog (the latest catalog that my local dealer has) the MS361 has 4.4bhp @ 12.3 lbs and the MS361C has 4.4bhp @ 12.6 lbs. Neither are listed as having '4.6bhp".
Leave it to a Stihl dealer to fudge the numbers whenever they can. And being that you appear to have fudged the one number that I could actually check on, your other figures are now also suspect.

By comparison, according to the 2006 Husqvarna catalog the Husky 359 is listed at 3.9bhp @ 12.1 lbs. And the Husky 357XP is listed at 4.4bhp @ 12.1 lbs.

The power-to-weight champ in this class is the Husky 357XP.

According to the catalog the 357XP has "fast acceleration" and "high speed power". I take that to mean it's a higher reving saw than the 359, which is listed as a "power and torque" saw.

 

[saxman]

I have checked the service manual for my MS361 and can verify that the specifications quoted by Lakeside are correct. The MS361 has a max engine RPM of 14,000 RPM and it develops 4.6 bhp at 9500 RPM. This is found on page 5 of the 2004-2005 manual.

 

[coveredinsap]

I have checked the service manual for my MS361 and can verify that the specifications quoted by Lakeside are correct. The MS361 has a max engine RPM of 14,000 RPM and it develops 4.6 bhp at 9500 RPM. This is found on page 5 of the 2004-2005 manual.

That's not what their website says.
http://www.stihlusa.com/chainsaws/MS361.html

By the way....see the false claim at the bottom claiming the "best power-to-weight ratio in it's class". LOL!

As we've seen, the Husky 357XP has better numbers.

 

[saxman]

Mr. Sap: You are correct that the website has it listed differently than my written manual. I have no explanation or care to fuss and fight about it. I suggest you buy the type of saw you want and I will buy the saws I want and we can go our seperate ways and both be happy. I have read some disucussions on this site that suggest that Husky has listed the weight of their powerheads in error at times. I am sure it was just an honest mistake, not a way to make their power to weight ratio look better. Why would Stihl list a power rating lower? What advantage would that be for them to a potential customer? Have a great day!

 

[Erik D. Schmid]

West Texas is correct. Mine turns at just under 15,000. Other than having the muffler modded it is stock.

 

[manual]

Sorry Guys I was just surfing last night and comparing saws the way dealers show them. also looking at the cc ratings. While I was not trying to cause a Degrading of companys. I was simply trying to figure out how they do that.
the 361 has 59 cc's and the 359 has 59cc's. so there stroke must be different to create differnt power bands.
Dear Sap We all know your knowledge about saws. so please open your mind and see what others have to say about power bands

 

[pinus]

The 361 max RPM is 14,000, max torque is at 9500, and it's 4.6bhp. I don;t have the exact numbers for the 359.

Not max torque but the power output. Max torque should be at lower rpms.

 

[Lakeside53]

Not max torque but the power output. Max torque should be at lower rpms.

That's what I said.... that's why there is a comma!


And to the eariler poster, yes, I took my numbers from the service manual specification page.

Personally, I don't care what the numbers are - it is a fabulous 59c chainsaw... and I'm going to buy another.

 

[Lakeside53]

West Texas is correct. Mine turns at just under 15,000. Other than having the muffler modded it is stock.

Did you richen up the carb after you modded the muffler? 15k is above my comfort zone. I keep mine about 13k wot (+/-500rpm), and it doesn't seem to affect the cut performance materially.

 

[Monkeyhanger]

By the way....see the false claim at the bottom claiming the "best power-to-weight ratio in it's class". LOL!

As we've seen, the Husky 357XP has better numbers.

Hi Sap,

MS361 3.4kW - 3.7Nm - 5.6kg - 1.6kg/kW

357XP 3.0kW - 3.4Nm - 5.9kg - 2.0kg/kW

359 2.9kW - 3.3Nm - 5.8kg - 2.0kg/kW


Sorry Sap but the Stihl has the best power to weight ratio of the three saws mentioned (without chain and bar to keep it fair). If you don't like the metric figures you can convert them yourself but that won't change a thing. To make matters even worse for you the 361 even has lower vibration levels than the 357XP and is also a little lower than the 359. The only advantage Husky has in this class is the air filtering.

All figures are from the KWF which is an independant organisation and in no way biased.

Bye

 

[manual]

Ok lakeside, that is what I am trying to understand, high Rpms does not mean power. how do you measure the power band. and what would I need to know to be able to compare other power bands?

 

[Lakeside53]

Ok lakeside, that is what I am trying to understand, high Rpms does not mean power. how do you measure the power band. and what would I need to know to be able to compare other power bands?

There are no numbers published that are going to help you on that one. I've never seen a graph of the power curve from any of the manfs. To "measure" the power band, you'd need to set both saws up on a dyno, or, just do timed cuts with same bar/chain.

 

[Monkeyhanger]

...high Rpms does not mean power.

Hi

if I remember correctly high RPMs does mean power!

because power is equal to torque x RPM divided by some number I can't remember. So the higher an engine turns the more power it produces from the torque it has. Sounds wierd but in the real world "power" is a pretty meaningless measurement. Torque is what really matters, as it is torque multiplied by revs. that gives you "power".

I may be wrong, as I said it's a long time since I had much to do with calculating power etc. for engines.


Bye

 

[coveredinsap]

Hi Sap,

MS361 3.4kW - 3.7Nm - 5.6kg - 1.6kg/kW

357XP 3.0kW - 3.4Nm - 5.9kg - 2.0kg/kW

359 2.9kW - 3.3Nm - 5.8kg - 2.0kg/kW


Sorry Sap but the Stihl has the best power to weight ratio of the three saws mentioned (without chain and bar to keep it fair). If you don't like the metric figures you can convert them yourself but that won't change a thing. To make matters even worse for you the 361 even has lower vibration levels than the 357XP and is also a little lower than the 359. The only advantage Husky has in this class is the air filtering.

All figures are from the KWF which is an independant organisation and in no way biased.

Bye

The published numbers (Stihl 2005 catalog) for the MS361 is 3.3kW @ 5.6kg (& 5.7kg for the 361C). For the Husky (2006 catalog) the numbers are 2.9kW @ 5.5kg for the 359 and 3.2kW @ 5.5kg for the 357XP.

Try doing your calculations again using the correct figures, instead of relying on what Stihl tells you to believe are 'independant' numbers.

Also as someone else pointed out....torque and horsepower are two different things. The measurement at 9500 rpm is of maximum hp output, not torque.

While both may be a term refering to a measurement of foot pounds, a saw with 'better torque' usually refers to higher foot pound measurements across a wider range of rpms, as opposed to a higher measurement (horsepower) at one point in it's power band.

 

[manual]

I'm starting to get confused