Bidding jobs

[mikecross23]

So far I have only done residential tree work and don't usually do more than a few removals at one time. Often times prospective customers don't have enough money laying around to get all the work done at once. For example. . .

I have given two bids in the last week involving multiple removals. The first one was 8 cherry trees and the second was 9 oak and sweet gum removals w/ a few small miscellaneous' here and there. When I estimate the time and costs involed, I add up the total of each individual tree as if I were to come and remove just that one tree. Then I present the bid to the customer as, A: I can remove one or two of these trees at a time for the individual prices, or B: I can do it all at once for this substantially lower price. I see this as a way to provoke the customer to get it all done at once allowing me to be in and out and ready for the next job.

What are some ways you guys bid multiple removals?

I know to more experienced business owners, this question is elementry, but I need to know if I'm on the right track.

Any criticism or ideas welcome.

 

[mikecross23]

Maybe I should just get richer clients!!!!!

 

[treeclimber165]

Your idea is sound. I for one have been guilty of writing up bids with multiple trees, listing prices for each tree but assuming all the work would be done at once. Then when the customer started picking my quote apart by only wanting 1-2 trees done, I usually ended up losing money.
Times are tight right now. Keep plugging away and giving bids. Keep in mind that the customer might think your price is fair and you are qualified, they just might not have the money today. It isn't always a personal reflection on you. I climbed for 3 different companies in 5 days a couple weeks ago. Even established companies cannot generate enough work to keep busy.

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

The richer clients will come eventualy.

I do the discounting also, take drive and setup times out of the bid, how much you will save on cleanup doing more then one or two...

It may pay to bring in an extra dragger or two, as long as you make money on those manhours.

I will also tell them that I can come down on the cost the more work they do, such as fine raking and the obviouse wood removal. I try to stay away from city stacking because IMO there is no real savings for us in it. A big chipper is faster and I feel it is not something the city should be picking up.

It is also cheaper to grind many stumps at once, and if you can get the installation, stump grinders can help dig the hole.

 

[TREEGODFATHER]

Your way of pricing the individual trees and being able to "discount" for multiple seems to be the best.

However any amount of discount should always be explained it is a 1 time shot and each quote should have an expire date on it.

 

[Jumper]

Sounds like you are on track......I would sit down with the customer and ask them what they can afford to have done now, and what can be afforded later, explaining multiple visits will end up costing $X more because of travel time, set up etc. Then put together a plan, budget taken into account, and hopefully end up with the fewest number of visits and the lowest cost possible. If having it all done at once is signifigantly less, it might be worthwhile considering a loan if possble, to have it all done at once. If you have reasonable credit ,money to borrow for home improvements is not that expensive, and if they can not even get a small consumer loan, perhaps you do not need them as customers as you are going to get stiffed at some point of the plan when they are short one month. One real indicator I once saw that we were not going to get paid quickly was a big lock on the gas meter, it had been cut off!

 

[NeTree]

Ditto to all the above.

 

[mikecross23]

I got undercut on the bid for the 8 cherry trees. I found out that I didn't get the job when I called back to give him the reduced price for all at once. Should have been more prompt.

Treegodfather,
Good idea, adding an expiration to the bid. Things can change in a short time. Like you said, "It is a 1 time shot" and I blew my one chance w/ that dude!

JPS,
Lately I've been leaning away from city pick-up too. Not to professional sounding or looking, plus I make more $ by doing it all. I don't have a stump grinder but I do rent a little mickey mouse one on occation, then I just bill $25 an hour (driving time included) and the rental cost.

"It is also cheaper to grind many stumps at once, and if you can get the installation, stump grinders can help dig the hole."

What do you mean "can help dig the hole."

Jumper,
Good idea, recommend small consumer loan for high cost jobs. Or just avoid inquiring cheap folks.

Brian,
Times are slow! I just placed two adds in local magazines hoping to get some clientel build up. Word of mouth just ain't cuttin' it no mo!!!

Thanks for the eye deers! keep 'em comin'!
-Mike-

 

[budroe69moni]

you snooze, you looze....

mike,
from my experience, get your bids back a.s.a.p.!!!!!!
i try to get them back the same day that i walk the property.
i've lost a couple because i waited a day or two. usually you
are not the only tree company that the customer has contacted.
i keep my bid sheets in the jeep and try to work them up on the spot.......beat'em to the punch!!!!
budroe

 

[ORclimber]

Times are slow! I just placed two adds in local magazines hoping to get some clientel build up. Word of mouth just ain't cuttin' it no mo!!!
[/B][/QUOTE]

Time for us small/new to business guys to get creative. I have a newspaper add, yellow page add, radio add, and add in a local garden journal. I get a few calls from the newspaper add, and the rest is either repeat business or word of mouth. But it hasn't been enough to keep me busy 5 days a week since Halloween.

I sent out 80 letters Monday to all of the landscapers in the local yellow pages asking to be their go to tree guy, sold and done $350 so far on a $40 investment. Also traded a 4 hour removal to have my chipper sandblasted and painted. I'll try door hangers soon. There's a guy who posts on lawnsite that does $45 lawn aerations and then upsells mowing contracts. I'm going to try aerating and upselling tree work since I have an aerator, and have more time than $.

 

[NeTree]

I'll try door hangers soon.

OR, You can try that if you like, but if you're planning on going door-to-door hanging them you're likely to get very negative results, especially in more up-scale places. It's seen akin to "begging" for hand-outs.

If you must try it, target homes with an obvious need for services; dead trees, down trees, adelgid ridden shrubs, and the like.

Best wishes intended.

 

[mikecross23]

ORclimber,
I just missed the yellow pages, phone book just came out. One of the adds I placed, I also got the image on disk. Now I can print one out and make color copies to post as fliers on bulletin boards or to just pass out or even "accidentally" leave here and there.

Personalized letters to local lawn and landscaping services is a great idea. I've contacted a few aquantances that own lawn services but they either haven't produced or they allready have a tree guy.

-Mike-

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

I've tried door hangers and flyers. The best results are from ones where you were in the area all day, your marketing material lets them know you were the company they saw as they drove buy and you noticed work you could do for them.

It seems, anicdotaly, that a proffesionaly printed trifold handout works better then something that looks like a kid did it on a PC. Haveing the little dos and don'ts of tree work and short expalinations of why you do it a certain way. Quick read with some graphics is best.

I've known a few guys who use these to blanket targeted areas of midscale neighborhoods 15-20 year old canopy.

I know a couple of guys who have made their dedicated handouts, one for dead tree removal, noe for building clearance, another for pick pruning shrubs....

 

[ORclimber]

Originally posted by netree

If you must try it, target homes with an obvious need for services; dead trees, down trees, adelgid ridden shrubs, and the like.

It's seen akin to "begging" for hand-outs.

I've seen "how to hire an arborist" articles and they say not to hire tree guys who go door to door. Seems like a thinnly veiled attempt to keep the new guys down as well as hacks. Most of the more successful tree businesses around here are in there second or third generation of family ownership. They must of started small thougth. netree, others, how did you grow your customer base when starting out?



Good advice, I stop at all dead trees and leave cards/estimates, but I only get called back on maybe 1 in 10. Most are still standing a year later.

 

[NeTree]

OR, if I sounded discouraging, I do apologize.

How did I get started? Different from most, probably. I actually worked for a logging company in my teens, until I joined the Army. After I got back to the "real world", I had a few different jobs, before ending up working as a groundman for Asplundh. It renewed my interest in tree work/arboriculture, with the help of a VERY knowledgable foreman, who had worked for years in tree care before doing line clearance. He taught me how not to be a hack, like most line clearance crews, and alot of how to deal with people. (I'm not sure about other companies or areas, but in the region I worked you had to get the customers' permission to trim, even though legally it wasn't required- not an easy task when the trees were HACKED previously!) While there, I actually did QUITE a bit of tree work on the side. I left Asplundh for a better paying position with a private tree company, and after alot of dismay with their non-existant safety, bought my first bucket truck and went out on my own. Since then, I have added two more buckets, a crane, and a climbing crew with a chip truck to the mix.

Most of the jobs I got at first were from people I met while doing line clearance, and then word-of-mouth became a huge factor in bringing work in the door. In fact, word-of-mouth still accounts for around 90 percent of my business, with another 8 percent coming from the web site, and maybe 2 percent coming from the rare newspaper ad I toss out.

Some of my bigger customers are realtors, who (correctly) believe that a little tidying up of the trees on a property can help it fetch a better price, and contractors in the area.

I also have rarely had alot of success with business cards stuck in doors, but there is the odd jobb here and there, and those have generated some good word-of-mouth.

Another biggie that I rank in the WOM category is being set up on one job site and having neighbors hit me up for quotes. One good example of that come from a small pruning job in Rockland that eventually had me doing something for all 6 houses on the street!

I really do wish you the best of luck, and hopefully warmer weather will see things picking up alot for you. Don't get discouraged, and keep plugging away. Sooner or later, business will pick up, you just have to hang in there in the lean times.

 

[ORclimber]

NETREE, thanks, encouraging and good ideas coming from someone who has succeeded in doing what many hope to.

 

[mikecross23]

Originally posted by ORclimber
NETREE, thanks, encouraging and good ideas coming from someone who has succeeded in doing what many hope to.

Ditto!

I like the realtor idea. I know a few I should probably send a call, card, and letter to.

 

[NeTree]

As for the realty thing, alot of people may not realize just how much trees have an effect on the property value. In my town, for instance, a well cared-for tree adds like $500 to the property's valuation.

They can also have an effect on your homeowner's insurance; dead dangerous trees are a liability, and one of the most often listed insurance claims.

 

[TREETX]

Good relationship with realtor works!!!

1 - Many of them want you to "put lipstick on this pig" before they sell a property.

2 - If they don't do the work, they will refer you if their client asks after the purchase.

3 - Many times a house won't pass inspection for a loan if there are hazards - the realtor wants to get the sale through so they will call fast. Warning: at this point sale is in progress and you may have to collect from a title company.

4 - This is the kicker for me. Many of the realty companies here also manage rental properties. Tons of work here and when something happens, they call you first.

Door Hangers SUCK!!

I have only had them work when writing a little note on them.


If you are starting, it is ok to be hungry and use door hangers, newspapers, and other bottom feeder methods. Anything to get in the door. Then if you are honest and do good work in a business like manner with no suprises, you will start getting the references.

Check out the book "Raving Fans" by Ken Blanchard. A good customer service approach. Happy customers are just not good enough, you need to have raving fans.

Have a target audience. There is no right answer here but it sets your approach.

Don't be dissappointed if you lose a removal bid. Removals are a commodity based product and price rules. Pruning is value based. Plus removals are frequently a terminal relationship - no tree, no tree service.

 

[budroe69moni]

TREETX,
you're absolutly right!!! that is an awesome
book!!!! doing a good job isn't good enough,
you need to blow the customer's expectations
out of the water!!! do a little extra than what
is expected and you'll win a customer for life!!!
i pruned out 2 small live oaks last week and
when i was finished, the 2 20' queen palms
that were next to the oaks stuck out like a sore
thumb! i trimmed them up real quick, took an
extra 10 minutes. when the customer got home
that evening she called and asked how much do
i owe you for the queens and i said no charge.
she was floored!!!! she couldn't believe that i
did it for free!!! i already had one of her neighbors
call me for a quote!!!!! ABOVE AND BEYOND!!!!!
it's all about expectations!!!!
budroe