Big Ol' live oak removal

[mikecross23]

I talked a dude out of removing a big live oak last week. He wanted it gone so the grass would grow but, I sold him on a deadwood and light prune instead. He wanted everything lion tailed to let light in, but he listened to my reasoning and agreed to do what is best for the tree. It's a great lookin' BIG live oak about 5'-6' dbh. I explained that it is a protected tree and that it's an asset to his property. Agreed.

Not!

He called back today, after he spoke w/ his wife and said forget our arrangements, I want you to remove it. I threw him an uneducated guess of roughly $5,000 while trying to persuade him to leave it. I didn't think the guy had it in him to shell out 5 G's. Luckily I told him that # was definately not agreed on.

Now my problem is. . .

What n' tha heck do I do? I usually work small and am not equiped for a tree of this size. I have made a few contacts w/ other local larger services and have back up loader guys. First I will check with the homeowner's assoc., then call the county to find out permiting. It will be necessary to drop some lines so I will call the power co., maybe the phone co. too? If I can get all that straight, then I will find a capable, legit sub-contractor to remove the tree and dispose of or have a loader lined up. A Crane is probably the best way to go. I'll have to get Monkeypuzzle and his men for that!!!

Basically I want to know what you guys think. Am I wrong for wanting to learn and grow. Would that make me an ass for organizing everything and helping as much as possible for a nice fee off the top. Should I just leave it to a more qualified service altogether?

All of this depends on this cat holding to the removal idea, but I WILL be prepared w/ dollar figures and dates when I speak to him next.

Let me hear it!!!
-Mike-

 

[mikecross23]

Thanks Dan. That's the kind of response I'm looking for. I don't want to be that butt hole off the top skimmer. Let me hear other opinions, or is this too soon after "The Right Thing" thread. I guess me posting this sounds kind of dumb after reading the other thread, but I hate to let a job like this slip away.

-Mike-

 

[treeclimber165]

Yup, it's tough passing on a job that size. But consider that the guy is stupid enough to pay a fortune to remove a perfectly healthy tree in order to:
1) Reduce his property value
2) Greatly increase his electric bill
3) pay a bunch of money for a chemical-laden green rug of a lawn that will cost him even more money to maintain.

I wouldn't be surprised if this jerk paid extra to buy the only wooded lot in the entire subdivision just so he could have the tree removed! I have never liked working for people like this and the money is rarely worth it.

If, however, you could bring in a liscensed, insured company to handle the job with the stipulation that you get to help climb and/or learn from the climber, and you get paid for your time as well as a 5%-10% commission, then it could be a joint effort with their name on the contract.
I've turned lots of guys on to work that I wasn't prepared to handle at the time and it always came back tenfold for me at a later date. Everybody wins and everybody likes the other guy. Hard to put a dollar sign on goodwill.
:angel:

 

[mikecross23]

Originally posted by treeclimber165
If, however, you could bring in a liscensed, insured company to handle the job with the stipulation that you get to help climb and/or learn from the climber, and you get paid for your time.

Brian, you've just summed up my intentions of being a third party. I'll turn the job over if necessary, but would like to work the job for the experience and a fair days pay. I have no intentions of trying to stiff anyone.

Give me some more feed back folks.

 

[Kevin]

If you said you would remove the tree and are in fact paying someone else to remove it then your credibility is diminished in my opinion.
A man has got to know his limitations although everyone wants to advance you can only work within your means.
I hope you get to work on it, the experience alone will be large.

 

[mikecross23]

Kevin,
I did tell the guy from the start that I don't have the man power or equipment to do a tree of that size. He didn't seem to hear me and now I feel very confident that I could remove this tree if I have to. I think I'll just submit an outrageous bid, that way if he bites then It will make it worth my while to buy much needed equipment. Gettin' the tree to the ground wouldn't be out of my leauge, but I've never cut on a stump that big. I've been debating what saw to get anyway, 046 or 066. If I won a bid like this I could just buy both!!!

 

[Greg]

Mike,
Go for it, you will learn a lot from that job, I think you should give a high price, but don't give up the job. There is nothing wrong with you managing the job, and subbing out everything. Think of it this way, the customer has some level of confidence in you, because you are giving the bid and talking to the customer does not mean that you need to cut and carry each peice of wood out of the yard. Lots of guys could not sell a job like that. Call a local tree company and tell them that you are a small tree guy that needs some help on a big job, how much will you charge me for a day of chipping, call someone with a loader truck and aks their rate for 1-2 loads of wood. Find a place to dump the chips. Pay them what they need to be paid and take the rest as your management fee. You are taking some risk so you need to be rewarded for that. I've lost my a$$ on jobs like this in the past, but I sure did learn from them. Bid high, don't loose your a$$!!
Greg

 

[johncinco]

"Neither a buyer nor a seller be, but a broker for a fee". Now thats a little exagerating for this type of business, but I pay out finders fees, or comp people all the time for sending me business that they do not handle or specialize in. In return I get paid on occassion for sending people to others for the specific services they render. It is after all a business tranaction. If the guy trusts you enough to let you sub contract out the work, and understands that is what you will do, I say no harm no foul.

 

[mikecross23]

Well, this thread was a waste.

I figured all of my costs for this job and submitted a bid for my service to do the work. I confirmed the permitting, talked to the electric co. about clearing the lines for me, have a few loader truck options ready and was going to buy an 066. I felt confident when I called back so prepared w/ the final bid. Too bad this cat is just givin' me the run around! Now he doesn't know what he wants!!!!

Thanks for the thoughts arbo folks!
-Mike-

 

[geofore]

run around

mikecross23, you did not mention you offered to plant a tree to replace the one you are asked to remove. If you could sell this guy on removal could you sell a replacement, a small tree would let in the light and would not have to be a fast grower. It could be a big tree long after this guy is gone the tree would be there growing. As to the run around, this guy heard your price and needs a few days to find a cheaper price? If he wants it down sell him on putting in a new one. You can learn a lot from taking down a large tree but I would sell him on a replacement rather than a naked yard.

 

[Tim Kasulinous]

Mike,
I had a customer just like that once. I started to remove this huge silver maple and partly into it he starts debating whether or not he wanted to keep it. Of course at this point there are spike holes all over the place because the tree was slated to be removed. We finished about half the tree the first day. When we came back he told us how great the tree looked (actually all hacked up half tree) and that he was going to keep the rest standing. I hated leaving with my name on that tree. I have never left a tree in such horrible shape until them. That was years ago when I first started out and ever since then I am a firm believer in contracts not only to protect them but to protect my butt.
Tim

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Mike, don't burn any bridges with this guy. I've had vasilating customers like this that I've got some sort of work after even a year from the first consultation.

One of my best sales closed a year and a half after I wrote the bid up.

Call him back in a week or so.

 

[rahtreelimbs]

Good thread!

Good responses!

 

[mikecross23]

Originally posted by John Paul Sanborn
Call him back in a week or so.

I already calandered a follow up call for a week and a half from today. That should give him enough time to "Talk it over with his wife."

 

[treeclimber165]

If you really think the tree is worth fighting for, then maybe you could offer something like this:
Mr. ******- I can make this tree pretty and safe by simply pruning out the deadwood and any weak/ structurally unsound branches. I will also lightly thin it so you can get more sunlight on your lawn while retaining the shade of the tree.
If you agree to let me prune the tree first and then decide you still want it removed, I'll credit the pruning cost towards the removal cost if you have the tree removed within 60 days of my pruning. I'm betting you will agree that the tree is a valuable asset and I'm willing to back up my belief in order to save this tree.

 

[mikecross23]

Thanks Brian,
That's a good pricing idea for this situation! It's worth it to me to make one more call and I'll definately offer the 60 day credit towards removal. I just got in the mail today some pamphlets from ISA to pass out to hesitant folks like this guy. I think I'll write up a new bid w/ a to the point letter and enclose, Tree Values, Mature Tree Care, and Pruning Mature Trees. I can come down a little on price for removal too. The first bid included a large chunk of the cost of an 066. I'd be willing to let more of those $$$$ come from my pocket to remove this tree.

 

[rahtreelimbs]

Originally posted by treeclimber165
If you really think the tree is worth fighting for, then maybe you could offer something like this:
Mr. ******- I can make this tree pretty and safe by simply pruning out the deadwood and any weak/ structurally unsound branches. I will also lightly thin it so you can get more sunlight on your lawn while retaining the shade of the tree.
If you agree to let me prune the tree first and then decide you still want it removed, I'll credit the pruning cost towards the removal cost if you have the tree removed within 60 days of my pruning. I'm betting you will agree that the tree is a valuable asset and I'm willing to back up my belief in order to save this tree.

Great idea, Brian.