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treeseer

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This month's issue of TCI has a cabling article on page 32--subscriptions are free, and online: http://www.tcia.org/PDFs/TCI_Mag_July_07.pdf

When I read in Dennis Ryan’s article on cabling (July 2007 issue) that “you shall use a lag instead of an eyebolt in a decayed limb”, I reached for my ANSI Support Standards. I’m no expert on the subject, but common sense told me the opposite was true. Sure enough, ANSI said “Lag-threaded hardware shall only be installed in sound wood.” This is confirmed in the BMP’s, which the article listed as a reference. Dennis seems to have it backwards, or there was a typo or an editing error. TCIA typically does an excellent job upholding ANSI, so it was surprising to see this slip.

The first ANSI Support Standard reads “All necessary pruning should be performed prior to installing a tree support system”, but I did not see pruning mentioned at all in the article. The risk from many weak forks can be made acceptably low through pruning alone, so it seems that pruning could have been mentioned. It was also disappointing to read the author’s opinions that synthetic ropes are “ugly”, while “a steel cabling system …is not visible to most people”.

Steel cables are easy to see, so one wonders whether the author’s aesthetic bias indicates a deeper prejudice against dynamic cabling. Maybe it’s just the blinding glare off the snow in Massachusetts. Anyway, what place does this degree of subjectivity have in a scientific or even a technical article?
 
Wow thats quite amazing, someone writing a scientific paper that would not only dismiss dynamic bracing totally but also get cable bracing hardware so far wrong. Where in scientific papers are opinions wanted anyway; "synthetic ropes are ugly"? To Who?
 
That lag into decayed wood recommendation has gotta be a typo. Even a weekend shadetree handyman would get that. Be interesting to see if TCI publish an errata in the next issue.

But Ryan DOES mention "judicious pruning" in the first paragraph, treeseer. I can't get my browser to rip a quote from a pdf but it's a single sentence just to get that out of the way so his article can concentrate on the actual aspects of cabling.

He is dismissive of dynamic systems, even dissing Cobra Cables (TM reg) by name. He quotes Thompson (1959) which makes the point that the installation should cause as little damage to the tree as possible, then fails to highlight that as the primary strength of dynamic systems.

I recall an editor at a motorcycle magazine being fired and the publisher settling out of court after one manufacturer kept getting bad reviews after cancelling their advertising contract with that mag. Not sayin', just things that make me go hmmmm...


RedlineIt
 
I have been doing quite a bit of cabling as of late. It is a situational judgement call, with science to back it up most times. I really like the EHS/Wirestop combo (RigGuy). Who has concerns or knows about research on squirrels eating synthetic style cabling systems?
 
Putting a lag bolt into decay is wrong, but not because a through bolt would be better, it's wrong because you are not installing the cable high enough.

What did Maashole just say? How does he know it's not high enough?:popcorn:

The ANSI standards say cables should be installed 2/3's of the way from the bad crotch to the top of the tree.
Ninety-nine percent of cable installations are done lower than that, and thus incorrectly.

But Maashole, you said it's wrong like 100% of the time installing in decay is wrong.

Now to address the other 1%, if you ever accurately find that 2/3's height, you're in approximately 6" diameter wood. How many mature trees have decay in their 6" diameter wood? Very few, and then there is usually a better choice for an anchor point.

If you find that one in a million tree that has and bad crotch, decay 2/3's of the way up, no other anchor point, then other tactics should be considered.
 
Ryan DOES mention "judicious pruning" in the first paragraph, treeseer.
Hey Redline thanks for the correction. I breezed right over that. My bad.
He quotes Thompson (1959) which makes the point that the installation should cause as little damage to the tree as possible, then fails to highlight that as the primary strength of dynamic systems.
Bingo! I totally missed that one too. Thanks man.:clap:
 
It might be wrong. Or, just a matter of symantics: maybe the need for clarification.

There might be some confusion between intalling in "decay" versus, say, installing in a decayed limb.

My queston is, "is the whole limb full of decay, or just one area?"

Personally, I don't install lag or bolt into a decay area of a limb.

As for the article, it looks like its important to read what it is saying, and what it didn't say.
 
Related to this, see page 22 here: http://www.treecareindustry.org/PDFs/TCI_Mag_Aug_07.pdf

The author was called on making unqualified predictions with exaggerated certainty, and replied, with exaggerated certainty, that MOST will fail, so "...it is only a matter of time."

No matter how badly anyone wants to sell a cable job, I think it would be arborphobic fraud to make such a definite prediction about something as variable as a tree growing in nature. Or is there a crystal ball around that I have not seen?
 
The author was called on making unqualified predictions with exaggerated certainty, and replied, with exaggerated certainty, that MOST will fail, so "...it is only a matter of time."

I've read enough of H.D.P. Ryan III to know he is intransigent in his opinions. He is dead set against advanced climbing systems too, and teaches old school.
 
I've read enough of H.D.P. Ryan III to know he is intransigent in his opinions. He is dead set against advanced climbing systems too, and teaches old school.
Omigosh...not the....tautline hitch! :taped:

I thought universities were places where minds were supposed to be open.
 
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