Certified Arborist Test...Knots???

[M.D. Vaden]

My plan for November, is to take the test in Wilsonville, Oregon for ISA Certified Arborist, to add to my Certified Landscape Technician status.

I am really enjoying how well the study guide was put together.

What I would like to know from you Certified Arborists that have taken the exam - did they test you on the knots?

I don't do any climbing - purely ground work. Since I sub my climbing to a licensed contractor, a Certified Arborist climber, I'm ignorant about knots.

So I was checking to see how big or little of a crash study I may need to make on that part.

Thanks

 

[rumination]

i just took the Western Chapter Certified Tree Worker exam today. the people there who were doing the arborist exam only had to do a written exam (200 questions) and tree identification. no knots. however, I'd encourage you to learn most of the basic riggin knots because they are extremely useful whether you're on the ground or in the tree.

 

[Stumper]

In addition-knots are just plain FUN. A few truly great knots will enhance your life. Whether pulling someone's vehicle out of a mudhole or hanging up a craft project for you wife or tying something down on your pick-up to haul it home. The right knots make it BETTER.

 

[SilverBlue]

Plus the first time you have to put heavy pressure on a knot say towing a vehicle you will apreciate a knot that unties easy

 

[MasterBlaster]

Did somebody say bowline?

 

[TREETX]

MD -

Remember that it is not a climbing test and that many certified arborists never actually work on trees.

A lot of city and utility guys get the simple cert so they can appear more credible when questioned by the public on specific policies or actions.

A lot of LA's get the cert. Same for those big tree care companies with hundreds of crews and sales guys that never actually have worked on a tree.

This is not a criticism of any group, just a reminder that MANY of the certified arbos out there have never climber a tree and probably rarely touch them. So being a Cert Arb is not restricted to tree workers.

 

[City climber]

favorite knot

Thats Knot my job

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

The climber certification has a knot section to it, along with the practical app of climbing in a tree.

 

[Eagle1]

"A few truly great knots will enhance your life".

I love that one. A classic line.

 

[NebClimber]

So, what are the "essential" knots. Please list your top 3.

 

[MasterBlaster]

1) Bowline
2) Timber hitch
3) Clove hitch

 

[ProfessorPlum]

The newest ISA cert exam has some very basic questions that require a cursory understanding of the use of knots used by arborists, including the bowline, timber hitch, prussik, etc. At no point on the test are you asked to actually demonstrate how the knot is tied, only under what circumstances the knot is used.

If you don't know those knots already, though, I've never met an arborist who didn't look forward to a chance to show their prowess with a rope over a beer. Keep a length of rope around the house to practice; you'll lose 'em if your fingers don't get in the habit of tying.

Good knots are pretty life changing, though, as was said. They not only make tree work a hell of a lot easier, they keep you from being that guy on the interstate dodging traffic to retrieve two mattresses and a shattered canoe. You know the guy.

 

[Gord]

Good gravy, a timber hitch as the number two knot!! Whutfer? It's knot even a not, just a bunch of friction wraps. Very dependent on rope type/size/cleanliness/dryness...sorry but I hate the knot. Often touted as easy to undo...except of course when it's under a large block or log (which is often what it's used for) and you must perform about seven unwrappings until it's free.

My knots, not in order:

Bowline, running bowline, sheet bend, other bowline variations.

Clove hitch, half hitches, buntline hitch (all the same thing)

Valdotain Tress and it's variations. (not just for climbing...excellent for a movable attatchment point midline for pulley systems or whatever.)

Distel, Schwabisch, Prussik (variations on the same theme. fancier brothers of the clove group.)

Anchor bend, running anchor bend.

Double Fishermans knot, Scaffold knot.

Figure Eight stopper.

 

[Greg]

Gord, you trashed the good ole timber hitch, but what do you tie to hold a block? I agree the timber does have some draw backs but it has never failed me. I've been using a loopie a lot and like it much better than the timber hitch however.

ISA exam --- does have knots that you need to know. You don't have to tie them just answer questions about them. I remember some really screwey question about the timber hitch in particular. I think the knots fall under the rigging section.
Take all of the chapter tests in the book, know them, and you will do fine.
Greg

 

[Stumper]

My top 3: Bowline, Alpine butterfly, and clovehitch. Three aren't enough though. I need that Timber hitch, a Scaffold knot, Distel, V.T., Carrick bend, cow hitch, improved tautline(open asymetrical prussik) round turn and two half hitches and several angling knots that don't carry over to rope.

 

[TheTreeSpyder]

i would like to submit that a VT is a variation/family of round turn/french prusik. An anchor is roundturn sitting on it's own tail as a constritor is the cloves similar answer. i find the coils of a Blakes to place it in this family too. i see an double fishermans/barrel as anchor to self; like buntline to clove or lobster to girth/larks head?

i think that muenter/girth/larks head shwab, cow hitch, prusik is a seperate family from clove, distel,tautline, knut etc. In the former the bar is straight ends out same side middle. This makes pulling on line end push the bar deeper on the tail end, drags the tail the same direction as the pull(locking free end better once again, after line changes direction in the pattern.

The clove (family), on the other hand the bar is slanted, the turns follow the same direction yet cross each other (so not a round turn family), and the ends come out different directions from center. That makes pulling one end of knot push the bar towards the free end of line, as any drag fromthe pull side pulling on free end to pull out too, as well as turns continuting in same direction make this family more 'walkers' than the previous girth/prusik type strategy family. IMLHO i think a scaffold knot as i've seen it is a kinda turned around stretched out clove?

Of course a sheet bend is a cut open bowline, and a bowline is jsut a half hitch choking ring grabbing it's own tail 2x to leave a secured loop i think.

i place timber hitch as a loose eyesplice.

i really go with the knot groups! And think that a half hitch choking loop is in all of them. 2 of them in smooth series starts round turn/ prussiks, 2 opposing halfs continuing in same direction starts clove, 2 opposing halfs changing direction starts muneter/girth/prusiks.

Kind like the extra bulk of going beyond overhand and fig. 8 stopper. to stevedore in 1/2" and under lines.

Double bowline with Y tie off (even make sheetbend like that).

Clove Family

and Stevedore Stopper.

Ya got me on the running anchor bend though!???

 

[Rob Murphy]

three most used

1 Double fishermans ,
2 Clove
3 Running Bowline

 

[ramanujan]

Running anchor bend Spydey? Try it you'll like it. Not for situations of extreme loading, I use it for taglines and such. Just tie anchor bend around standing part with tail emerging away from loop. Good for SRT in place of a running bowline when you need a bit of friction in the running loop to keep it away from suckers stubs etc.

 

[TheTreeSpyder]

MathMan i woulda figured that would hang up!

One i learned as a knot before trees, was a trucker's tightner/hitch that we know as a Z-rig, but is listed as a knot (like parbuckle is). Hauling about anything away from trees, that tension comes in handy, especially if ya can see the pattern to make it a 6x or 9x, impact it with body weight, maybe sweat it in, pull to that side a bit to much; put one like it on the otherside; pull item back straight etc. If moving a motorcycle etc. prolly going to take 4 legs Compress the shocks/springs when ya can as part of process, hitching to strong points, no sheet metal etc.

Good one about butterfly too Stumper!

 

[M.D. Vaden]

The test is over - was today, November 15th.

Only two knot related questions.

Out of about 25 people, I was second to last to finish.

I tend to read the questions very slowly.

So its about 4 weeks until results time.