cropduster= dead white oaks

[jd40mo77]

Has anyone seen this.........

I live in an area where there is a lot of row crops and have lived here all my life. I have heard of locals who planted gardens and got into it with farmers/crop dusters when they sprayed and the drift got on plants in their garden.

We acutally live a good 5 miles from any row crop and for some strange reason............supposedly to kill out unwanted brush...... the guy owning property across the county road from us had a cropduster spray his grown up pasture. The slight breeze was strong enough to carry the drift over onto our side of the road.

We kinda laughed about it at the time which was sometime around May/June 2011. But by the end of the summer there were at least 20 oak trees including some white oaks that had grade lumber in them that were dead. We rent this house and our landlord had the trees cut down and salvaged what they could for lumber and made a verbal agreement with guy across the road who agreed to pay to have the stumps ground out.

Now over a year later there are still trees dying. We own property a few miles away with several acres of timber and I would hate to think that something like this could happen there and what course of action a person could take.....

Does anyone know what type of chemical would kill healthy mature white oaks?

At this point these trees are dead and gone or going and our landlord doesn't think they would benefit in the long run by pursuing legal action...............but it would be nice to know these gentlemen could be persuaded to not do this in the future to anyone else's trees and property.........

I wish we could have shot some video........

 

[jd40mo77]

Oh yeah..........to my knowledge this guy never paid a dime towards any cleanup of these dead trees or stumps and they were located a large front yard which is kept manicured with zero turn mowers once a week through the summer months.

As a bonus every time the wind blows the numerous dead trees along the county road drop limbs and break off into the roadway as they decay...

 

[ATH]

That would be a regulated application. In most states that regulation would either be through the state agriculture or environmental protection agency. You might check with them to see if they are intested in the matter. The fact it is over a year after the fact, they are probably not able to do much. You might at least get them to get the records that would show what was sprayed (it is manditory to record that).

 

[Raintree]

You not being the owner of the alleged loss I don't think you have a claim.

State level DEP still may show interest like ATH said, worth a call.

Chemical trespass with or without damages is a serious issue.

One would think the aerial spray guys would know better specially using herbicides.

Something about this just doesn't sound right to me.

 

[jd40mo77]

I don't have any desire to pursue any claims to damages and neither does the landlord at this point....

I was mainly interested in figuring out if this happens in other places and if anyone on here has ideas on what type of herbicide would be capable of killing a mature white oak tree.

Someone suggested it may have been 24D mixed hot as in 100%........

I had the thought at one point that this clown had a bunch of various chemicals and needed to get rid of them............but surely not.....

I wouldn't really want to shut them down or cost them any money but it would give peace of mind to know a representative from the right agency paid this "neighbor" a visit and gave them a update on what the "best practices" are for aerial application of brush control herbicides and wind drift guidelines and who would be liable and the potential cost of gross errors......

 

[sgreanbeans]

I would make sure that meeting happens. That is a big issue in Iowa, spray drift and it goes both ways. I had a buddy with a tree nursery, had them sprayed, spray drifted into farmers crops. No more tree farm($$$$$) Farmers have crop dusters all the time, we sometimes stop and watch the pilots, as they are amazing, they way they throw those little planes around. But like anything else, they need to clean the tanks and sometimes they don't. A duster recently was spraying a pesticide and switched to herbicide with out cleaning, or the other way around, not sure. Killed a bunch of soy beans and the drift came over into a newly planted streetscape, toasting it. Farmer and Pilot held liable. Even tho the farmer took a big hit with his crops. He really got screwed!

That would be a fun job, there is a guy here who has a old mustang fighter, uses it for dusting. Thing sounds like a dragster when idling and he can do all kinds of rolls and banking maneuvers with it. I cant really tell from the ground. but I could swear I hear him laughing and screaming when he goes by. WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

 

[Urban Forester]

Someone suggested it may have been 24D mixed hot as in 100%........

It seems hard to believe that anyone would load 100% of anything in an aerial tank. Even if they were stupid about regulations, label restrictions, etc. the cost would be astronomical. If improper aerial applications are being performed in your state on a semi-regular (?) basis. Then you need to get involved in changing the laws that regulate crop dusting. It sounds as if there is a inspection/compliance issue here. The agency tasked with ensuring compliance has dropped the ball. There are certain pesticides used in agriculture that have EXTENDED soil half-lifes. Put aside the health of the trees, what about your kids, your neighbor's kids walking barefoot on grass/soil treated with God know's what at what rate! The issue of improper or improperly regulated applications is a SERIOUS matter, that should be dealt with ASAP!

 

[dingeryote]

It seems hard to believe that anyone would load 100% of anything in an aerial tank. Even if they were stupid about regulations, label restrictions, etc. the cost would be astronomical. If improper aerial applications are being performed in your state on a semi-regular (?) basis. Then you need to get involved in changing the laws that regulate crop dusting. It sounds as if there is a inspection/compliance issue here. The agency tasked with ensuring compliance has dropped the ball. There are certain pesticides used in agriculture that have EXTENDED soil half-lifes. Put aside the health of the trees, what about your kids, your neighbor's kids walking barefoot on grass/soil treated with God know's what at what rate! The issue of improper or improperly regulated applications is a SERIOUS matter, that should be dealt with ASAP!

The FAA and USDA keeps a corner office in every spray pilots keester LOL!!

The premise that off label applications were made, and performed in a manner that recklessly endangered a nearby dwelling is more than a bit of a stretch. Simply just too much to lose and no gain period.

In addition spraying a hay field means somebody intends to feed that hay.
That is a whole 'nuther point of conflict in the premise. Critters are too expensive to poison, and hay is too valuable to lock up in PHI.
Whatever it was, I seriously doubt it was a sterilizing agent or one of the more persistent and hazzardous herbicides.

Mistakes are made, though rarely, and when they are, notifications are required by law, and it IS enforced.
Inventory cross reference to application records and billing, is part of the annual+ audits, and there is no room to wiggle.
Things went from serious scrutiny to hyper scrutiny after 9-11-01 when it was discovered Haji had studied using dusters as a weapon, and it hasn't let up.

I would suggest that the neighbor might be able to answer questions without creating hostilities, and done first.
From there open a can of ugly if needed. If the guy is some rare idiot hack, doing the neighbor a favor with the neighbors chem, or some other off the wall wierdness, I agree about the concern for the kids. Talking to the neighbor would allow for a direction of assumption, or clarity.

Stay safe!
Dingeryote

 

[jd40mo77]

The FAA and USDA keeps a corner office in every spray pilots keester LOL!!

The premise that off label applications were made, and performed in a manner that recklessly endangered a nearby dwelling is more than a bit of a stretch. Simply just too much to lose and no gain period.

In addition spraying a hay field means somebody intends to feed that hay.
That is a whole 'nuther point of conflict in the premise. Critters are too expensive to poison, and hay is too valuable to lock up in PHI.
Whatever it was, I seriously doubt it was a sterilizing agent or one of the more persistent and hazzardous herbicides.

Mistakes are made, though rarely, and when they are, notifications are required by law, and it IS enforced.
Inventory cross reference to application records and billing, is part of the annual+ audits, and there is no room to wiggle.
Things went from serious scrutiny to hyper scrutiny after 9-11-01 when it was discovered Haji had studied using dusters as a weapon, and it hasn't let up.

I would suggest that the neighbor might be able to answer questions without creating hostilities, and done first.
From there open a can of ugly if needed. If the guy is some rare idiot hack, doing the neighbor a favor with the neighbors chem, or some other off the wall wierdness, I agree about the concern for the kids. Talking to the neighbor would allow for a direction of assumption, or clarity.

Stay safe!
Dingeryote

I am not sure about the status of this property in regards to it being used as a "farm"......I have never seen a cow on the place or seen any being brought in or taken out. They didn't have the gumption to bushhog the "pasture" much less make hay off of it. That is why the saplings and brush were beginning to take over the open areas since he aquired the property. His whole claim that he had it sprayed to kill the brush seems to not really fit with the activities/improvements or lack there-of both before and after the incident. The "Neighbor" who own's the "pasture" was talked to by the landlord who owns the house we rent and the manicured front lawn where over 20 trees have died. The landlord explained that since they just happen to be in the sawmill and logging business they would salvage what they could and clean up the tops. At that time the only thing asked of the "pasture" owner from across the street was for him to have all the stumps ground down below ground level. I was present as a bystander during one these discussions and I got the feeling the "pasture" owner wasn't going to turn loose of one dime to fix the problem he has created. He started talking about how he could have one of his employees run a grinder and he could rent it but it would cost such and such much........... The landlord had a personal friend offer to grind the stumps at a price at least 30% less than the price Mr. pasture owner had named off. The bill was sent to Mr. pasture owner and to my knowledge he never paid anything on it.

Just in the past couple weeks Mr. pasture owner has had some guy out here fumbling around with a skidder and chainsaw taking down random dead and decaying trees on his property. These trees were healthy prior to the cropduster incident. I feel sorry for the timber worker since it looks like a really good way to get killed by a widow maker. You see Mr. pasture owner owns several hundred acres and a pretty decent sized business in the communications and broadcast industry. Along with this business he owns numerous large pieces of equipment such as 100+HP ag tractors and batwing bush hogs............these he could just as easily have used to mow down the saplings and sprouts which looked to be less than 2" and definitely less than 3" in diameter.......
His company also owns dozers, backhoes and other equipment with protective cabs on them which could be used to safely knock down the trees that are now crumbling......... or of course they could have been used to clear the trees before they were in the hazardous state they are now........