Does tree wood grain spiral?

[M.D. Vaden]

The question comes from my hike in the forest, but it pertains to urban trees.

Last weekend, in the Rogue River National Forest and Red Buttes Wilderness, we passed some trees - I think pine, spruce, maybe Douglas fir, that were dead, laying on the ground, and long enough for the bark to be gone. The wood was silvery gray looking.

The outer part of several logs had cracks that spiraled, rather than just being straight cracks. Is that because the wood grain was formed that way?

Will trees have spiral wood grain that is not noticeable when they are alive and standing?

I've heard a few tree removal or logging stories about trees that partially rotated during the felling. Would something like that pertain to a twisting wood grain?

 

[SilentElk]

Seen alot of trees with a spiral grain. You will notice it is very common if you do much firewood splitting.

 

[TheTreeSpyder]

Same'ere; notably our Live Oaks; part of their strength i think is the spiraled/ cable like grain; giving more fiber to hold than if run straight(?).

 

[Bermie]

A lot of our cedars here spiral (Juniperus bermudiana)
A tree can grow with a spiral ( or twist) if it has a large branch or group of branches on one side that catches the wind, not just the vagaries of the species, but a mechanical reason.

 

[clearance]

I have climbed a few cedars, red and yellow that were real twisted sisters. Seen a few logs like that in the slash, culls, obviously. Seen big old logs with the bark all gone used beside the road for gaurd rails. Just like corkscrews, wierd, I don't know why they are like that.

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Some trees will actually move the transport tissue year to year so translocation is spread out, while other trees it's all nearly a straight line.

 

[Sprig]

Interesting. Have no idea what causes this in other-wise straight-grained trees but have seen lots of it. Genetics? Magnetic vortexes? Naturally occurring ground toxins? Predisposed? Mutants? Aliens? Who knows. It could be as simple as where the branches happen to come out in a pattern that forces the growth that way. I did a huge downed hemlock (predisposed to twisting imo to start with) on a wood claim I had, old growth at least 300-400yrs old and around 6ft diam., that did a complete 360degree turn every 30ft or so. It had been left as a cull 50+years ago, or it could have been just too big but I think it was because of the spiraling in it. Though not my favorite wood to burn the 7-8 cords I got out of it was awesome stuff and lasted me for two cold winters, long burns with little ash and decent heat. Nice stuff as far as hem goes.
My neighbor and me are rooting and potting fig trees right now that we are purposely weaving, but this is way off topic. I have some second growth fir in my shed that is so firkin' gnarly it is a bull to split even 10" thick rounds, the grain is like spaghetti. It grew in an area of other-wise straight trees so one can easily surmise that it was genetics in that particular tree. Then again maybe it was partially chomped by a deer when it was young, who knows? I have a neighbor just down the road who is a tree geneticist that might have an answer or two, I shall ask her next time I see her and post her response if anyone is curious. I am.
Cheers, Serge

Edit: Ran into tree genetisist neighbour on the 25th and posed the question to her and she confirmed that it is more genetics than anything of individual trees, so you can have mutants in other-wise straight stands of timber. In others it is a growth stratagy for strength. Interesting, now I want to learn more!

 

[TheTreeSpyder]

Some thumbnail pictures(click for larger pix) of highly leveraged Live Oak; showing obviously twisted grain as a support strategy; straining to show beneath the layer of bark/skin, as branch collars do. Tree Muscles

 

[geofore]

growing strait trees

There was a government study on trying to grow walnut trees strait and tall. I don't remember the title, done in wisconsin years ago. Either a GAO report or one of those free publications out of Pueblo, CO. That's a place to start looking.

 

[TheTreeSpyder]

Just as trees leaves will roll if that is the path of least resistance against wind; they will also rotate in hole slightly when that gives great relief to a specific storm's wind force. Also, i think of all growth as a response over time.

i think some trees are more prone to spiraled fiber; especially slow growers of high weight; whereby they grow slow enough to be able to adjust tot he leveraged weight

 

[Jack Green]

spiral "windy genes"

The question comes from my hike in the forest, but it pertains to urban trees.

Last weekend, in the Rogue River National Forest and Red Buttes Wilderness, we passed some trees - I think pine, spruce, maybe Douglas fir, that were dead, laying on the ground, and long enough for the bark to be gone. The wood was silvery gray looking.

The outer part of several logs had cracks that spiraled, rather than just being straight cracks. Is that because the wood grain was formed that way?

Will trees have spiral wood grain that is not noticeable when they are alive and standing?

I've heard a few tree removal or logging stories about trees that partially rotated during the felling. Would something like that pertain to a twisting wood grain?

dear m.d. vaden For an explanation of this condition check out "The body language of trees" by claus mattheck and helge breoler under "helical growth and torsion" . As noted by Bermie it can be down to wind loading on an asymetrical crown causing torsion , but it is also geneticaly determined , some species are more prone than others and some stock within that species are more prone than others . it's quite common in Horse chesnuts ( Aesculus Hippocastanum) and Wild cherry (Prunus Avium) in my part of the u.k. so in conclusion "Windy genes" : regards

 

[pigwot]

Check out this thread and the article I mention about spiral grain in trees: http://arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=32169

 

[Jack Green]

Pigwot , nice article on the subject of curly maple cheers , regards .

 

[Treeman67]

The question comes from my hike in the forest, but it pertains to urban trees.

Last weekend, in the Rogue River National Forest and Red Buttes Wilderness, we passed some trees - I think pine, spruce, maybe Douglas fir, that were dead, laying on the ground, and long enough for the bark to be gone. The wood was silvery gray looking.

The outer part of several logs had cracks that spiraled, rather than just being straight cracks. Is that because the wood grain was formed that way?

Will trees have spiral wood grain that is not noticeable when they are alive and standing?

I've heard a few tree removal or logging stories about trees that partially rotated during the felling. Would something like that pertain to a twisting wood grain?

In Centeral Oregon, Ponderosa Pine had sparial grain, it is kinda interesting and it got me curious too
Treeman67

 

[pigwot]

I need to find my box of old photos. I have a picture of my groundsperson and I standing on a 10 foot long Acer saccharum log (36" to 40" diameter from top to bottom) once we loaded it on our home-made log wagon. The grain spiraled a full 360 degrees over the length of that log.

 

[M.D. Vaden]

In Centeral Oregon, Ponderosa Pine had sparial grain, it is kinda interesting and it got me curious too
Treeman67

Of the few trees I mentioned in my opening post, the pine probably was Ponderosa. There's Ponderosa and Sugar pine here.

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

There was a government study on trying to grow walnut trees strait and tall. I don't remember the title, done in wisconsin years ago. Either a GAO report or one of those free publications out of Pueblo, CO. That's a place to start looking.

Try the Forest Products Lab in Madison WI. It's part of the USDA-USFS.

http://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/aboutus/aboutus.html

Lost of good research there. The Silvics Manual is outstanding.