Gave Part of the Job to the OTHER GUY????!!!!

[limbwalker54]

Please let me know what you guys think:

Looked at a Thornless Honeylocust planted over 60 years ago about eight feet from the corner of a house. Client wondered if it was dead....it was not....so I bid the job to do a light crown thinning on the tree (TH's don't take much pruning......) and elevate some of the heavier limbs that were leaning over the home for their piece of mind. Client also has three stone dead Sassafras in the back yard, accessable by my little log truck and plywood, that we will be using a spider lift on instead of climbing because there is no other tree to tie into and they are too close to wires to be dropped..... Also bid the job to remove a fallen Sassafras from the neighbors yard.... All in all a nice one day job with bringing out the wood, etc etc...
I let a week go by after I gave them the estimate and then called on follow up.

Here's what the older gentleman in his 80's said.... "Well Mike, unbenounced to me my wife gave part of the job to someone else....but what is your price on the back yard stuff?? You see, trees really do nothing for me....so please give me your best price."

I said, "Well, I will give you a price but I want to make sure you are getting proper pruning on the tree in front." He replied, "Well, how bad could they screw up the front tree?" I said, "Without seeing what they have specified, I don't know. But I want to make sure if I am there and put my name on the trees in the rear, that the job was done to our standards in the front yard as well."

I ended up giving him a price, just subtracting the amount we had in the price for the pruning on the Thornless Honeylocust. He approved. Supposedly the other guy was to do the pruning the next day. I can't wait to see what they did.... If the thing was topped or truly hacked I would like to walk away from the job......I'm afraid someone would look at us and assume we did it......if it is good, no harm done? How would you guys feel? .....I have never had this happen before.

 

[sgreanbeans]

I think u are on the right track, wait to see what they do. If bad, walk.
I have had people call me after they went with the "other guy". After throwing the OG off their property, they wanted me to come in and finish. I dont do it because, once u set foot on the project, you own it. People down the street can only assume you are the same guy who messed it up. So I stay far away from the OG and their shoddy work.

 

[limbwalker54]

Thanks SGB....yeah I'm gonna swing by incognito and just wander out back to look at the trees to "see how much plywood I need" (which is the truth anyway...) to get my little log truck back there.....
I'll look at the one in the front...if its bad I'll know right away, and so we'll see how it goes!

 

[NCTREE]

I love it when HOs give the prune job to the cheaper guy thinking they are getting a bargain. I tell people a removal is a removal when it comes to pruning you get what you pay for. I always ask do you want a $400 prune or do you want a $800 prune. I can do cheaper too and hack up your tree if thats what your looking for.

It's funny when they come #####ing back that they should of went with me all along.

I had an Ho the other week I gave a price for an oak pruning and misc trimming. I gave a verbal est. Later that week I got a call back saying they wanted a writen est because they didn't want me charging them more. I said I don't do writens because then the Ho shows it to another tree guy and they say they will beat by a $100 dollars. She told me I got the job but she just needed it in paper so I agreed. I called her the day I put it in the mail and got a call back later that she didn't need the est because she found someone to do it cheaper. Click!:bang:

Boy I tell ya sometimes it can be frustrating. I'm interest to see what inid of a job she gets.

 

[treeman82]

I did a big oak removal last year for a guy who wanted no damage. Got the job done without any damage, the guy was very happy. Had me bid a couple more days of work with no damage. He calls me later on, he got somebody else to do the easy work for cheaper, but wants me to come back later on for the hard stuff. I told him to go to hell.

 

[limbwalker54]

Burns me up too NC, all of this price shopping. I try to sell my knowledge and skills on them first, but some people just don't give a rats a** about that....including these folks. I gave them the "we don't top and here is why" education in the beginning, and even helped them figure out what to do about the tree that was theirs that fell in the neighbors yard...as well as was going to provide a little crown cleaning for free in a small Japanese Maple in the front yard......
Frustrating.
If I go back and it's a hack job then no way am I taking down any falling apart, 4 years dead sassafras that are about 55 feet tall.....just so I can look like a hack.....

I'm a member of the NTH association.... "NO Tree Hacking" hehe

 

[mckeetree]

I did a big oak removal last year for a guy who wanted no damage. Got the job done without any damage, the guy was very happy. Had me bid a couple more days of work with no damage. He calls me later on, he got somebody else to do the easy work for cheaper, but wants me to come back later on for the hard stuff. I told him to go to hell.

With no damage??? The only calls we get are folks who want no damage...to anything! I have gotten in my old age to where I tell any and all of them to go to hell when they start the gave part of the job to someone else or can you just do the hard part crap. Screw those people.

 

[limbwalker54]

I have half a mind to call them back and kindly tell them thanks but no thanks.
It makes me wonder what the other guy wanted for doing the trees in the back.......

 

[treeman82]

Maybe I should rephrase that as no impact.

 

[NCTREE]

Well your probably better off walking away from that one. Sometimes you need the work but if you don't than walk. You are never gonna get anything out of it in return. Those kind of customers just want the cheapest price and thats it. You'll never a get a referral from them and they probably wont call you back or if they do they will call everone else in the book. I dont need customers like that.

Funny thing happened to me last week I was on a job across the street from this crazy manic guy who I had done work for. This guy literally drove me nuts when I worked for him. He screwed me over on a second job I was going to do for. Went with someone else because the guy told them they were going to have the wood cut up for lumber and gave them a cheaper price. Anyways the guy did the job and broke all kinds of #### and ended up cutting all the wood and loading it anyways. I laughed when I heard about and thought good for them.

So I was at the job across the street last week and I figured this lunatic might come over and bug me. Sure enough he did. I shut the chipper off and told him right out that he couldn't be on my jobsite. He said he wanted an estimate. :angry2: I said no go find someone else you wasted my time enough turn away and kept working. Boy did that feel good. This guy has had 3 other tree services work him I sure as hell aint getting anything out of it other than wanting to blow my brains out listening to this guy talk. Screw me once shame on you, screw me twice shame on me.

 

[prentice110]

Intresting thread

I have half a mind to call them back and kindly tell them thanks but no thanks.
It makes me wonder what the other guy wanted for doing the trees in the back.......

Other guy is gotta be a pick up truck hack that knows he can take a load of brush out, but cant touch the big work out back without killin himself or loosing his ass. Other than that, it ought to be a hoot to see what the Locust looks like. Let us know!

 

[fishercat]

I don't they expect that response.

I did a big oak removal last year for a guy who wanted no damage. Got the job done without any damage, the guy was very happy. Had me bid a couple more days of work with no damage. He calls me later on, he got somebody else to do the easy work for cheaper, but wants me to come back later on for the hard stuff. I told him to go to hell.

They think we are so desperate we will do anything.

Good for you!

 

[fishercat]

If they hired someone else...........

I have half a mind to call them back and kindly tell them thanks but no thanks.
It makes me wonder what the other guy wanted for doing the trees in the back.......

I'd walk. They need to learn they get what they pay for.

 

[Natewood]

You guys must be in really good markets to think loyalty is expected... I wish i could have it like that! I lose so many customers to hacks, but sinxce I try to educate my customers to know the difference in quality work, typically they end up calling me back (humbled) to fix a hacks mistake. To me they've learned their lesson , I don't have to tell them"told ya so", I just do the work at full quoted price before the hacks came through while doing half the origonal work.... I'm never too proud to take someone's money!

 

[Bigus Termitius]

If I can fix a hack's mistakes, I will. I think that's what we ought to do to promote true arboriculture as professional arborists. I can certainly understand why some guys will not though, can't blame them. Might there be some misperceived backlash, perhaps, but IMO the overall benefits are more likely to outweigh it in the long run.

If the though is to split the jobs up, unless I know the OG, I’d encourage the HO to let me go first, check the OG’s insurance, and get multiple references.

I’m hesitant to step onto a job some OG has fled from, but I have before, and it's not cheap.

I had a customer go with the OG on a couple of removals after I got back to him with a more accurate price, he said his wife (classic scapegoat) was impatient and they wanted it done ASAP. We had a verbal agreement and I was going to combine the stump grinding with another project if possible to save everyone some money and get the job done within the week. He said he'd call me about pruning in the spring though.

His trees stood there for months.

Can't wait for that call. I'm going to be too busy and recommend....yep, you guessed it…..the OG.

 

[limbwalker54]

Well....here it goes.

Went back there yesterday.....drove around the neighborhood a bit, looked at the other work in the area. Seems that hacks have this neighborhood wrapped up! At least every other house had something that was topped, "shaped" or with so many cuts to laterals that were undersized they may as well have took the trees down.....
I went to the guys house and lo and behold... five cuts on laterals on the lower portion of the tree, and not one bit of cleaning or crown thinning done..... the guy even left a 3 inch diameter limb shooting out toward the neighbors house that should have been removed completely cut to a little 1/4 inch twig!! It didn't look as bad as some of the trees in the area...but it didn't even address the issues the tree had.
1. It was so dense from never being touched that we specified a light crown thinning....would have made about thirty or so smaller cuts with the pole pruner and hand saw to accomplish this....in about and hour and a half....
2. We were going to lighten up the load over the house on a few limbs that would become problems in the snow/ice season.....
3. we were going to crown clean it of limbs over 1" in diameter while we were in the tree.....all told about 3.5 hours worth of work in this larger Thornless Honeylocust

This guy just showed up and made a bunch of white eyes all over the lower portion of the tree and said "pay me".

It doesn't look horrible, but nevertheless, it was not pruned correctly. The cuts did not accomplish ANY goals the client had.....IMO....but according to the client....when I talked to them (the wife came home as I was looking at the tree....)

She said "well you said that you were going to crown or something" and that "someone told her crowning was bad". I said, "Ma'am, I specified CROWN THINNING, CROWN CLEANING, and CROWN RAISING...." And I explained what it meant. She thought the reference to "crown" was to top the tree...which I had already explained to her would not be done, nor was it good for the tree.....

So.....if she actually read the estimate, and paid attention to what I said we were going to do.....I would have probably got the pruning portion of the job.

I tried to keep my composure but after that she said, "You see, I love my grandkids....I don't love trees. You love trees and work in them, but we just want the job done....." I told her, "I love trees and perform accurate, correct work on them only. I gave you an estimate to perform accurate, arboriculturally correct work to accomplish the goals you expressed as well maintain the health of the tree. The fellow who did this work, did not accomplish those goals. The job was not done properly. I can fix some of these things if you wish, but you have already spent money on this and some of the cuts made will harm this tree."
She said "Well if that's the way you feel, do what you have to do."
I said, "Ok, thank you." and I went on my way. She said as I was starting to my truck, "I mean, "so and so" did this and they have been in business for forty years." I said, "Ma'am I don't care if he's been in business for two or two hundred years, there is a right way to do this and a wrong way."
Then I left.



Got a call forty minutes later from her husband......who profusely apologized for his wife going with the OG....and asked me if I would reconsider doing the work in the back. He said he had talked to his neighbor upon my recommendation about a tree on the border the neighbor was piling soil against the root collar. He said the neighbor agreed to remove the soil.

I learned that this guy actually paid attention to what I had said. I believe his wife misunderstood what we were going to do and when the OG showed up, the husband was not there and she said "OK".....family type dispute.

If this were any other situation, I believe I would have walked away completely as I set out to do....but this guy is in his eighties....

I plan on not touching the tree in the front at all and making quick work of the trees in the back....

I uphold my standards as an arborist. I did make an effort to offer corrective pruning to the hack job in the front, told them what was wrong.

Do you think in this situation that going back to do the removals is the right thing to do? I don't believe the guy would have apologized unless it was a true oversight or mistake that the wife hired the OG.....I pretty much have committed.....but what do you think of this long winded response....whew!

 

[limbwalker54]

I had no idea that post would be that long when I started typing.......

 

[jefflovstrom]

Me either!!!!!!!! lol!
Just go do the job now that you have vented. Probably feel good after you do and maybe something good comes from it. Old people talk alot, could be a good thing.
Jeff :msp_smile:

 

[limbwalker54]

Jeff,

Thanks...I guess I apparently talk a lot too hehe....

 

[jefflovstrom]

Jeff,

Thanks...I guess I apparently talk a lot too hehe....

Jeff