Got another stubborn one.. Stihl 017

[a. palmer jr.]

I went back through this post and indeed I didn't say whether I replaced the carb or not, sorry about that. I will indeed go out tomorrow and check to see if I actually did replace it. Looking through my ebay records I see where I bought a carburetor for it but I'll still check and see if I put it on. I know I put one on the other saw I'm working on. Getting old isn't the fun it ought to be.

 

[ZeroJunk]

I had this happen this week with a vintage 025. I replaced the carb and after that it ran perfectly. Perhaps it was already flooded, but all my flood tests failed. Nothing worked, but the new carb solved everything. Engine started on the third pull: first two on choke and third at fast-idle position. Fired immediately and runs great today.

I had something a few weeks ago, can't remember exactly what, but it was just dumping fuel in to the barrel all the time. No way to unflood it. Empty the tank I suppose. New carb fixed it.

 

[ZeroJunk]

I find it odd that so many do not feel the need to vacuum and pressure test on a saw with age. First place I go in the shop. At least 75% will have it.

I know I am at odds with most. But, you should be able to determine if a saw has an air leak without testing.

Sort of jumps out at you.

 

[lone wolf]

I had this happen this week with a vintage 025. I replaced the carb and after that it ran perfectly. Perhaps it was already flooded, but all my flood tests failed. Nothing worked, but the new carb solved everything. Engine started on the third pull: first two on choke and third at fast-idle position. Fired immediately and runs great today.

Yeah, it could be flooded, he should clear it out and try again.

I know I am at odds with most. But, you should be able to determine if a saw has an air leak without testing.

Sort of jumps out at you.

It depends on to what degree it leaks, and it is best to eliminate this right off the bat.

 

[ZeroJunk]

Yeah, it could be flooded, he should clear it out and try again.

It depends on to what degree it leaks, and it is best to eliminate this right off the bat.

If it does not leak enough that you can tell by running it, then why ?

Cause some Stihl class told you to ?

I have cranked the high needle up and finished a job with half the plastic part of the seal gone.

Jesus. Work on some saws.

 

[lone wolf]

If it does not leak enough that you can tell by running it, then why ?

Cause some Stihl class told you to ?

I have cranked the high needle up and finished a job with half the plastic part of the seal gone.

Jesus. Work on some saws.

To be perfect, that's why.

 

[ZeroJunk]

To be perfect, that's why.

Really. I have you ever thought of how silly it sounds for a saw mechanic to have to test for an air leak to see if there is one ?

 

[Bob Hedgecutter]

Really. I have you ever thought of how silly it sounds for a saw mechanic to have to test for an air leak to see if there is one ?

Not to see if- to prove where and negate the guessing game of near enough is good enough.

 

[a. palmer jr.]

I know I am at odds with most. But, you should be able to determine if a saw has an air leak without testing.

Sort of jumps out at you.

I kind of agree with you but this saw has never been started by me, I just pull and pull and nothing happens, like the ignition is turned off but it's not.
I didn't work on anything today but I did notice the saw has the new carburetor on it and everything is attached. I noticed on my receipt that I also bought an ignition module at the same time but it is not on the saw. If I can locate it I'll install it and see if anything happens.

 

[a. palmer jr.]

When I've flooded some of my saws in the past and you try to start them they kick back and try to pull the starter rope out of your hand; I got none of this with this saw. It was also easy to pull over considering it had good compression, checked with a known good tester. If I can find that module I bought I'll try to install it tomorrow if nothing else comes up. I'm still leaning toward that being my problem.

 

[a. palmer jr.]

Not to see if- to prove where and negate the guessing game of near enough is good enough.

I still say that if there's fuel in the combustion chamber and the ignition and compression are okay then it should hit at least once, air leak or not. This saw has all three except the timing of the spark may not be at the right time. Since I can't locate my timing light maybe I can locate my ignition module, I have most of the day tomorrow to see if I can find it. Don't ever move, even if your wife wants to!!

 

[L34]

Remove carb altogether and squirt some fuel straight in and see what happens.
No carb no flood.

 

[stihltech]

As far as vac and pressure testing, when you have to guarantee your work out the door you cover all the bases. Will a big air leak jump out at you, sure. But what about all the little ones that get missed and turn into bigger ones down the road and take out a piston? Yes it happens. My insurance on these.
I see all the parts cannons fired when all it needed was a seal, cylinder gasket, pulse hose, intake boot, etc.
Worked for 40+ years, ain't changing now.

 

[ZeroJunk]

As far as vac and pressure testing, when you have to guarantee your work out the door you cover all the bases. Will a big air leak jump out at you, sure. But what about all the little ones that get missed and turn into bigger ones down the road and take out a piston? Yes it happens. My insurance on these.
I see all the parts cannons fired when all it needed was a seal, cylinder gasket, pulse hose, intake boot, etc.
Worked for 40+ years, ain't changing now.

Me neither LOL. Agree to disagree.

 

[lone wolf]

Really. I have you ever thought of how silly it sounds for a saw mechanic to have to test for an air leak to see if there is one ?

As far as vac and pressure testing, when you have to guarantee your work out the door you cover all the bases. Will a big air leak jump out at you, sure. But what about all the little ones that get missed and turn into bigger ones down the road and take out a piston? Yes it happens. My insurance on these.
I see all the parts cannons fired when all it needed was a seal, cylinder gasket, pulse hose, intake boot, etc.
Worked for 40+ years, ain't changing now.

Just once I had a Vac leak right though a cylinder on the side, believe it or not.

 

[ZeroJunk]

Just once I had a Vac leak right though a cylinder on the side, believe it or not.

I have had seals leak, cylinder base loose and leak, spark plug loose, decomp loose, hole in manifold, split impulse line, glued on cylinder cover come off, pan cracked,.... some more will come to me I'm sure.

All within the last couple of months.

Never had a cylinder leak through the side though.

 

[a. palmer jr.]

Okay, I may have stumbled upon the problem: I was out in the garage early this morning looking for a ignition module for the 017 and found a couple in my can labeled "017". They didn't look alike so I tried the newer looking one and the bolts wouldn't line up. I then remembered going through this once before with an 017 from the same people. Stihl made a model change early on with the 017, changing the module when they changed the cylinder. Apparently the cylinder or flywheel has been changed on this saw allowing it to have spark but not in time. The replacement module I put on this saw does exactly the same thing the other one did, has spark but doesn't hit. I put a bit of fuel in the sparkplug hole, noticing the plug was not wet so doubt if it is flooding, no fuel in tank. I had fuel in tank last time and some of us thought it was flooding so I drained the tank this time. Anyway, for now, I'm giving it and myself a rest while I search for another flywheel to try.

 

[a. palmer jr.]

Just once I had a Vac leak right though a cylinder on the side, believe it or not.

I had a new looking Craftsman saw that had a cracked block, took forever to find it.

 

[Old2stroke]

Think of how far ahead you would be if you had the use of a timing light.

 

[cscltd]

There are 2 modules and matching flywheels with ser breaks. Below is old er. Version
You can kinda see if timing is right by by putting piston to tdc and seeing where magnets are in relation to module pickups. Not accurate but if it is out by a few degrees you can see it. (Especially if you have another similar to compare)
I had a brand new out of box 3120xp that the key way on crank was out by about 5 degrees and was at wits end until I checked it on a hunch- I had to replace the brand new crank.