Log Skidder vs. Tractor

[PA Plumber]

Am currently considering purchasing a used Tractor/Loader/Backhoe combo in the 40 horse range. It would have 4 wheel drive and a front grapple on the bucket.

Am also considering purchasing a log skidder.

It would be one or the other.

I do have about 20 loads of combined pulp and logs to harvest and am wondering if I should just purchase a skidder and try to sell it when I'm wrapping up.

I have been told about a 1981 John Deere 640 that might be for sale. The number would be in the 6K range. I was also told the tranny slips a little, but if not ran too hard, it would likely be fine for what I am doing. It has a 100' steel cable winch.

Any thoughts? And thanks.

 

[rdbrumfield]

As long as you realize the potential of your tractor, that is what I would go with. They are so versatile. You may and may not get what you paid out for a skidder. would hate to do some logging just to break even when you sell the skidder. If you do break something, a tractor is much cheaper to fix than a skidder.

I have used both. I can do anything with a tractor and more. Just the size of wood that matters.

What kind of a tranny is it that is slipping?
might be just a clutch adjustment

 

[hanniedog]

If you are going to harvest any good sized trees the 40 horse tractor will not cut. Last year i cut down a hickory about 30 ft long by 24" at the base. It was all a 150 horse 1086 wanted on firm flat ground.

 

[PA Plumber]

As long as you realize the potential of your tractor, that is what I would go with. They are so versatile. You may and may not get what you paid out for a skidder. would hate to do some logging just to break even when you sell the skidder. If you do break something, a tractor is much cheaper to fix than a skidder.

I have used both. I can do anything with a tractor and more. Just the size of wood that matters.

What kind of a tranny is it that is slipping?
might be just a clutch adjustment

Don't know about the tranny.

The fellow who told me about it is the one doing the hauling for me. He mentioned the owner may want to get rid of it due to health reasons.

It used to be his machine and he did tell me it was "straight" except for the slippage.

I wasn't even thinking about a skidder, but if I can get something decent for under 10K, I wondered if it would be worth considering.

Was pretty settled about the tractor idea until I started looking as skidders on line today.

 

[PA Plumber]

If you are going to harvest any good sized trees the 40 horse tractor will not cut. Last year i cut down a hickory about 30 ft long by 24" at the base. It was all a 150 horse 1086 wanted on firm flat ground.

Another part to the equation...

I do still have the 931C Cat track loader.

Have had some interest, but not sold yet. I could use it for the really big stuff. That thing will pull big logs in full tree length; It's just not very fast.

 

[hanniedog]

If you are going to be on very rough terrain the skidder would be my choice. Just from a safety point.

 

[hanniedog]

Since you have the track loader just use that, it may be slower but will get it done. Then get your small tractor which has a multitude of uses.

 

[PA Plumber]

Since you have the track loader just use that, it may be slower but will get it done. Then get your small tractor which has a multitude of uses.

The track machine is dreadfully slow. Quite a few nice trees are back in about 1/4 of a mile or so.

Am figuring the tractor would be okay for taking out pulp. Most of those trees are in the 14" DBH and smaller range, close to the landings, and not too bad to get to.

Good point on the terrain.
If the terrain is too steep for the track loader, I usually "throw" a tree uphill, one down hill, chain the tops together, and pull them out.

I'm thinking a winch would come in pretty handy for the ones that are hard to get.

You do have me leaning back to wards the tractor again. If the trees are too big, I could buck them to length and pull them out individually.

 

[sawinredneck]

A skidder has a mutitude of advantages, but limited uses. And a skidder with problems just seems to multiply those problems more over time. Think someone elses headache.
I love my mini for my aplication, if it can't lift it, it will ussuall drag it. But not at all usefull for your aplication.
A semi cheaper route would be a grapple for the track hoe?
If I were to look at a tractor for this aplication I wold have a front loader, and a grapple on the back. With something of this capacity trying to handle the wood you are talking about, a grapple bucket will do nothing but perterb you! Even trying to drag it backwards, a feat on a CUT, if it hangs at all the tires are in the air. Going foreward with it, you will constantly be trying to drive over it.
There may be a grapple attachment you could use on the backhoe? That would be slicker than snot!! A little to far to get the tractor in? Just reach in and grab it to drag it where it is handy to work with. One of the many things I have come to apreciate with the mini!
The CUT also opens up a world of versatility with other uses and can pay for itself many times over in the future. With the economy tanking can you say the same with a worn out skidder in six months to a year?

 

[slinger]

My JD 4500 ~35hp (check Avaatar) weighs about 3 tons with loader/backhoe attached. Unless your pullin modest sized saw logs (8-10' ) that size tractor is not enough on rough terrain. Does OK on firm/flat ground but mud and hills are too much for it. Might do better with a full set of chains but:dunno:

 

[sawinredneck]

My JD 4500 ~35hp (check Avaatar) weighs about 3 tons with loader/backhoe attached. Unless your pullin modest sized saw logs (8-10' ) that size tractor is not enough on rough terrain. Does OK on firm/flat ground but mud and hills are too much for it. Might do better with a full set of chains but:dunno:

Please don't take this the wrong way, but are you serious? I can grab a full tree, 12" DBH and drag it back wards with the grapple on the mini about anywhere I want to. It only weighs 1800#'s. i would be less than impressed with performance less than that from a CUT!

 

[redprospector]

For 20 load's I wouldn't buy a skidder. If the tranny crap's out it could cost 10k or more to fix.
If you're going to skid log's a skidder's hard to beat. If you're wanting versatility go with the tractor.

Andy

 

[PA Plumber]

A skidder has a mutitude of advantages, but limited uses. And a skidder with problems just seems to multiply those problems more over time. Think someone elses headache.
I love my mini for my aplication, if it can't lift it, it will ussuall drag it. But not at all usefull for your aplication.
A semi cheaper route would be a grapple for the track hoe?
If I were to look at a tractor for this aplication I wold have a front loader, and a grapple on the back. With something of this capacity trying to handle the wood you are talking about, a grapple bucket will do nothing but perterb you! Even trying to drag it backwards, a feat on a CUT, if it hangs at all the tires are in the air. Going foreward with it, you will constantly be trying to drive over it.
There may be a grapple attachment you could use on the backhoe? That would be slicker than snot!! A little to far to get the tractor in? Just reach in and grab it to drag it where it is handy to work with. One of the many things I have come to apreciate with the mini!
The CUT also opens up a world of versatility with other uses and can pay for itself many times over in the future. With the economy tanking can you say the same with a worn out skidder in six months to a year?

Using the track loader, every single tree for logs or pulp, has been removed going in reverse. (I'll see if I can find a pic.)

Actually I really don't mind dragging them out that way. I would just like to get the logs out a lot faster.

For the CUT, I was planning on some sort of 3 pt. hitch skidding tong for the back. The front grapple would be for moving brush and stacking bucked logs.

 

[maplemeister]

If you buy the skidder, is this the only job you really need it for? If you buy a tractor, would you have other uses for it besides this harvest operation? I am currently using a John Deere 1020, 40hp, on a rolling 50 acre lot I am cutting firewood from. Tractor is NOT four wheel drive but has big chains and loaded tires as well as a front end loader. Snow is still about 20" deep where I'm cutting so I am pulling most of my logs into the wood-road with a straight cable pull, or a cable and snatch block. I am not having any difficulty pulling two and three hitch setups to the landing with this tractor but most of the logs do not exceed 14" in diameter and I am pulling on a good hard packed and frozen wood-road. Since I'm cutting firewood, I am also using the bucket a lot to move my wood around, as well as stacking the logs at the landing. I have forks for the bucket but so far the bucket by itself is working just fine. I use my tractor year around and also have an 8 ft. plow that mounts to brackets in the bucket so your decision would be easier for me. I would like to find a deal on a cable skidder such as the farmi or Norse for my tractor as that would probably be the best setup I could have for small woodlot harvesting but they don't come on the block that often. Just a few ideas to think about. Hope this helps somewhat. A skidder would vastly improve my production, but for my personal situation, I get a lot more use out of the tractor on a year around basis.

Maplemeister:

 

[PA Plumber]

Here's an old pic from a trail camera.

 

[PA Plumber]

If you buy the skidder, is this the only job you really need it for? If you buy a tractor, would you have other uses for it besides this harvest operation? I am currently using a John Deere 1020, 40hp, on a rolling 50 acre lot I am cutting firewood from. Tractor is NOT four wheel drive but has big chains and loaded tires as well as a front end loader. Snow is still about 20" deep where I'm cutting so I am pulling most of my logs into the wood-road with a straight cable pull, or a cable and snatch block. I am not having any difficulty pulling two and three hitch setups to the landing with this tractor but most of the logs do not exceed 14" in diameter and I am pulling on a good hard packed and frozen wood-road. Since I'm cutting firewood, I am also using the bucket a lot to move my wood around, as well as stacking the logs at the landing. I have forks for the bucket but so far the bucket by itself is working just fine. I use my tractor year around and also have an 8 ft. plow that mounts to brackets in the bucket so your decision would be easier for me. I would like to find a deal on a cable skidder such as the farmi or Norse for my tractor as that would probably be the best setup I could have for small woodlot harvesting but they don't come on the block that often. Just a few ideas to think about. Hope this helps somewhat. A skidder would vastly improve my production, but for my personal situation, I get a lot more use out of the tractor on a year around basis.

Maplemeister:

Exactly my thoughts until I got this goofy skidder bug in my noggin! And yes, this is the only job in which the skidder would be used. (Do have a stand of Tulip Poplar coming on, but that is a few years away.)

Leaning even harder to wards the tractor.

The two I am looking at are the Kubota L39 and the John Deere 110 TLB.

Very similar machines with strong and weak points on both sides. Looking at whichever one I can get for the most reasonable price.

 

[slinger]

Please don't take this the wrong way, but are you serious? I can grab a full tree, 12" DBH and drag it back wards with the grapple on the mini about anywhere I want to. It only weighs 1800#'s. i would be less than impressed with performance less than that from a CUT!

hehe

I hooked a ~20 DBH Post Oak last fall ~20' long with skidding tongs on my 3 point hitch and dug ruts all the way to the field where I was cuttin/loading. I don't think I would have much trouble with~12" stuff but that's not what I typically drag out.

Some of the slopes in my woods are >7% with ditches and springs and good ol' southern Illinois clay.

I don't doubt a small tractor could do the job but, 20 loads might be a struggle in rough terrain/conditions.

 

[HolmenTree]

640 JD is a good size skidder. 1981 was their heyday. If you can find one today like you said for $6,000 and it can pull a load buy it! Maybe the torque converter is bad or maybe the tranny just needs setting up.For as much as you may use it even if it cost you an extra 5 grand to fix up your still far ahead because you could resell it and break even or you may just see how handy it really is and you may find other good paying work for it. This machine has 120+ h.p. and weighs over 20,000 lbs. A winch that can pull the ring out of the world , the ultimate big tire on all fours four wheel drive, put chains on even just the front tires and you can skid 2 cord loads just about anywhere when you got a dozen or more chokers on the winches mainline. You got 3/4" thick heavy steel stump pans which fully enclose the underside of the machine and you won't have to worry about sticks or logs popping up and taking out a hose or oil pan or something. You got a heavy duty blade that can push trails or landings with, backblade limbs off your trees, butt up your logs at the pile nice and even, save room at the landing and pull layers of loads onto your pile with a butt face 6 feet high. You are sitting up high with excellent eye sight of your work area. A small hitch plate can be welded on the back to hook up to a fuel trailer or whatever. These machines are built to work in the tough going, pushing over unwanted small trees , going over stumps and can travel 25+mph. Its got a canopy that will protect you from just about any hazard in the woods ,falling trees,tops, rollovers.Heavy screen to protect from spears, debris or logs flipping up while winching or backing up. In a farm tractor you won't fair so well.
The nice thing about John Deere is alot of the power train,engine parts from their farm tractors fit on their skidders which is a saving in dollars compared to Cat, Clarke Ranger, Timberjack etc.
It was fun writing this ,brings back good old memories.

 

[PB]

What is the terrain you will be skidding like? If it isn't too hilly or muddy, you can find 2wd farm tractors in the 60-100hp range for relatively cheap. Compact tractors have a much higher retail value than a farm tractor that is too big for most people.

Most of our skidding is done with a 2wd tractor when possible, and gets through some pretty hairy spots.

 

[sILlogger]

what about getting a forestry winch for you crawler? i bet i know a place that would have one!