Lot Clearing - The Stump question

[sritzau]

I am clearing a house lot for my mother in law. At this point we do not know who will do the excavating, so we do not know whether to leave the stumps (in case they use a bulldozer) or cut them flush (if they use an excavator). Any tips? I was thinking I would leave the stumps and then go back take them down if/when we knew they would be using an excavator. Any ideas on how tall to leave the stumps? Other tips and tricks?

Thanks,

Steve (lot-clearing nubie).

 

[tony marks]

depends some on the size an amount of trees. if u gonna have big stumps and a good many ofum. its best not to build a foundation on it as the roots will decay and u will have settling ground under u..
as to the part that would be yd. the same applys. u just gonna end up with holes to fill in an that can be dangerouse to running kids etc.. heaven help a poor horse or pony on groundlike that .. its one mistake the city folk make when they come out to the country for their dream life ,with horses an such.jmo
forgot. about a 15 inch stump is easy to work with.

 

[tawilson]

Knock the trees over, stumps and all whenever possible. Get someone with some experience in grubbing, he'll know what to do. You'll be surprised how much leverage that tree gives you for popping stumps.

 

[Newfie]

I take mine down to at least 12". allows ground clearance for my equipment and leaves something for the excavavtor to find without having to hunt for flush cuts. The guys I clear for all use excavators to pop the stumps and like the stump as short as possible so that it dumps easier at the "stump dump". They use bulldozers to prep the lot after the stumps are popped.

 

[sritzau]

Thanks for the responses. Thought I would add that the majority of the trees are small (6-10" diameter) ash with some oak, maple, hickory, and the occasional big-a$$ pine thrown in.

Steve

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

We were grinding stumps on a clearing job yesterday. It took 45 seconds to grind out a 20" maple stump.
If the excavator dig them out, you still have to get rid of them. It's getting harder and harder to find places to take the root balls.
If you do have a spot to dump the balls, you won't dig it out, load it up and haul it to the dump, in less than 45 seconds.

 

[dozerdan]

sritzau
Have a few different people bid on the job.
It should cost you less if you push the trees over with a dozer and then cut the stumps off. You have to get the dozer in anyhow to level the stump holes out. Why pay for two moving in fees?
Been there, done that.
When people would call me and tell me that they cleared there lot and that they left the stumps about two feet high. I always told them that it would have cost about 1/2 of what it will cost them now.
tawilson is correct, use the weight of the tree to your advantage.
Later
Dan

 

[Hunter]

Just keep in mind where they will be digging the footers for the foundation. Since its residential, they wont have to strip the topsoil. That makes it better, so you can just grind them 4" or so below ground level.
If you can get the layout of the house, You will see where they will be digging. If its going to have a basement, then they will remove most of the roots and stumps for you. but still grind what you can.
On all my commercial work, we have to take stumps down 8" below ground level, that gets alot of the roots. Even then, we still pull alot of debris when stripping topsoil.
Hunter

 

[dozerdan]

Hi
I haven't seen anyone in this area dig a footer for anything with a basement for over ten years. 2B stones are cheaper then digging footer with a machine. We just use 8" of stone for a base and shovel out the stones where the footer gets poured. The 8" of stones will create your side forms to hold your concrete.
We also have a concrete truck bring in the stones whenever possible. They can run them out of their shoot, once you get the hang of it, its fast.
Later
Dan

 

[tony marks]

where else can u get that kinda know how. fer free.

 

[Hunter]

what I was saying, was if its not going to have abasement, then we dig footers, If its gonna have a basement, then the digging of the basement will remove most of the debris from roots and stumps.
Hunter

 

[jokers]

Originally posted by dozerdan
Hi
I haven't seen anyone in this area dig a footer for anything with a basement for over ten years. 2B stones are cheaper then digging footer with a machine. We just use 8" of stone for a base and shovel out the stones where the footer gets poured. The 8" of stones will create your side forms to hold your concrete.
We also have a concrete truck bring in the stones whenever possible. They can run them out of their shoot, once you get the hang of it, its fast.
Later
Dan

That`s an interesting technique Dan, do you dig the stone by hand or with the excavator? It seems like you would end up using alot of extra concrete at $65 a yard with the slope you`d have to put on the stone so that it didn`t fall back in the footprint. How do you screed the footer flat and level?

With the exception of wall systems like Superior Precast which don`t use a footer, seems like everything around here gets a formed footer, either dug or framed and 10"x20" is standard because we use 10" block.

It sounds like your way could save some labor.

We also use the concrete truck or a slinger, or in some case the excavator bucket if reach or accessability is a problem. I`ve also heard of guys using a concrete pump for the stone but have never done it myself.

Russ

 

[Newfie]

Local or state building codes are different everywhere. Footings on everything with a basement, at least 4 foot below grade for frost.

Typical to have all top soil stripped before any stakes are set for hole.

I'd find an excavating contractor and see what his preferences are.

 

[dozerdan]

Russ
You really don't use any more concrete with the stone forms. If you did a footer with a hoe, you use an 18" or a 24" bucket. If you dig the stones out by hand, you can end up with about 12"-14" at the bottom and at the top its still less then 24". Its also nice to be able to move your footer a few inches after its dug.
Their seems to be no set pattern on how the contractors pour the concrete. Some of them will mix it that thin that it will flow out level, others have it mixed stiff and just walk along with a transit stick and rake it in place.
Superior Precast Wall
I know them well, I have helped set many and they are poured about 10 mile from my house. I have also toured the plant. Look at any of them above a basement door and tell me if its cracked. I have never seen one that didn't. I never saw one that leaked water or had a wall collapse but they all seem to crack.
Later
Dan

 

[jokers]

Hi Dan,

Figured that you would be familiar with Superior, they have a very nice system.

I`ve never met a Codes Enforcement Officer(CEO) that wasn`t a stickler for undisturbed soil under a footer and footers that have vertical walls all the way to the undisturbed soil. Even if you use stone in an overdig, it has to be compacted, preferably with a plate compactor.

Neat and orderliness in appearance is also a big thing if you don`t want undue scrutiny. I don`t think that mixing it wet and letting it flow out wouldn`t fly too far in this area, it also affects final strength, but of course you know that. It could be very judiciously vibrated. Mixing it stiff and hitting it with a grade rod and transit or laser to get elevation is what we call wet screeding, pretty common on wide pours. Then we cut expansion joints with a CHAINSAW while it`s still green, just kidding about the chainsaw of course.

It`s always interesting to hear how other people are doing things.

Russ

 

[Lawn Masters]

Did you know that there actually is a chainsaw that is made for cutting concrete? ICS makes it there are at least 2 models with gas engines and many more with hydraulic power. Theyre pretty cool saws to look at but probably even more fun to use. I'll look around and get a link for y'all to visit.

 

[glens]

For cutting concrete with a chainsaw, there's at least <a href="http://www.cuttersedge.com/products/concrete.html">Cutters Edge</a>.

I will use nothing but formed footings for anything I do fancier than a pole barn.&nbsp; Crawl space or basement, no difference, excavate everything to bottom of footer grade and fully form them.&nbsp; Most places I'm familiar with require drain tiles both <i>sides</i> of the footing with at least the inner one going to a sump, anyway.

I do okay with some heavy equipment but a few of my friends can put me to shame many times over, yet nobody I've ever known could trench (residential or better) footings well enough to satisfy me.&nbsp; They always end up deep or wide or slightly askew or any combination and need handwork to get the crumbs out.&nbsp; Then they're a b<i></i>itch to lay block on (in) and no matter how careful you are there's always too much variation in height on the finished surface, even if you do make the concrete sloppy enough to flow and have no strength.&nbsp; Not to mention all the clods knocked in while placing the concrete.&nbsp; I'd rather invest the little bit of trouble and time on the forms than all the other stuff that eats into productivity <i>far</i> more in the log run.

As to the lot clearing, assuming it's not the entire lot being cleared, I'd say drop the ones around the perimeter by hand, either cut the stumps low and grind them (first choice) or leave them a few feet tall for a little something to knock around.&nbsp; The trees in the middle, push them over whole with equipment or leave the stumps a few feet tall.&nbsp; If you're going to harvest any lumber or firewood, you might want to do it beforehand if you've got the time.&nbsp; I personally hate dealing with firewood logs that were dragged, rolled, and pushed around by heavy equipment.&nbsp; It takes all the fun out of it.

Glen

 

[Lawn Masters]

The saws I'm thinking of are made by ICS who is owned by Blount. http://www.icsbestway.com/en/index.asp Theres a link to the site. Its all concrete cutting chainsaws some hydraulic and some gas models.

 

[dozerdan]

Russ
When they dig the stones to pour the footers, they do dig down to the undisturbed soil, if you want to call it soil, its more like solid rock.
Up until this month we had no one like a
Codes Enforcement Officer(CEO). This month we have some new laws that will take affect and all construction will have to be inspected. As of last month, the only thing that had to be inspected was your septic system, unless you had a public sewer system. The only other thing that was inspected was if you ran an under ground power line. The power company would inspect that before you could cover it.
We had no building, plumbing or electrical inspectors.
Poured concrete walls are far more durable then the Superior walls but also cost more. Yes we have poured walls setting on the type of footers that I talked about earlier, never had a problem yet.
Later
Dan

 

[ehp]

You should come up here and build , just the permits to build a house is $6500. Then you have to pay to have them come out to look your place over and it does not matter what you do , every part of you house has to be looked at , we have so many people looking over your shoulder it is hard to do anything