Kensterfly
ArboristSite Operative
I recently wrote to Troy-Bilt, asking what the latest status was on the reported cylinder blow outs on the 27 ton splitter.
(see this thread: http://www.arboristsite.com/firewood-heating-wood-burning-equipment/174531.htm
Unfortunately, it appears that all the archives have been lost in the server upgrade. I was hoping to also include links to the many discussions on this site regarding this topic.
Following is their reply to my first inquiry, my response to their reply, and finally, their reply to my reply. (got all that?)
Response (Andrew H.) 06/15/2011 02:37 PM
I looked for complaints about the cylinder and could find nothing specific on this. We did recently have a recall due to some issues with a control valve brand we were using that did not allow the splitter head to return properly but in my 11 years with the company there have not been any manufacturing issues with the cylinder.
Customer (Ken Thompson) 06/20/2011 07:41 PM
Denying that there is a problem does not make the problem go away. There are hundreds of posts about cylinder/weld/trunion failures on various websites that deal with logging, firewood, etc. What is particularly disturbing is the lack of Customer Service or even Customer Care in this matter. Many people have openly stated that after reading about this design fault and lack of any attempt to acknowledge it or fix it has helped them in making their decision as to which splitter to purchase. Basically it will be anything but an MTD manufactured splitter. SpeeCo is highly noted for their customer care and service. They even regularly monitor the websites and take part in the discussions of their products.
I am posting just one thread (of many) that has well over 100 posts on it regarding Troy-Bilt Splitters. Andrew tells me that there have been no complaints. That is obviously not true as copies of the complaints AND T-Bs responses are posted in the thread. MTD/TB keeps looking at this problem as a warranty issue. While one of these failures occurred in just over a year after service, others happened after 4-6 years of service. It is not a warranty issue but it IS a safety issue when you have pints of very hot hydraulic fluid erupt into your face and eyes because a metal cylinder under high pressure literally bursts open doing exactly what it was designed to do, split wood.
********** | Wood Stoves, Fireplace, Pellet Stoves, Gas Stoves and More - Forums!
In this thread, even an employee of the company that supplies the cylinders says that the engineers at his company warned you that you have a bad design and suggested changes to make the cylinders stronger and to change from a trunion mount but that MTD refused to follow this advise due to cost factors. When it becomes public that MTD refused to follow engineers warnings on a safety issue, it's going to hit the fan. People are already filing complaints with the Consumer Protection Bureau and with state legislators.
There are no warranty periods for safety issues. Automobiles are recalled all the time out of warranty because of design flaws that compromise safety.
Troy Built and Cub Cadet used to be considered top of the line products. Since MTD began to manufacture them, they are basically considered inferior to everything else. Quality has dropped exponentially in order to sell your products cheaper. That is understandable to a degree but safety should NEVER be compromised.
Your motto "Built To Last" is now considered a joke. As in "Built to Last (until you get it home and take it out of the box.")
I seriously had my heart set on a 27 ton Cub Cadet. In one of the posts on the above thread someone indicated that there has been a beefing up of the welds around the trunions. That would appear that someone actually saw that there was indeed a problem and an attempt was made to make this weakness stronger, though it remains a bad design.
I realize that this failure may occur on a very small percentage of your splitters but the fact that you refuse to acknowledge that it happens at all, when it is well documented, is very disturbing.
Please try to convince me that I can safely buy and use your product with the expectation that it will be useful to me for many years.
I would hope that you will pass this on to a higher, management level.
Response (Andrew H.) 06/21/2011 09:18 AM
Thank you for the link to this information. I read through several pages and could only find two people complaining of the failures but with this information I will turn it over for inspection. I will also notify the appropriate departments that a gentleman is claiming to have worked for a company that built splitters for us to put an engine on. This equipment has been manufactured by MTD at our Tennessee plant.
As with any used equipment you are looking at I would have the equipment thoroughly evaluated by an authorized service center before operation. Any type of hydraulically operated equipment needs to be kept within specific tolerances. Loose connections and improper installation can result in catastrophic failures.
(see this thread: http://www.arboristsite.com/firewood-heating-wood-burning-equipment/174531.htm
Unfortunately, it appears that all the archives have been lost in the server upgrade. I was hoping to also include links to the many discussions on this site regarding this topic.
Following is their reply to my first inquiry, my response to their reply, and finally, their reply to my reply. (got all that?)
Response (Andrew H.) 06/15/2011 02:37 PM
I looked for complaints about the cylinder and could find nothing specific on this. We did recently have a recall due to some issues with a control valve brand we were using that did not allow the splitter head to return properly but in my 11 years with the company there have not been any manufacturing issues with the cylinder.
Customer (Ken Thompson) 06/20/2011 07:41 PM
Denying that there is a problem does not make the problem go away. There are hundreds of posts about cylinder/weld/trunion failures on various websites that deal with logging, firewood, etc. What is particularly disturbing is the lack of Customer Service or even Customer Care in this matter. Many people have openly stated that after reading about this design fault and lack of any attempt to acknowledge it or fix it has helped them in making their decision as to which splitter to purchase. Basically it will be anything but an MTD manufactured splitter. SpeeCo is highly noted for their customer care and service. They even regularly monitor the websites and take part in the discussions of their products.
I am posting just one thread (of many) that has well over 100 posts on it regarding Troy-Bilt Splitters. Andrew tells me that there have been no complaints. That is obviously not true as copies of the complaints AND T-Bs responses are posted in the thread. MTD/TB keeps looking at this problem as a warranty issue. While one of these failures occurred in just over a year after service, others happened after 4-6 years of service. It is not a warranty issue but it IS a safety issue when you have pints of very hot hydraulic fluid erupt into your face and eyes because a metal cylinder under high pressure literally bursts open doing exactly what it was designed to do, split wood.
********** | Wood Stoves, Fireplace, Pellet Stoves, Gas Stoves and More - Forums!
In this thread, even an employee of the company that supplies the cylinders says that the engineers at his company warned you that you have a bad design and suggested changes to make the cylinders stronger and to change from a trunion mount but that MTD refused to follow this advise due to cost factors. When it becomes public that MTD refused to follow engineers warnings on a safety issue, it's going to hit the fan. People are already filing complaints with the Consumer Protection Bureau and with state legislators.
There are no warranty periods for safety issues. Automobiles are recalled all the time out of warranty because of design flaws that compromise safety.
Troy Built and Cub Cadet used to be considered top of the line products. Since MTD began to manufacture them, they are basically considered inferior to everything else. Quality has dropped exponentially in order to sell your products cheaper. That is understandable to a degree but safety should NEVER be compromised.
Your motto "Built To Last" is now considered a joke. As in "Built to Last (until you get it home and take it out of the box.")
I seriously had my heart set on a 27 ton Cub Cadet. In one of the posts on the above thread someone indicated that there has been a beefing up of the welds around the trunions. That would appear that someone actually saw that there was indeed a problem and an attempt was made to make this weakness stronger, though it remains a bad design.
I realize that this failure may occur on a very small percentage of your splitters but the fact that you refuse to acknowledge that it happens at all, when it is well documented, is very disturbing.
Please try to convince me that I can safely buy and use your product with the expectation that it will be useful to me for many years.
I would hope that you will pass this on to a higher, management level.
Response (Andrew H.) 06/21/2011 09:18 AM
Thank you for the link to this information. I read through several pages and could only find two people complaining of the failures but with this information I will turn it over for inspection. I will also notify the appropriate departments that a gentleman is claiming to have worked for a company that built splitters for us to put an engine on. This equipment has been manufactured by MTD at our Tennessee plant.
As with any used equipment you are looking at I would have the equipment thoroughly evaluated by an authorized service center before operation. Any type of hydraulically operated equipment needs to be kept within specific tolerances. Loose connections and improper installation can result in catastrophic failures.
