Questions from a new guy

[redheadwoodshed]

Hello AS, I just sent off to the state for my arborist study guide so I can get my licsense.
In order to legally advertise or take money for tree service in LA. you must be licesensed, insured, and have a written contract.This I am working on.My main question is about priceing.
Can I get some examples of jobs and how you guys priced them?

 

[redheadwoodshed]

O.K. a hypothetical example.A pin oak about 30" dbh,tall and straight, but lightening struck and dying.A fence on one side, house on one side and power lines on the other side.No issues as far as a bad lean or anything it would fall in the clear fairly easy or with just a little pull to be on the safe side.
The homeowner wants the tree felled and bucked for firewood so no cleanup involved.What would be a fair price according to the pros here.
Again this is hypothetical so no pictures are available.Just looking for advise.Thanks.

 

[jefflovstrom]

First, learn to sell ' License'.
Second, are you serious?
Jeff :msp_ohmy:

 

[jefflovstrom]

No clean-up what so ever, right. No target's. What you got? Climbing or bucket? How big a crew? How long? What is your man hour rate? Not much to say without knowing.
Jeff :msp_confused:

 

[Kottonwood]

First, learn to sell ' License'.
Second, are you serious?
Jeff :msp_ohmy:

haha a typo for a typo


The key is to figure out how long it is going to take you to do the job. I bid 40 per man hour for ground crew and 50 for climbers (including myself). You have to figure what your hour rate is. Basically at the end of the day after workers comp, liability, taxes, unemployment etc what your are actually paying your guys costs about double. For instance someone making 15 an hour costs you 30. So if you bid properly you make enough money to profit a little off of each guy. Don't forget to factor in how long it is going to take you to get there, how much mulch you will produce and have to get rid of etc etc. Where you really make your money is by working yourself, because that is almost a real 50 dollars an hour in your pocket. Sometimes that is the only profit I make on a job.

Also be careful about underbidding how long cleanup takes. I still underbid the crap out of jobs all the time, especially removals. I think to myself "easy day, I'll have the tree on the ground in two hours" then we spend the rest of the day cleaning up the mess. Even if you are leaving the firewood, moving big cookies can still take a while if you don't have equipment, or you may spend a lot of time cutting the wood down into small pieces just to move it.

 

[jefflovstrom]

haha a typo for a typo


The key is to figure out how long it is going to take you to do the job. I bid 40 per man hour for ground crew and 50 for climbers (including myself). You have to figure what your hour rate is. Basically at the end of the day after workers comp, liability, taxes, unemployment etc what your are actually paying your guys costs about double. For instance someone making 15 an hour costs you 30. So if you bid properly you make enough money to profit a little off of each guy. Don't forget to factor in how long it is going to take you to get there, how much mulch you will produce and have to get rid of etc etc. Where you really make your money is by working yourself, because that is almost a real 50 dollars an hour in your pocket. Sometimes that is the only profit I make on a job.

Also be careful about underbidding how long cleanup takes. I still underbid the crap out of jobs all the time, especially removals. I think to myself "easy day, I'll have the tree on the ground in two hours" then we spend the rest of the day cleaning up the mess. Even if you are leaving the firewood, moving big cookies can still take a while if you don't have equipment, or you may spend a lot of time cutting the wood down into small pieces just to move it.

Hahaha! Got it--spell
Jeff :hmm3grin2orange:

 

[redheadwoodshed]

First, learn to sell ' License'.
Second, are you serious?
Jeff :msp_ohmy:

Yes, I'm serious...and thanks for the SPELLING lesson.
I thought that's what this forum was for, people like me with no experience in this field to ask people like you, that has experience.
I've been a welder for over 20 years now and if you have any questions about welding, feel free to ask, maybe I can help you.

 

[redheadwoodshed]

haha a typo for a typo


The key is to figure out how long it is going to take you to do the job. I bid 40 per man hour for ground crew and 50 for climbers (including myself). You have to figure what your hour rate is. Basically at the end of the day after workers comp, liability, taxes, unemployment etc what your are actually paying your guys costs about double. For instance someone making 15 an hour costs you 30. So if you bid properly you make enough money to profit a little off of each guy. Don't forget to factor in how long it is going to take you to get there, how much mulch you will produce and have to get rid of etc etc. Where you really make your money is by working yourself, because that is almost a real 50 dollars an hour in your pocket. Sometimes that is the only profit I make on a job.

Also be careful about underbidding how long cleanup takes. I still underbid the crap out of jobs all the time, especially removals. I think to myself "easy day, I'll have the tree on the ground in two hours" then we spend the rest of the day cleaning up the mess. Even if you are leaving the firewood, moving big cookies can still take a while if you don't have equipment, or you may spend a lot of time cutting the wood down into small pieces just to move it.

Thank you very much, this is the kind of info that will be helpful, thank you.

 

[jefflovstrom]

Yes, I'm serious...and thanks for the SPELLING lesson.
I thought that's what this forum was for, people like me with no experience in this field to ask people like you, that has experience.
I've been a welder for over 20 years now and if you have any questions about welding, feel free to ask, maybe I can help you.

It is and I am just checking how serious you are. Send or post pic's if you want help. I hope you stay around and build on your tough skin!
Jeff :msp_smile:

 

[redheadwoodshed]

No clean-up what so ever, right. No target's. What you got? Climbing or bucket? How big a crew? How long? What is your man hour rate? Not much to say without knowing.
Jeff :msp_confused:

No clean up, cut down a tree and cut it up to about 20" pieces.One side of the property wide open, no need to climb, no need for a bucket.Take maybe 4 hours.

 

[jefflovstrom]

No clean up, cut down a tree and cut it up to about 20" pieces.One side of the property wide open, no need to climb, no need for a bucket.Take maybe 4 hours.

So you want a number? How about $700.00
Jeff

 

[redheadwoodshed]

It is and I am just checking how serious you are. Send or post pic's if you want help. I hope you stay around and build on your tough skin!
Jeff :msp_smile:

If I had any pics I would have sent but as I stated this is hypothetical.Just need to get some ideas about the way these jobs are priced.

 

[redheadwoodshed]

So you want a number? How about $700.00
Jeff

$700 sounds good to me. Do people actually pay that much?

 

[jefflovstrom]

Yup!
Jeff

 

[flushcut]

For WI 700 is a bit high for a cut and run but out by you you're golden, but then again I am not seeing your tree so I can't really say what is fair. I would also get some experience working with somebody before you just go off on your own and start tugging trees over.

 

[jefflovstrom]

True, If it is just one guy, 4 hours would be about $100 per hour.
Jeff

 

[flushcut]

I like to be right around 65/80 an man hour.

 

[redheadwoodshed]

Thanks Jeff, thanks Flushcut.
I have worked for loggers falling before, but I would like to work with a tree service and get some experience working close to houses and power lines and such.I had planned on talking to a tree service in a city near where I live.I work a 21-21 rotation so I would have time to work part time with them on my days off.
I'm really just getting started, but I think there is room for one more around where I live.I have talked to one guy who has a tree service and he tells me he has been turning work down because he doesn't have time to do it all. Again thanks for the advise.

 

[pbtree]

...

Also be careful about underbidding how long cleanup takes. ...

Man o man is that good advice - I have made the mistake of underestimating the clean up more than anything else. It really starts to hurt when you are 4 hours into a clean up you thought would only take two!

 

[rarefish383]

$85 per M/H in the Wash DC area, and plenty of work. I guess because you said you were getting licensed and insured the guys took a liking to you. In most cases of guys trying to make the jump from one occupation to tree work you get taken to task pretty hard. I've found tree work to be as much of a life style as a job. Once you get into it you live and breath it. I'm 4th generation (retired) and you see I still hang out here. The only advice I'm giving out today is tree work is one of the most deadly jobs you can pick. Few people survive a fall over 30 or 40 feet. A saw dropped 30 or 40 feet makes you dead too, if you're the one it lands on, touch the wrong wire, dead. In the fatality thread a climber hooked himself in the leg and bled out before they could get him down, dead. If you don't know what I mean by hooked, you'll learn. There is an awairness level that 99% of the people out there just can not comprehend. They say I know, I know, I'll be carefull, and they do not have a clue about what carefull is. You have to know what's going on around you 360*, and over you, every second of every minute all day long. The first time you let up you WILL get bit.Good luck and keep us posted as to how things go for you, Joe.