Sawing with bottom vs top of bar

[danthe]

Hi,

I'm a paper pusher in my day job but I do enjoy being a gentleman woodman whenever I have some free time. I have been cutting and chopping 5-6 cords per year for heating our home for over 30 years. Up until two years ago, I hand split my firewood each years except when I did rent a splitter 6 time when I was running late in thee season. At 55 I bought myself a small 15 ton splitter as splitting was starting to be pain in my shoulder and upper back. My wife being a physiotherapist...it was an easy sell

I took a basic welding course a few years back and I've been doing welding project with a small 90 A flux core welder. I will be moving up to a larger machine, 200 A stick unit. I've started gathering all type of steel bar, channel etc with the intention of building myself a small chainsaw mill...either a Norwood portamill or procut type rail mill.

Now for my question:

I do understand some of the physics of using the bottom of the bar and leveraging the weight of the chainsaw for cutting and limbing. But I'm trying to figure out why when sawing on horizontal rail if using the top of the bar would be better. The 2 reasons would be 1- spit the sawdust away from the operator and 2- the top of the bar is freshly lubed so would this be an advantage. I would be using using a remote throttle cable so ergonomic of working the gas feeder would not be an issue.

OK don't be too hard on me for issue I may not comprehend in using the bottom of the bar.

Thanks for your responses.

Danthe

 

[BobL]

I do understand some of the physics of using the bottom of the bar and leveraging the weight of the chainsaw for cutting and limbing. But I'm trying to figure out why when sawing on horizontal rail if using the top of the bar would be better. The 2 reasons would be 1- spit the sawdust away from the operator and 2- the top of the bar is freshly lubed so would this be an advantage. I would be using using a remote throttle cable so ergonomic of working the gas feeder would not be an issue.

No reason at all all long as both saw and log can be held firmly as the log will be pushed away from the saw and VV.

On my mini-rail mill (which can be used in any orientation) this is usually what I do


BTW It does not spit all the sawdust away from the saw and an annoying amount still comes the usual side.

 

[Brian72]

No reason at all all long as both saw and log can be held firmly as the log will be pushed away from the saw and VV.

On my mini-rail mill (which can be used in any orientation) this is usually what I do
View attachment 688297 View attachment 688296

BTW It does not spit all the sawdust away from the saw and an annoying amount still comes the usual side.

That's a nice setup Bob! Hope you're feeling better!!

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[Brian72]

With the type of mills you're looking at, the saw is mounted very solid to the framing of the mill so it wouldn't be a problem. With an Alaskan mill it's a little different but still can be done easily. Oiling really isn't an issue unless you're running longer bars but an auxiliary oiler fixes that problem. No matter direction, you're gonna get dirty! Lol. One thing to consider is refueling. If you cut with the top of the bar, you'll have to remove the saw to gas up. There really is no right or wrong answer. Much is personal preference.

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[danthe]

On my mini-rail mill (which can be used in any orientation) this is usually what I do
View attachment 688297 View attachment 688296

Thanks BobL, I've followed so many of your post and response. I'm very flatten to have you response.

I do have a welder...a hand drill...a set of screwdrivers and very very limited fabrication knowledge LOL ...compared to a Master.

If I may, so using either top and bottom of the bar should permit back and forth sawing...a process that does not appear to be used by many if any?

Thanks

Danthe

 

[danthe]

[QUOTE="Brian72, post: 6736426, member: 143974" One thing to consider is refueling. If you cut with the top of the bar, you'll have to remove the saw to gas up. There really is no right or wrong answer. Much is personal preference.

Thanks for the responce. I'm not quite sure why fueling would be a issue. Basically for most of the horizontal rail mill I've seen, just sawing backward to what most people do would not change in any way access to the fuel tank. On many sawmill just transferring the push handle from one side to the other would use the top of the blade for sawing...I will consider a push handle on both side...why not?

Danthe

 

[BobL]

With the type of mills you're looking at, the saw is mounted very solid to the framing of the mill so it wouldn't be a problem. With an Alaskan mill it's a little different but still can be done easily. Oiling really isn't an issue unless you're running longer bars but an auxiliary oiler fixes that problem. No matter direction, you're gonna get dirty! Lol. One thing to consider is refueling. If you cut with the top of the bar, you'll have to remove the saw to gas up.

There's no need to rotate the saw if you are prepared to pull it through the cut, or push from the other side, or use a winch. I've tried it with an Alaskan and found it very awkward and tiring because the mill wants to continually pull away from the log and with a long bar on a narrow log this unbalanced the mill and that leads to complications. I found I had to use a lot of energy just to continually hold the mill in balance and after one face cut I was stuffed.

Anyway, the OP is referring to a horizontal rail mill whereby the saw is firmly held to the mill structure.

 

[BobL]

On my mini-rail mill (which can be used in any orientation) this is usually what I do
View attachment 688297 View attachment 688296
Thanks BobL, I've followed so many of your post and response. I'm very flatten to have you response.

Flattened? I assume you perhaps meant something else?
Sometimes thing go quite on some other forums I hang out on so I drift across to here to see what's going on.

I do have a welder...a hand drill...a set of screwdrivers and very very limited fabrication knowledge LOL ...compared to a Master.

Smoke and mirrors and selective photography can hide a multitude of fab sins.

If I may, so using either top and bottom of the bar should permit back and forth sawing...a process that does not appear to be used by many if any?

As I suggested above there are a few other reasons why back and forth is not done - eg
When you stand on the other side you will still get covered in sawdust, A deflection shield can be used to reduce this.
The throttle and wrap handle (which is handy to lean) on are not easily accessible.
I also reckon a sloped log makes things much easier even on a rail mill, and cutting back and forth on a slope means you would be pushing uphill every other pass.
It takes all of 5 seconds to roll the mill back to the start

 

[Brian72]

[QUOTE="Brian72, post: 6736426, member: 143974" One thing to consider is refueling. If you cut with the top of the bar, you'll have to remove the saw to gas up. There really is no right or wrong answer. Much is personal preference.

Thanks for the responce. I'm not quite sure why fueling would be a issue. Basically for most of the horizontal rail mill I've seen, just sawing backward to what most people do would not change in any way access to the fuel tank. On many sawmill just transferring the push handle from one side to the other would use the top of the blade for sawing...I will consider a push handle on both side...why not?

Danthe

You're right. I apologize. Just having a brain fart this morning. Lol. Guess I need to get more coffee in me.

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[BobL]

Coffee solves a lot of probs for me too.