Spiderjack question

[sir_nick2]

Hi just got a spiderjack 2 for xmas knowing full well that a eye splice is recomended to connect your rope through to the biner, I tried the 2 biner and sling method but wasn't overly convinced. Before i got the SJ i was on a hitch climber system using an anchor bend as my termination knot so I tried it with the SJ, its pretty low profile and looks like it may work what do you guys think? I know the anchor bend needs a knot in the tail end the pics are purely for an example
Nick

 

[2treeornot2tree]

Hi just got a spiderjack 2 for xmas knowing full well that a eye splice is recomended to connect your rope through to the biner, I tried the 2 biner and sling method but wasn't overly convinced. Before i got the SJ i was on a hitch climber system using an anchor bend as my termination knot so I tried it with the SJ, its pretty low profile and looks like it may work what do you guys think? I know the anchor bend needs a knot in the tail end the pics are purely for an example
Nick

All I can say is I am glad I got the lock jack. Dont have to be messing around with knots, and I can connect it midline.

 

[imagineero]

splicing your own eyes isn't as difficult as you might think. You dont need any special tools - most pro splicers use their own pullers made of piano wire rather than fids. I do my own splices with stuff you've probably already got at home, a coat hanger as a puller, some tape to seal off ends of ropes, a marker. The only thing you might need to buy is a big sail sewing needle from a chandler and some heavy duty whipping twine (about $3 all up).

Buy 10m of your favourite rope or use some of your old stuff. Expect to mess the first one up. Test your first good one. Test each one you make. Once you learn it you'll wonder why you waited so long. Spliced eyes are awesome, and stronger than any knot. You can get the splicing instructions form the rope manufacturers website, and there are many excellent video tutorials on youtube as well as some on manufacturers websites.

Here are some I did earlier this year together with my testing regime;

http://www.arboristsite.com/commercial-tree-care-climbing/177590.htm


Please do some vids of yourself using the spyderjack, there are hardly any vids of the nuts and bolts of them out there, or any good reviews. They're big $$$ in aus, and I cant bring msyelf to spend that kind of coin without a test or seeing someone elses good review. From what I can tell they look like they give excellent control on descent/payout on limbwalking. Great for returning from limbwalking, but how are they on a freehanging ascent? You cant footlock with them?

Shaun

 

[sir_nick2]

Please do some vids of yourself using the spyderjack, there are hardly any vids of the nuts and bolts of them out there, or any good reviews. They're big $$$ in aus, and I cant bring msyelf to spend that kind of coin without a test or seeing someone elses good review. From what I can tell they look like they give excellent control on descent/payout on limbwalking. Great for returning from limbwalking, but how are they on a freehanging ascent? You cant footlock with them?

Shaun

I'm from aus i just went through honey bros. 5 days to my door for under $300 and that was over xmas, i can splice double braid and have the tools but neither the time or patience, i put an eye in a length of donaghys 11mm i had it was good but i still like knots, i took it out for its first spin today my system usually is a hand ascender on a tether with a hitch climber vt on my bridge and a foot ascender on my left foot i set my line and ascend Ddrt both hands on the ascender left foot ascending and right foot just keeping me out from the tree but to day i switched the hitch climber for the SJ and i found that with tension on the foot ascender the SJ didn't grab so i just went hand over hand and as long as you feed the rope straight into the SJ it tends and grabs nice it was mainly up and down today i'll get out again tomorrow and have a play, the whole finger/thumb friction control is gonna take some getting used to lol
Nick

 

[imagineero]

Are you nick up on the north shore who started out with Jamie Abbot? If not, whereabouts are you at?

Good tip on honey bros!

Thats what I was worried about with the spyderjack... looks great when you're on spikes, limbwalking, and awesome on descent once you get the hang of it, but for freehanging ascent it looks like it suits smaller guys. I'm 110kg, and use DRT most of the time with a hitch. On freehanging ascents I'm too heavy to arm myself up, even if I hump air all the way. I usually use one arm on the hitch, and one below, then footlock and pull down with both arms at once and slide the hitch up. No setback, and pretty quick and easy.

On big trees (30m) I go back to SRT.

I'd still love to see some vids of spyderjack action by common tree climbers, not world championship winners.

Shaun

 

[sir_nick2]

Thats what I was worried about with the spyderjack... looks great when you're on spikes, limbwalking, and awesome on descent once you get the hang of it, but for freehanging ascent it looks like it suits smaller guys. I'm 110kg, and use DRT most of the time with a hitch. On freehanging ascents I'm too heavy to arm myself up, even if I hump air all the way. I usually use one arm on the hitch, and one below, then footlock and pull down with both arms at once and slide the hitch up. No setback, and pretty quick and easy.

On big trees (30m) I go back to SRT.

I'd still love to see some vids of spyderjack action by common tree climbers, not world championship winners.

Shaun

No i'm nick on the central coast nsw lol. I'm a 110kg climber aswell prob a bit more after xmas lol, footlocking the tail Ddrt would probably work since once the lock and push up is complete the tail end is completely free hanging while up bring your legs back up for the next lock but i found with the foot ascender hand ascender combo if i was holding the rope with either device the SJ wouldn't seem to grab but you have to remember today was my first half hour or so on it give me a few weeks to really sort it then i may have figured out. If you have watched the spiderjackery clips on youtube (if you haven't do yourself a favor) and you'll see in the third one how he footlocks drt to where he wants to work then he self tails the SJ up to himself from the ground, really cool i thought.

 

[imagineero]

Ah well...

If you're in sydney and have a spare hour feel free to drop buy and I'll splice your ropes up for you. You can bet your life on it ;-) I'll throw a coffee in there too.

I've seen the spyderjackery vids, but as you probably know they were done by Joe Harris who very nearly won the ITCC comps in aus this year. He missed out by half a point. I wouldnt call this guy an 'average every day tree climber' though. I'm more interested in how the device works for every day guys. World champion climbers can probably use any wet rag as an ascender and out climb me.

Shaun

 

[sir_nick2]

Wow, the amount of searching i did to try an find a splicer around me before i eventually ended up just learning to do it myself. Lol, you also may be on to something "the new ART wet rag"..... Hmmmm i have high hopes in the SJ at the moment i do like my hitchclimber setup with a 4 wrap 3 tresse vt config using amour prus but also having tried a unicender and lockjack neither of which i thought were much chop. With the SJ self tending seems great and the no sit back you get from a hitch is good to. The main reason i thought the SJ may work for me is the ability to release ALL friction just by using the bottom lever a feature i liked when i had a brief 3 weeks or so climbing Ddrt on a shunt, being able to release everything with it for a limb walk was great, but putting to much weight on it just to decend with its either on or off grab was no good too many rope burned hands lol

 

[sir_nick2]

Ok, gave the SJ another run today, shot a line maybe 15m srt up, lanyarded in and set up the SJ Ddrt terminated it with the anchor bend and had another swing on it. It's a great bit of kit controlled descents are easy and either hand over hand or 2 hands on my hand ascender to ascend is quite easy. The anchor bend seemed ilke it worked well i kept a close eye on it whilst swinging around to make sure it didn't interfere with the SJ but all looked good it doesn't really touch the device at all with the piece of rubber hose installed. I still haven't figured out how to use a foot ascender properly with it yet maybe cause it feels like it won't grab after a push with the foot or i'm just not trusting it enough i don't know. I was also wondering how to leave it on the line then do a srt ascent and have it ready for me at the TIP and thought if i set my line cinched around limb with the SJ on the ground and a stopper knot underneth it so i can just haul it up, set it up Ddrt and off i go, i may give that a go tomorrow
Nick

 

[the Aerialist]

SpiderJack with Screamer attached ...

I use a set pole 99% of the time, so I reset my TIP often as I work myself up to where I want my final TIP to be. One of the hassles with the SpiderJack as opposed to the LockJack is the velcro attachment that must be undone and redone each time to reposition your TIP.

To make it easier to attach, I bought a Yates "screamer" - an energy absorption device, gear borrowed from rock climbers who may take a fall onto their safety line and want to reduce the shock load of such a catch. In tree climbing I don't think this is such an issue, but we do use static rope which will even give you a harder stop at the end if you fall very far, than the dynamic rope rockers use.

Anyway, if I do take a fall, this setup will reduce the jolt of my rope catching up to me:

The main advantage of using the screamer with the SpiderJack is quicker, more consistent hook ups. It also helps prevent me from grabbing the wrong side of the rope while ascending.

As far as foot locking or pantin use with either the SJ or LJ, using the tail of the rope like that will straighten the path of the rope through either device, which is the same as activating the release cam to straighten the rope path and descend.

I use a Kong double handled ascender with a Revolver roller equipped 'biner in case I want some mechanical advantage. You can foot lock or use a pantin with this setup but most times I don't bother, arm strength and body thrusting is usually enough to get me where I need to go.

 

[treeclimber101]

Well there goes another thread lost to the dopetard

 

[2treeornot2tree]

I use a set pole 99% of the time, so I reset my TIP often as I work myself up to where I want my final TIP to be. One of the hassles with the SpiderJack as opposed to the LockJack is the velcro attachment that must be undone and redone each time to reposition your TIP.

To make it easier to attach, I bought a Yates "screamer" - an energy absorption device, gear borrowed from rock climbers who may take a fall onto their safety line and want to reduce the shock load of such a catch. In tree climbing I don't think this is such an issue, but we do use static rope which will even give you a harder stop at the end if you fall very far, than the dynamic rope rockers use.

Anyway, if I do take a fall, this setup will reduce the jolt of my rope catching up to me:

The main advantage of using the screamer with the SpiderJack is quicker, more consistent hook ups. It also helps prevent me from grabbing the wrong side of the rope while ascending.

As far as foot locking or pantin use with either the SJ or LJ, using the tail of the rope like that will straighten the path of the rope through either device, which is the same as activating the release cam to straighten the rope path and descend.

I use a Kong double handled ascender with a Revolver roller equipped 'biner in case I want some mechanical advantage. You can foot lock or use a pantin with this setup but most times I don't bother, arm strength and body thrusting is usually enough to get me where I need to go.

I dont know how well that screamer would work for you in a drt setup. They are ment to be used when you are using trad gear climbing, and the anchors might not be super bomb proof. Its good to think outside of the box, but maybe you should just tape yourself in the box.

 

[the Aerialist]

It's not the fall ~ It's the sudden stop ...

I dont know how well that screamer would work for you in a drt setup. They are ment to be used when you are using trad gear climbing, and the anchors might not be super bomb proof. Its good to think outside of the box, but maybe you should just tape yourself in the box.

Point is: it made the SJ quicker to get on and off line, something I do frequently in my style of climbing. You'd probably have to take a 10' fall to activate it, and I can't imagine having that much slack in my overhead line. Branch failure maybe, but most times that would mean the ground would be what stops you, not the rope.

 

[sir_nick2]

Yeah I was using the same kind of thing but a soft link instead but i found it wasn't really long enough to keep the biner away from my hands and ascender when i was pulling myself up, I advance my TIP by unclipping and throwing higher too now i'll just have to see how long it takes for me to get sick of untieing and retieing whilst advancing lol

 

[Scrat]

I use a set pole 99% of the time, so I reset my TIP often as I work myself up to where I want my final TIP to be. One of the hassles with the SpiderJack as opposed to the LockJack is the velcro attachment that must be undone and redone each time to reposition your TIP.

To make it easier to attach, I bought a Yates "screamer" - an energy absorption device, gear borrowed from rock climbers who may take a fall onto their safety line and want to reduce the shock load of such a catch. In tree climbing I don't think this is such an issue, but we do use static rope which will even give you a harder stop at the end if you fall very far, than the dynamic rope rockers use.

Anyway, if I do take a fall, this setup will reduce the jolt of my rope catching up to me:

The main advantage of using the screamer with the SpiderJack is quicker, more consistent hook ups. It also helps prevent me from grabbing the wrong side of the rope while ascending.

As far as foot locking or pantin use with either the SJ or LJ, using the tail of the rope like that will straighten the path of the rope through either device, which is the same as activating the release cam to straighten the rope path and descend.

I use a Kong double handled ascender with a Revolver roller equipped 'biner in case I want some mechanical advantage. You can foot lock or use a pantin with this setup but most times I don't bother, arm strength and body thrusting is usually enough to get me where I need to go.

AA,
I would like to know what that screw going through the screamer that appears to be threaded into the side of the SJ body where the screw that normally secures the velcro to the SJ is doing or is it an illusion due to picture angle? I would not modify a life safety device in a way that could end potentially disastrous.

Also the thickness of the Yates Screamer appears to be substantially thicker than a spliced eye or loop runner and looks like it would inhibit using the SJ with the left hand. In this business it is an asset to be ambidextrous due to situationally dictated needs. I have been using a spliced eye on my rope and to be honest the time it takes to undue or redo the velcro - (2 seconds) is really NOT troublesome. Maybe if you are Joe Harris's climbing equal and need to beat him by a few hundreths of a second at a world class compitition!

 

[mattfr12]

AA,
I would like to know what that screw going through the screamer that appears to be threaded into the side of the SJ body where the screw that normally secures the velcro to the SJ is doing or is it an illusion due to picture angle? I would not modify a life safety device in a way that could end potentially disastrous.

Also the thickness of the Yates Screamer appears to be substantially thicker than a spliced eye or loop runner and looks like it would inhibit using the SJ with the left hand. In this business it is an asset to be ambidextrous due to situationally dictated needs. I have been using a spliced eye on my rope and to be honest the time it takes to undue or redo the velcro - (2 seconds) is really NOT troublesome. Maybe if you are Joe Harris's climbing equal and need to beat him by a few hundreths of a second at a world class compitition!

Don't those screamers come undone like a bungee cord during a fall if i remember correctly but may be wrong. their are layers in their that unfold if pulled on hard enough we pulled one apart one time with a quad to see how it would react.

 

[2treeornot2tree]

Yeah they do pull apart. They are 4' or 6' long when activated.

 

[the Aerialist]

Yeah I was using the same kind of thing but a soft link instead but i found it wasn't really long enough to keep the biner away from my hands and ascender when i was pulling myself up, I advance my TIP by unclipping and throwing higher too now i'll just have to see how long it takes for me to get sick of untieing and retieing whilst advancing lol

I used a short soft link as a first try but replaced it with the screamer because, being stiffer, it was simpler to clip into it. It's length puts the 'biner higher up on the attachment side of the rope an allows more clearance for your hand as you pull on the other side of the rope, my Kong clears it easily but thick gloves make it a bit harder to free your hand as the two ropes are pulled together under your weight. Still an issue, but less of one with the 'biner out of your way above your pulling hand.

 

[the Aerialist]

AA,
I would like to know what that screw going through the screamer that appears to be threaded into the side of the SJ body where the screw that normally secures the velcro to the SJ is doing or is it an illusion due to picture angle? I would not modify a life safety device in a way that could end potentially disastrous.

Also the thickness of the Yates Screamer appears to be substantially thicker than a spliced eye or loop runner and looks like it would inhibit using the SJ with the left hand. In this business it is an asset to be ambidextrous due to situationally dictated needs. I have been using a spliced eye on my rope and to be honest the time it takes to undue or redo the velcro - (2 seconds) is really NOT troublesome. Maybe if you are Joe Harris's climbing equal and need to beat him by a few hundreths of a second at a world class compitition!

I replaced the short screw that holds the velcro in place with a longer one to secure the screamer to the device without velcro. The original screw and velcro band that secures the rope to the device got lost so I improvised. I may order another screw and velcro and return it to the original configuration since that would work as well to hold the screamer in place.

On my saddle the terminating attachment is a swivel, so right or left hand use is just a matter of turning the SJ to suit whatever hand I'm using.

I'm not trying to compete with anybody, I just like to reduce any wasted time. I found myself spending too much time dealing with the velcro when climbing, so I eliminated the need to mess with it.

 

[TreeAce]

Can anyone give me a reason the LJ isnt the the better choice given its abilty to go on mid line? Is the SJ smoother on desent? Does the rope feed through the SJ better? Seems like the LJ is a no brainer. As for the screamer, I can see where AA is coming from. I wouldnt use it but the idea is sound. Just need to do away with the break away part. But a stiffer extention like it is a good way to go I think. This of course coming from someone who doesnt even have a SJ or a LJ .

And also, what is that velcro really doing anyway? Is it just keeping things neat n tidy or is it actually important for the climbing line to stay RIGHT there? I just dont quit see why you need it or at least need it EVERY time you hook n unhook. I mean once you are at your final TIP then ya use it but if you know you will be re setting a few times in a short amount of time why bother with the velcro?