Starting problems
- Thread starter gr8mac
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wiley_p
ArboristSite Guru
Is this a treesaw? If not maybe you have a leaky impulse line, low end too lean.
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The saw is an old pioneer made in the 60's. The carb has no choke, but a primer button. I think the diaphram for the primer button needs replaced but I am not sure, I can get gas to the carb if I press it enough times. Can't figure it out.
The saw is an old pioneer made in the 60's. The carb has no choke, but a primer button. I think the diaphram for the primer button needs replaced but I am not sure, I can get gas to the carb if I press it enough times. Can't figure it out.
You're complaining about having to push a primer bulb a few times? I have to pull a rope to get my saw to start. What you're doing sounds a bit easier.
Okay, I'll be serious. Are you saying this happens every time, even when warm? Does it occur immediately after shutdown or does it have to sit a few minutes first to cause the need?
It sounds to me like there are fatigued diaphragms inside the carburetor so I think you're on to something by suspecting the same. Get a rebuild kit and replace them.
Okay, I'll be serious. Are you saying this happens every time, even when warm? Does it occur immediately after shutdown or does it have to sit a few minutes first to cause the need?
It sounds to me like there are fatigued diaphragms inside the carburetor so I think you're on to something by suspecting the same. Get a rebuild kit and replace them.
What he means is your current situation would make a great "Mr. Obvious" routine for <a href="http://www.bobandtom.com/">Bob and Tom</a>.
The primer bulb in it's normal configuration is a manual fuel pump to both initially charge the system when it's dry and to provide an excess of fuel as is typically needed on a cold start. In that second respect it takes the place of a choke plate.
If your saw starts easily without it when warm then there's likely nothing wrong. If you intend to keep and use the saw, it wouldn't hurt to get a rebuild kit and either install it or put it on the shelf so it'll be handy when you <i>do</i> need it.
Glen
The primer bulb in it's normal configuration is a manual fuel pump to both initially charge the system when it's dry and to provide an excess of fuel as is typically needed on a cold start. In that second respect it takes the place of a choke plate.
If your saw starts easily without it when warm then there's likely nothing wrong. If you intend to keep and use the saw, it wouldn't hurt to get a rebuild kit and either install it or put it on the shelf so it'll be handy when you <i>do</i> need it.
Glen
mikey
ArboristSite Operative
All cold engines need a choke or primer bulb(accelerator pump,inrichment circuit,etc) to start.Some saws have both.
tony marks
Addicted to ArboristSite
are u sayin u have to spray fuel in the carb to start the saw ,when its cold..
if so the choke is not working..
if it has an intact primer bulb and u are talkin about usin it on a first start. duh.jmo. i think hes sayin he has to spray prime it tho..
if so the choke is not working..
if it has an intact primer bulb and u are talkin about usin it on a first start. duh.jmo. i think hes sayin he has to spray prime it tho..
What I am saying is that when the saw is cold I have to prime the carb with fuel manually and start it, then it will run off the tank. It doesnt matter if I push the primer bulb or not. After it is warm it will start on it's own. Only thing I can think of is that the primer button diaphram is not working and needs replaced (although I can see fuel going towards the carb through the fuel lines). Am I correct in assuming this or could there be some other problem I am over looking????? Thanks
What you just said is different than "I can get gas to the carb if I press it enough times" like you said before.
It sounds as if the carburetor needs cleaning, especially in the pathways taken by the discharge of the primer pump.
What is the make and model of the carburetor?
Glen
It sounds as if the carburetor needs cleaning, especially in the pathways taken by the discharge of the primer pump.
What is the make and model of the carburetor?
Glen
tony marks
Addicted to ArboristSite
sounds like u got an airleak in u primer system bud .. if the bulb is filling and pumping fuel to the carb and still not working ,take it to an mechanic.. its probabably not a biggee ....he needs the work and u need a good starting saw.. good luck..
Lewis Brander
Addicted to ArboristSite
Primer Bulb:
I have seveeral pieces of equipment that has primer bulbs. I figure as long as you can see gas displacing the air in the lines the bulb is working properly. In this case the prmer bulb takes gas from the tank and pumps it to and through the carburetor and back to the tank. Also it squirts a bit of fuel into the carburetor to give it fuel for cold starting, taking place of the choke. If the saw is warm and idling and you pump the primer the saw will load up, flood, and die or quit. If the saw starts normally when warm without using the primer and idles in various positions, with out the chain moving, I'd say the carb and crank seals are OK. As long as the High side of the carb is adjusted so that it 4 cycles or blubbers at WOT and the idle is set so that the saw idles smoothly and accelerates properly, as I said without the chain moving, there appears to me to be no problem with the saw. JMO. Lewis.
I have seveeral pieces of equipment that has primer bulbs. I figure as long as you can see gas displacing the air in the lines the bulb is working properly. In this case the prmer bulb takes gas from the tank and pumps it to and through the carburetor and back to the tank. Also it squirts a bit of fuel into the carburetor to give it fuel for cold starting, taking place of the choke. If the saw is warm and idling and you pump the primer the saw will load up, flood, and die or quit. If the saw starts normally when warm without using the primer and idles in various positions, with out the chain moving, I'd say the carb and crank seals are OK. As long as the High side of the carb is adjusted so that it 4 cycles or blubbers at WOT and the idle is set so that the saw idles smoothly and accelerates properly, as I said without the chain moving, there appears to me to be no problem with the saw. JMO. Lewis.
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I agree Lewis, nothing is wrong with the saw other than it won't start on it's own when cold. I think it is something in the primer button. I say button because that is what it is, not a bulb. Same principle though. From what I understand, parts for the pioneer primer systems have been unavailable for many, many years. But I also found out that I can use a Walbro primer system for parts, i.e. new diaphram. Thanks for all the replies guys. 
old pioneer
It's time for a new saw, unless you are keeping this old saw because it's your favorite go to saw. It's time to retire it to the shelf and wax about the great times you had with it over a beer on the weeekends. Go out and get a new saw. A couple of reasons for the new saw, better anti vibe, chainbrake, less aggrivation, it'll start when you pull the rope and last chance to get a 2 cycle before the industry goes to 4 cycle. Parts are available for the new saws. New saws usually start on the first or second pull, hot or cold, at least mine do.
If you're keeping the old one, look up Pioneer, who hasn't posted here for a while. He collects them and he can sometimes get the parts for them. I would say it's time to get a new saw though.
It's time for a new saw, unless you are keeping this old saw because it's your favorite go to saw. It's time to retire it to the shelf and wax about the great times you had with it over a beer on the weeekends. Go out and get a new saw. A couple of reasons for the new saw, better anti vibe, chainbrake, less aggrivation, it'll start when you pull the rope and last chance to get a 2 cycle before the industry goes to 4 cycle. Parts are available for the new saws. New saws usually start on the first or second pull, hot or cold, at least mine do.
If you're keeping the old one, look up Pioneer, who hasn't posted here for a while. He collects them and he can sometimes get the parts for them. I would say it's time to get a new saw though.
Greg Carberry
ArboristSite Operative
Hello,
Yes I am still around just havent had alot of time to post in a while. What your problem is is the primer diaphragm and check valve. They go bad and no parts are availible anymore. You can adapt a Walbro primer assembly to it like that is found on newer Poulan saws. Ive done this and its turns out good if you take your time and make a nice plate to mount it. What I prefer is to find a choke off of a similar choke equipped Pioneer and fit that to it.
If your going to be serious about using any older saw you need to go through the while thing. Replace carb diaphragms, fuel lines, crank seals gaskets and filters. They can be made to run like an new saw cheaply just takes a little patience.
Yes I am still around just havent had alot of time to post in a while. What your problem is is the primer diaphragm and check valve. They go bad and no parts are availible anymore. You can adapt a Walbro primer assembly to it like that is found on newer Poulan saws. Ive done this and its turns out good if you take your time and make a nice plate to mount it. What I prefer is to find a choke off of a similar choke equipped Pioneer and fit that to it.
If your going to be serious about using any older saw you need to go through the while thing. Replace carb diaphragms, fuel lines, crank seals gaskets and filters. They can be made to run like an new saw cheaply just takes a little patience.
