Fabricating a new splitting wedge

[genesis5521]

Hi Guys:

I got a nice Hobart Stickmate AC/DC stick welder for my birthday last year. Don't know how to weld, but layed down a few beads and got two pieces of metal to stick together. Hammered the heck outta them, and they held. It weren't pretty, but the welds were strong. I had read everything I could on welding, and watched a ton of videos. I'll never be "a welder". But I wanna fabricate a few simple things.

I wanna fabricate a slip-on 4-way wedge for my splitter.
What kinda metal should I use and how thick should the metal be?

Thanks guys, and Merry Christmas.

Don <><

 

[Hank Chinaski]

Not trying to discourage you, but 20-30k tons of force against a "learning" weld doesn't sound like I'd like to be standing next to it if it decided to let go.

I'd start with at least 3/4" steel with the leading edges ground to a point and interlock the pieces so that the weld wasn't the only thing holding them together (ie cut a 3/4" wide slot in the center bottom edge of one and the center top edge of the other so they'll slide together and then you weld between the "legs" of the joints of the "X". Then I'd full weld any wings on as solidly as possible.

It's not impossible, but I"d pay very close attention to what I was doing while making it, as it'd be easy to reach out and bite you if done without respect

 

[genesis5521]

Not trying to discourage you, but 20-30k tons of force against a "learning" weld doesn't sound like I'd like to be standing next to it if it decided to let go.

I'd start with at least 3/4" steel with the leading edges ground to a point and interlock the pieces so that the weld wasn't the only thing holding them together (ie cut a 3/4" wide slot in the center bottom edge of one and the center top edge of the other so they'll slide together and then you weld between the "legs" of the joints of the "X". Then I'd full weld any wings on as solidly as possible.

It's not impossible, but I"d pay very close attention to what I was doing while making it, as it'd be easy to reach out and bite you if done without respect

Thanks Hank. You bring up a good point concerning a raw rookie welder (me). I may not do the 4-way thing just yet. My splitter wedge isn't very tall. Maybe I'll just make a taller one (maybe 3 inches taller and no 4-way) to slip over the wedge that's on the splitter now. The splitter I use is a little 4 ton Ryobi electric. It does an OK job, but I have to manually pull apart any "stringy" splits on bigger rounds. I'm probably just looking for an excuse to use my birthday present. So I'll get some 3/4 steel and grind/weld away. I'll figure out a safe way to test it.

Thanks for your input.

Don <><

 

[One Shot Will]

We have a Tech school in town at the college that would have one night a week for 6 to 8 weeks.
Makes a very good beginners class. Do you have something like that close.
I have been welding for 45 + years and it is not that hard - just need someone to show you and
then lots of practice. Find a scrap yard and get some pieces to weld on. just takes time. When you get them full of welds
take them back and trade for some more.
Good luck to you and have fun.

 

[genesis5521]

We have a Tech school in town at the college that would have one night a week for 6 to 8 weeks.
Makes a very good beginners class. Do you have something like that close.
I have been welding for 45 + years and it is not that hard - just need someone to show you and
then lots of practice. Find a scrap yard and get some pieces to weld on. just takes time. When you get them full of welds
take them back and trade for some more.
Good luck to you and have fun.

Thanks for your encouragement Will. Fact is, I'm a computer instructor at a technical college, and I know a few welding instructors. They gave me a few pointers. My neighbor is a maintenance supervisor at his plant and showed me a few things and will help me with this simple project to get me started. When I first got this welder, and set it up, I called him over to make sure I wouldn't kill myself. He checked things out and said, "OK. Show me what ya got". So I laid down a few beads. He said they looked "OK". Then he said, "Now do that 500 more times!"

Merry Christmas to you and yours Will.
(Wish I knew as much about welding as you do.)

Don <><

 

[old cookie]

It isnt like it will blowup. have at it if it looks ok try it.If it doesnt grind it out and try try again. 7024 rod will make you think you are a expert.7018 will make you realize you arent. get some 6011 or 6013 and 7024.1/8 inch and some scrap.Start hot that makes it easyer.7024 will weld pretty muchby itself just drag it.have fun

 

[saw dog]

Learning to weld

Hi Don
Like earlier stated allways bevel your work to its entire depth, figure in your fab deminsions a gap 1/32 less than the thickness of your root pass rod. I use Lincoln 5P for the root pass and
7018 for build up and cover passes. Welding 3/4 in. stock it takes numerouse passes to weld it properly. Using 7018 allways keep your rod as close as possible 90 degrees to your work, run hot as you can handle it and keep your puddle ahead of the flux flow. On 3/4 in. material you need to run multupal stringer passes paralell to each other to build up the field. You know you have the temprature right when the last 2 to 3 inches of the rod turns cherry red all the way to the stinger. Never drag 7018, you must work the heat ahead of your puddle to keep a puddle pocket burned out ahead of your puddle for perfect penetration and never let the flux encoumpus the puddle or you will end with a slag filled weld. If your temp. is right as the weld cools the slag from 7018 will allmost all releas it,s self from the weld as it cools. If and when you end up with slag in the weld, you must gring it out if you want a strong weld. It just takes patients and lots of practice but I am sure you can master it.

 

[fdoberman]

It's been puzzling me for a number of years, I fully understand the pimplefaced kid in the vest over there to HomoDesperate where I'm BANNED, and his cousin in the blue vest down the road at Blows know more about welding than I do, and as long as you have money they'll stroke your ego and sell you a genuine immitation welding machine. You buy this machine and you can weld a battle tank out of gutter pipe in your back yard sir. Them vestboys attended training you know, genuine videos put out by Lincoon and HoFart.

Thing is I been welding, NOT STICKING TOGETHER hunks of metal for close onto 50 years now, and there are days when I do some scratching where hair used to be coming up with an idea. Honestly all the welds are made in my head before the machine turns on, and truly I can generally show somebody a lot faster and easier than I can explain the job.

By my thinking companies that sell welders are in the business of moving as many welders as they can, and they don't care 90% of the machines sit on shelves collecting dust as long as the shelf ain't in the company warehouse. The Internet gave us a whole lot of welding experts spitting advice, oddly most seem to last about till their Unemployment runs out.

Long and short of it Don, stop by and in half an hour I'll teach you how to weld that wedge up. I'll even let you run a real Lincoln doing it. It'll take you about 3 months of practice after I'm done to be worth diddle.

BTW Don, couple months ago my puter crapped out, so I fired up the standby Dell. I was all set to put files on the Dell when the portable hard drive fell off the desk. How can I get my files on the Dell?

 

[Fifelaker]

I dont think the little Ryobi has enough umph to use a 4-way wedge. If the splitter is not making two pieces I can't see it making 4. I suggest welding a bigger splitter with a 4-way good luck.

 

[zogger]

Thanks for your encouragement Will. Fact is, I'm a computer instructor at a technical college, and I know a few welding instructors. They gave me a few pointers. My neighbor is a maintenance supervisor at his plant and showed me a few things and will help me with this simple project to get me started. When I first got this welder, and set it up, I called him over to make sure I wouldn't kill myself. He checked things out and said, "OK. Show me what ya got". So I laid down a few beads. He said they looked "OK". Then he said, "Now do that 500 more times!"

Merry Christmas to you and yours Will.
(Wish I knew as much about welding as you do.)

Don <><

You are lucky. I looked around for a welding school/night class and nothing in my area close enough I would be willing to drive to.

As a consequence I still suck at welding. I know trial and error and so forth, just would rather skip the wasting expensive rods part, especially trying to fix something I really need fixed here.. Heck, I don't even know which rods for whatever metal or thickness or what settings to use. Boss dropped off an old lincoln stick welder he got some place, said here ya go, have fun! Well, ya, but..... I had to fix the wires(the welding cables themselves) so they didn't short out, then the thing has no knob on the amp adjustment, put some vice grips on it, lol...and then it blows the circuit breaker if I turn it up too high....

Sometimes this on the job training on the farm is lacking a little....

 

[genesis5521]

I'm the OP. Thanks for your help guys.
One more question. What KIND of steel should I use.
When I look steel up on the internet, I find hot rolled flat bar steel, cold finish flat bar steel, etc. etc.
I was using this website: Metals Depot® - Buy Small Quantity Metal Online! Steel, Aluminum, Stainless, Brass

Don <><

 

[blackdogon57]

The worst thing that can happen with a splitting wedge is that the weld will break - so go for it. If it breaks you need to work on your welds.
I have broken my six way hardened steel wedge 3 or 4 times. They seem to break easily when it is really cold. Even when welded by a pro they have still broken just about as often as when I do a hack job myself.

 

[CJ1]

It's been puzzling me for a number of years, I fully understand the pimplefaced kid in the vest over there to HomoDesperate where I'm BANNED, and his cousin in the blue vest down the road at Blows know more about welding than I do, and as long as you have money they'll stroke your ego and sell you a genuine immitation welding machine. You buy this machine and you can weld a battle tank out of gutter pipe in your back yard sir. Them vestboys attended training you know, genuine videos put out by Lincoon and HoFart.

Thing is I been welding, NOT STICKING TOGETHER hunks of metal for close onto 50 years now, and there are days when I do some scratching where hair used to be coming up with an idea. Honestly all the welds are made in my head before the machine turns on, and truly I can generally show somebody a lot faster and easier than I can explain the job.

By my thinking companies that sell welders are in the business of moving as many welders as they can, and they don't care 90% of the machines sit on shelves collecting dust as long as the shelf ain't in the company warehouse. The Internet gave us a whole lot of welding experts spitting advice, oddly most seem to last about till their Unemployment runs out.

Long and short of it Don, stop by and in half an hour I'll teach you how to weld that wedge up. I'll even let you run a real Lincoln doing it. It'll take you about 3 months of practice after I'm done to be worth diddle.

BTW Don, couple months ago my puter crapped out, so I fired up the standby Dell. I was all set to put files on the Dell when the portable hard drive fell off the desk. How can I get my files on the Dell?

I am a Lincoln fan myself having 2 of them and sold alot of others before I quit making a living at welding. But that Hobart is not a bad machine!! Heck go to his house and teach him there. Then he can have the pride of using his own equipment. Good of you to offer to teach him. Welding is a art and skill combined. CJ

 

[One Shot Will]

Better off with plain old hot rolled steel. when using high grade steel the heat from the welding will crystallize the metal
and it will break easier. for a splitting wedge you would be better off with mass than high quality.
just my opinion

 

[Craz z]

Do you have access to a cutting torch?

Not a welder by trade but get by and notice the warmer the metal the easier the sticks startup.

Halfway through a cold weld it gets just right if you heat the steel prior to starting the stick it will hookup instantly.

you don't have to get it beat red just get it nice and warm and it will make the process much easier. oh and don't use the oxygen button if using the cutting head attachment or you'll make a mess and have to start over.

By the way grinding 3/4" and higher into a nice blade like point is gonna take awhile specially with a small hand grinder or bench grinder. I like to start a point with the torch and finish it with a grinder. cuts a hour or so outta your day.

 

[gink595]

I'm the OP. Thanks for your help guys.
One more question. What KIND of steel should I use.
When I look steel up on the internet, I find hot rolled flat bar steel, cold finish flat bar steel, etc. etc.
I was using this website: Metals Depot® - Buy Small Quantity Metal Online! Steel, Aluminum, Stainless, Brass

Don <><

A36 mild steel will be fine for it.

 

[gink595]

Here is how I did the wedge for my 4 way. I took my 9" grinder with a foundry hard disk on it and hogged away. Not easy but made a nice sharp wedge.

 

[fdoberman]

I am a Lincoln fan myself having 2 of them and sold alot of others before I quit making a living at welding. But that Hobart is not a bad machine!! Heck go to his house and teach him there. Then he can have the pride of using his own equipment. Good of you to offer to teach him. Welding is a art and skill combined. CJ

Hobart Bros are fine machines, white Hobarts made by IndoChinaThugWorks are little better than Horrible freight! I have one sitting here and there is no way in hell you should need to tape the wire speed pot to hold the setting!!! ITW completely whored Hobart's name. I also have a 400 amp Hobart Bros and that is a welding machine.
Also sitting in my shop is a Miller MM-200 and a propane driven Bobcat. 5 Lincolns ALL rotary DC machines up to the SA200, and a pair of P&H TIG machines.

The OP is making an absurd request expecially given his admitted lack of skill.
He would be a whole lot ahead visiting a LWS assuming he has one that ain't Airass and politely asking for help.

His project is at best 4 hours, 1 cutting and 3 welding. If he fails to understand sequence and warp, he will make a pretzel!

Given the size machine he's working with, 1/4 hotroll plate and a couple feet of scrap truck spring for the cutting edge will do the job. Weld the wedge up with 1/8 6013 after learning to use that rod, then attach the leafspring at the cutting edge with 1/8 309ss.

DO NOT CHILL ANY PART OF THE WELDMENT!!!

Sharpen the cutter with a torch or plasma grind to your pleasure and see if the splitter can support it.

 

[gink595]

I wouldn't use 6013 for anything! Make a pretty weld and feeds a ego on a novice, if you can keep the slag pockets out. I'd use 7018 or 6010-6011 and leave 6013 for sheetmetal.

 

[feader72]

Dont give up

Dont give up trying to weld with stick. I first learned from adult community education program how to weld with stick at night. Once I got the hang of it, i was able to fabricate things i needed without asking others for help. Then came mig/flux welding, and Ill tell you the only time I use mig/flux is for thinner stuff 1/8" and under (autobody etc.), then I always revert back to stick. You can find so many applications for stick, cast iron etc. and you can buy these rods right from T S C, Menards etc. in smaller packs so you dont have to buy 25# at a time. Stick welding has been around for years and will continue to be a forefront in welding for a long time, they are versatile etc. I've taught many ppl how to weld just by throwing down some scrap 1/4" and putting some 6011 on and letting them have fun practicing weaving etc. and thats exactly what you need to do, practice. Im by no means an expert welder but I tell you its fun welding and creating stuff with metal and stick welding, at least to me, has better penetration, you can get a 10018 rod (7018 means 70,000 psi where 100 would mean 100,000 psi) very strong but sometimes brittle too.

I buy my rods locally but I buy my flux core on line cuz everywhere else wants $80 + for a 10# spool of .030 flux core wire. even 2# of flux core is usually 16 bucks locally. Too much for me, I get quality flux wire from weldingsupply.com (they beat anyone local and any large box store for flux core wire) link : https://weldingsupply.securesites.com/cgi-bin/einstein.pl?PNUM::1:UNDEF:OR:FCMS03010
and just below that is 10# .035 flux core. You cant beat that price, its double plus in stores, thats why I always order 2 10#er's at a time.

keep on welding and there are lots of great ppl here that can help give advice if you need it.