Building My First Mill

I've decided that building a mill would be a fun project with the possibility of making lumber for my dad and friends to play with. Attached are a couple of pictures of the powerhead I'll be using. It's a never fired 820 PowerBee motor and I'll be using a 38" bar for starters. I had to make the clutch drum from two different drums to get what I needed to fit the motor. (see pictures of drum) I machined the aluminum blocks that hold the bar to the frame and will work on adding the oiling port to the bar for oiling. This model of motor was used on the old Montomery Wards saws never had an internal oilers, they used a manual pumps. I'm planning to use the pump from a large manual oiler I have found for the operator end of the mill and a drip system for the nose.

My next stage is to make the framework for the mill. I have a friend who manufactures custom aluminum pieces for high rise construction who has given me the OK to dumpster dive his scrap aluminum bin for any aluminum I want. Once I have built the frame I will work on fabricating the gas and oil tanks.

So what do you all think, am I nuts???

jerry-

Would never say you're nuts, lots of entrepreneurs and gadget builders on this forum. What cc is that motor though... you need at least 75cc for milling anything over 18 inches, and if your going to be using most of that 38" bar, even that won't really be enough.

Looking up the specs on that little engine... 134cc and 10 hp.

So it's on the same level as a Stihl 090


Personally I would have gone with a vertical shaft 4 stroke for any sort of fixed chainsaw mill, but lot of guys mill with 2 strokes smaller than that

So .. not crazy, keep us posted on how it works

Ian

Ianab said:

Looking up the specs on that little engine... 134cc and 10 hp.

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Specs I saw (ha!) at http://www.pittauto.com/pinfo/powerbee.asp said 10 HP was MAX HP. Tuning and operation for continuous operation said 6.5 HP at 7000 rpm so closer to half the operating HP of an 090

Real difference is less than half the weight 13.2 lbs compared to 30 lbs! - although weight is not really significant for a fixed mill.

Recommended continuous max revs are also only 7000 rpm. A better power for weight for chain speed engine would be an 066 with 7.1HP at 9500 rpm weighing in a 16.5 lb would probably give a significantly faster cutting speed.

Still not a crazy idea, the 134 cc should mean is lasts longer than a smaller engine.

BobL said:

Specs I saw (ha!) at http://www.pittauto.com/pinfo/powerbee.asp said 10 HP was MAX HP. Tuning and operation for continuous operation said 6.5 HP at 7000 rpm so closer to half the operating HP of an 090

Real difference is less than half the weight 13.2 lbs compared to 30 lbs! - although weight is not really significant for a fixed mill.

Recommended continuous max revs are also only 7000 rpm. A better power for weight for chain speed engine would be an 066 with 7.1HP at 9500 rpm weighing in a 16.5 lb would probably give a significantly faster cutting speed.

Still not a crazy idea, the 134 cc should mean is lasts longer than a smaller engine.

Click to expand...

I'm using this motor because of my experience with these motors and to see just how good it will perform.

The motor has never been fired so it will be fresh. The stock carb and intake on the old Wards saws were a 7/8' bore and intake. I'll be running a 1" carb and intake. I'm also thinking about running a tuned exhaust. There is a guy on Sonoma, CA that builds them for go cart racing who can get an additional 2hp with his exhaust. Now if that's not enough power there is a company that makes a stoker kit for these powerbee motors that will boost the cubic inches to 10c.i. Lots of torque. I'm hoping to be in the 10-15hp range when I get the motor completed.

Hey, I'm 55 and retired and this is just a toy I'm building. I was just at my friends ranch today looking at seven 30" Blue Oak tree that PG&E cut down below their high power lines that I hope to mill at some point in time. I'm going back next week to paint the ends to help avoid checking. I have been reading some of the threads from some people who are milling and most say that West Coast Oak is no good for making furniture. I'm planning to make out door benches and tables to reside under deck covers.


Attached is a picture of my 1967 Wards/PowerBee chain saw with a cannon 30" bar. I just cut up a big Oak in Sonol last week that was hit by lightening two years ago. This saw has been updated with electronic ignition, carbon fibor reed valves and a 1" intake/carb. The chain is a chisel tooth that Art Martin has been teaching me to sharpen. It made short time of that big tree.

This milling is all new to me so I'll be asking questions time to time from those of you who have much more experience milling lumber.

jerry-

820wards said:

This milling is all new to me so I'll be asking questions time to time from those of you who have much more experience milling lumber.
jerry-

Click to expand...

Well you came to the right spot to do that

its the torque!

I mill exclusively with old saws, and until 6 months ago, exclusively with under 60 cc saws. Here is what I learned. Its not all about chain speed. If you have an old torque monster saw, the torque will mill the log just fine without fast chain speed.
I've milled 22 inch birch logs with a 48cc stihl 031, 24 inch bar lp chain. It worked fine. I've milled maple(started at 30 inches in diameter) and oak with a 60's vintage Pioneer Holiday, 58cc's, 24 inch bar, lp chain. They both milled slow, but I got them milled. Running an old saw engine like you are, the low end grunt that these old saws produce will do the job. I personally, if I had that saw, I would mill with it.
Now my milling machines are a pair of Pioneer P51's (81 and 82 model years if I remember correctly) each on a seperate mill, to speed up the milling process (each mill preset to a different thickness). These are 82 cc's, low end grunters. They both run 24 inch bars and lp chain.
Build it, it will work, and work well, I'm sure of it.

(all my saws, and milling attatchments combined cost me less than a new 660 or 395)

stonykill said:

I mill exclusively with old saws, and until 6 months ago, exclusively with under 60 cc saws. Here is what I learned. Its not all about chain speed. If you have an old torque monster saw, the torque will mill the log just fine without fast chain speed.
I've milled 22 inch birch logs with a 48cc stihl 031, 24 inch bar lp chain. It worked fine. I've milled maple(started at 30 inches in diameter) and oak with a 60's vintage Pioneer Holiday, 58cc's, 24 inch bar, lp chain. They both milled slow, but I got them milled. Running an old saw engine like you are, the low end grunt that these old saws produce will do the job. I personally, if I had that saw, I would mill with it.
Now my milling machines are a pair of Pioneer P51's (81 and 82 model years if I remember correctly) each on a seperate mill, to speed up the milling process (each mill preset to a different thickness). These are 82 cc's, low end grunters. They both run 24 inch bars and lp chain.
Build it, it will work, and work well, I'm sure of it.

(all my saws, and milling attatchments combined cost me less than a new 660 or 395)

Click to expand...

Stoneykill,

Thanks for you input. I figure this mill will cost me around $600 when I'm all done. I can't believe the stuff people are willing to give just to see this thing work. I have a friend who called me Sunday who has seven Blue Oaks he wants me to mill for him, and he wants to pay me for the work. I'm doing this for fun not profit.

Say, Are you anywhere near Watertown? I have a brother-in-law who lives there.

thanks
jerry-

820wards said:

Stoneykill,

Say, Are you anywhere near Watertown? I have a brother-in-law who lives there.

thanks
jerry-

Click to expand...

Not really, Watertown is at least 3 hours away. I'm 35 miles southeast of Albany, only 5 miles from the mass border, at the edge of the Berkshires.

Built My Oil Tanks Today

Finally had a chance to work on the oil tanks for the mill today. I made them from two aluminum tanks. The tanks originally contained a cleaning chemical for flushing air-conditioning systems when a compressor burns up. I was very pleased how they turned out. First I had to machine the aluminum bung-fittings to be welded to the tanks. As for the gas tank, I have one end cap welded on, but I'm waiting for the aluminum gas cap/fitting to come that I ordered. Should see that this week. I'll post pictures of the gas tank when I finish welding it together. I measured the gas tank for capacity and it's 44 ounces. Do you guys think that will be enough capacity for my 134cc motor?


My next steps will be to start fabricating a nose protector for the bar and the fitting for oiling the nose of the bar. I'm planning to use a mechanical pump for oiling the bar on the power-head end and a drip feed system for the nose. If the oiler I'm planning to use for the mill works out good I just may add one for oiling the nose end of the bar. I was also able to purchase aluminum uni-strut for the rails and will be adding them to the mill next week. I'm really trying to keep the weight down on the mill.


jerry-

I post the remaining pictures in a second post.

Aluminum Oil Bottles

Last two pictures of oil aluminum bottles.

jerry-

man, you csm guys are hardcore, does my heart good, and i've seen what caliber of lumber ya'll turn out.........great stuff.............carry on!

820wards said:

I measured the gas tank for capacity and it's 44 ounces. Do you guys think that will be enough capacity for my 134cc motor?

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Should be OK for gas as that is bigger than any regular CS I know of.

In terms of oil, I find that around 20 ml (2/3rds oz) per minute of oil at both ends of the bar works well for everything except perhaps Hardwood logs bigger than 30".
At this rate a single 44 oz = 1320 ml tank will feed your regular and aux tanks for 33 minutes of continuous milling ie more than enough.

Jerry

Nice fab work.

Wish I had the tools to weld aluminum.

DRB said:

Jerry

Nice fab work.

Wish I had the tools to weld aluminum.

Click to expand...

LOL! Wish I had the skills...:censored:

zopi said:

LOL! Wish I had the skills...:censored:

Click to expand...

I got the skills but not the cash

Nice work, looking forward to updates.

BobL said:

Should be OK for gas as that is bigger than any regular CS I know of.

In terms of oil, I find that around 20 ml (2/3rds oz) per minute of oil at both ends of the bar works well for everything except perhaps Hardwood logs bigger than 30".
At this rate a single 44 oz = 1320 ml tank will feed your regular and aux tanks for 33 minutes of continuous milling ie more than enough.

Click to expand...

Bob,
Or until I run out of gas...

Thanks for the data.
jerry-

DRB said:

Jerry

Nice fab work.

Wish I had the tools to weld aluminum.

Click to expand...

My engineer Dad taught me to gas weld when I was 10yrs. old and I started tig welding aluminum in 1975 when I was crewing on a race car team. Seemed like something aluminum was always needing to get welded. Thanks for the complement. I'm also luck that I have a friend who has a business that has a dumpster of surplus scrap aluminum that I can get whenever I need something. Dumpster diving for aluminum...

jerry-

DRB said:

I got the skills but not the cash

Click to expand...

DRB,

I see in you quote that you have a 365 Special,

"365 Special, ProMac 70, 088 Magnum"

My neighbor just gave me one that he doesn't use any more and it's in great shape. The only problem with the saw is he left fuel in it for three years and couldn't figure out why he couldn't get it to start. I cleaned the tank out and fuel filter, but I think the carb is gummed up. I know one of the kids that works at our local lawnmower shop and he's going to come by tomorrow to pick it up and rebuild the carb. I'd just as soon as pay him to do it on the side vs me spending time trying to do it my self. He said it tricky just to get the carb out. Do you have an owners manual for your saw?

jerry-