70' tree leans toward house

[preach it]

I would like input from everyone else on my dilemma. I have a tree that I need to cut down. It's 70' tall spruce tree, leans slightly toward the residence, and I want to cut it off at 20'. I don't want to have to climb all the way to the top and do a bunch of cutting. I will have a rope to pull it over with. I will also have a rope to hold it so that it won't fall toward the house in case something goes wrong. I realize also that cutting below the halfway point of 70' makes the treetop hit first and then the butt will drag down the trunk. My drawing is enclosed to give you a good idea of what it looks like. Please give me your ideas and save me a lot of work. I have a couple of weeks before I will be doing this job.

Thanks.

 

[treeclimber165]

Do you plan on doing this from a ladder?

When I first started doing treework, I had no problem calling in a better climber when I had jobs too difficult to do myself. I learned a lot from watching them and benefited greatly from their experience. Hire a climber to drop it for you. It would be $100 well spent.

I'm not even going to ask why you are planning on leaving a 20' totem pole in your yard. I don't want to know.

 

[TREETX]

Why not cut it at 2' and attack the reast with a stump grinder??

I smell a lack of climbing ability. Those trees are ladders, it should be easy to disassemble in more than 2 pieces.

Hmmm, I am guessing a 20 foot ladder.

Seriously, give us a little more info on your objective and why you want to use this method.

 

[Stumper]

Nice drawing but it sounds like a poor plan. As Tex said, give us more info. Why isn't it practical to drop it full length? Why are you opposed to piecing it down in smaller/safer pieces? What is your experience level ( no offense intended but at this stage of discussion it appears to be very limited-Brian's advice to call in someone else makes sense.).

 

[preach it]

I will explain a little more. I have no problem climbing to the top and cutting it off piece by piece down to the 20 ft where the people want it cut off. The reason they want it cut at 20 ft is that they live on the edge of a large lake. The wind blows from the north or west most of the time here. (There aren't too many hills here, very flat and not a lot of trees.) It is common for violent storms to come through and take the tops off the trees or take them down altogether. They called me, I am a tree cutter/trimmer as a business. I work alone as many of you do. I have climbed to the top of many trees and cut them down piece by piece, letting them down on ropes. I have a fairly new saddle, and many saws. I am the only tree cutter/trimmer in my area that works with a saddle and ropes. There is one bucket truck in our area but there is a lot of trees that he cannot get to and those are the ones I usually get (probably the same as a lot of you). I do have a set of spikes, but in the thirty years that I have cut trees I have only used them once. I was just hoping that maybe someone had an easier way than piece by piece. Yes, it would be a lot easier to just cut them down and grind the stumps out. ( I have a stump grinder also.) The people want to try to preserve the trees in hopes that they will sprout new growth and they won't lose the trees altogether. (hey, its their idea.) You have to admit that it is easier to cut once than to have to climb up and cut 10 or more times piece by piece. But if no one has any good ideas to save me some time it will be done that way.

 

[ORclimber]

If you cut 50' out of the top of a 70' spruce tree it will die. It will look like crap before whatever green is left turns brown and dies. Your name will be attached to killing the tree. If you value your reputation cut it to the ground or walk away.

 

[Stumper]

I once cut about 35 feet out of a 70 foot Ponderosa pine. The top was dead. I told the people that the rest might die and it wouldn't look good but they wanted to try to save it. It hung around for years -alive but odd looking. I won't condemn you for doing what the customer wants but I would really "preach it" if I were you. Topping the tree is the WRONG thing to do.
If you can't convince the customer to totally remove the tree and decide to go ahead with the propoed operation I would climb high and piece it out. I have done something similar to what you described a few times but it is a tricky op that has the potential to go badly wrong. Spend the extra time to do it with complete control and charge for that extra time and effort. By the way, if you start figuring your rigging time on those ropes and compare the speed with which you could bomb the pieces into a clear(?) drop zone there probably isn't much difference.

 

[treeguy347]

If they want a tree there, cut the whole thing down. Then give them the name of a good nursery in the area.

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

A line of columnar arborvitae or juniper will be a better windbreak then topped pine.

I won't say you will have a 20 ft snag in four years, but the statistics are against you.

the problem is that you have this 50ft of dynamic mass supporting the roots, probably 70% fo the photosynthate ewill be removed. The the roots will start to die back....

 

[Newfie]

Other than the owners want the tree topped, is there any GOOD reason that the tree should be messed with? Is it unhealthy etc?

Sounds like some education is in order for someone.

 

[rahtreelimbs]

Originally posted by Newfie
Other than the owners want the tree topped, is there any GOOD reason that the tree should be messed with? Is it unhealthy etc?

Sounds like some education is in order for someone.

I have to agree.


Is this method carved in stone with the customer? I know that at this time of year work can be hard to come by. Any chance you can educate the customer into leaving well enough alone. Just remember that this tree will have your companies name attached to it.

 

[treeman82]

What are you doing with the brush and wood? Is this just a cut and drop situation? I would think that with the right ropes and other equipment your best bet would be a zip line off the other spruce there. But that is just me thinking again... which I know I am not supposed to be doing. :alien:

 

[TREETX]

This tree is being killed. Wheter by a cut at 20ft or a cut at 2ft, the result will be the same - dead tree

I am in the same situation with a customer and a large sycamore he wants turned into a 20ft totem pole. I am trying to change his mind. If I can't, I am going to give a sky high bid because I don't want to do it.

 

[preach it]

Some of you guys bewray yourselves. (Reveal). It can be done, but it is very, very dangerous. Check in Mr. G. Beranek's book, "The fundamental's of general tree work" , page 208-209 "Pulling on the butt of a top". Another rope with a stretched bungee is placed to pull it away from the tree when it breaks free. I know full well that many of you have pushed away a fair sized piece as it breaks free while you are cutting pieces up in the top of a tree, I have too. A piece this big, and over half of the tree, I am considering not doing it that way, just hoping that maybe some has tried it. I am fishing here for ideas.
I agree also that it will be very ugly and will probably die in a couple years. I give the people what they want pretty much and try to inform them if it is too out of hand. (Avoid topping, etc.) That is how business is done and money is made.
Also, it wouldn't surprise me if I end up just taking them both down anyway as the wife wants them removed but the husband wants to try to save them. We shall see.

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Print out one of the "Why topping is bad" papres on the net and give it to the wife. Explain that it will cost mmore for you to come back in a few years to remove them and planting now will have the new plants established by then anyways.

Sorry, but topping is for hacks.

 

[Stumper]

Preach it, You are right. It can be done safely. Some of us have done stuff like that without even using the butt-bungee. The reason I say go up and piece it is because taking 50'ft of top out of the 70 ft tree scares me. I have done that sort of thing and everything went fine-exactly as planned. The problem is that you are essentially felling a tree that you are tied to. If something should go wrong you have no escape path. You can't run! What if the big dynamic forces do something weird to the butt section? Suppose it splits, barber chairs, kicks back, slingshots the butt etc.? I don't mean to say that those things are likely. I don't mean that these things can't be planned and for and prvented. I just do not like the the complex possibilities that are hard to calculate and prepare for when I have no escape path. The longer I've been doing this the more strange occurrences I've seen or heard about. I keep getting more cautious.

 

[treeman82]

I had done something like this a couple years back with a friend who has been doing tree work for probably 30 years now. He had a couple tulip trees in front of his house. The first one I limbed out and we felled it from the bottom no problem. The other one however was too big to pull into the yard. I wound up going up and cutting out the lower limbs. I then put a pull line up about 40 feet or so. My friend had me cut the top out at 20' up. The tree was maybe 50 feet tall or so, but FAT. I wound up cutting the notch, and made my back cut. I then bailed out on the back end and we pulled the top out into the lawn. NOT something I would ever want to do again. However that was with no back lean, and also somebody on the ground with a 5/8" pull line and a farm tractor. Also there was nothing around for me to mess up should anything have gone wrong... besides some black top which he owns, and some soil. I seriously doubt that I would have done that if there was a house nearby.

 

[NeTree]

Money is money, but this is one of those "take the whole thing down or walk away" type deals. That tree stands a snowball's chance in hell of survival, will look ABSOLUTELY stupid, and YOU will look like an idiot for doing it... cutsomers' request or not. I'd also consider the liablility of what happens when the tree dies, and if it falls on the house. You can bet the customer will coming looking for YOU to pay the bill.

Sometimes you have to put your professional reputation before economics.

I'd recommend a complete removal of the spruce, and planting some lower-growing trees or tall shrubs. They'll make a better windbreak, and will be alot less likely to be a hazard to the structure in the future.

Just my two-bits,

Erik
[email protected]

 

[Toddppm]

Your signature line says it all " do it right the first time"

Why would the top hit first because it's taller than the bottom section? That should be a matter of the way you cut your notch, how narrow etc., should be able to make it fall flat. If any doubt being that close to the house I'd piece it out.

 

[Kevin]

Cutting a 70' tree from 20' leaves 30' above your head if the butt should hit the ground first.
You might get a mouthful of conifer if the tree comes back at you.
Mr. Beranek also warns to never cut the top out of a tree where your height above the ground is less than your position to the tree's top.
He took a good thrashing doing the same thing.
When you can't fall it from the ground it's much safer to go up and take it down piece by piece.
If you're asking for advice, don't do it.