'96 Dodge Intrepid problem

[wood4heat]

My cousins car quit on him this weekend so I've got a project at home. He said it was running fine Friday but when he went out to start it Saturday morning it ran for a second and quit. Now it turns over but wont start. My first thought was the fuel pump but I can hear it humming when I turn the key to on. Does anyone know if this car has a shrader valve somewhere to check if it's actually building pressure? It has the 3.5 V6 in it.

Since I figured it needed it anyway I replaced the fuel filter and it still won't start.

Anyone has another idea what the problem could be any advice is appreciated!

 

[2000ssm6]

A quick way to check if it's getting fuel is with intake/carb cleaner. Take the tube off the throttle body and spray it in while someone is spinning the engine over. Have the throttle plate open also. It could backfire and burn your face/hand so wear a glove.

There should be a valve on the fuel rail to check pressure but may be hidden. I'm a Nissan/GM guy so not much help on that. When you changed the fuel filter did gas spray everywhere or just run out slow?

If it doesn't start with the carb cleaner, look towards spark. A scan tool would be nice to check the crank sensor......

 

[wood4heat]

I didn't know it would fire on carb cleaner, I'll give that a try. I considered giving it a short shot of starting fluid but wasn't sure what it would do to the sensors or anything else.

When I popped the filter off fuel ran out but didn't seem to be under any pressure. I don't know what effect this has but I always take the fuel cap off when I'm replacing fuel filters hoping it will depressurize the system. Looking back maybe I shouldn't have done that this time.

 

[wood4heat]

If it doesn't start with the carb cleaner, look towards spark. A scan tool would be nice to check the crank sensor......

This could be my excuse to get an OBD II reader!

 

[TDunk]

I have had fuel pumps make noise before, but not build any pressure. Some dodges wont kick the pump on until the engine has built up oil pressure (not sure what years/models) Crank sensors are a pretty comman thing on chryslers. Shoot some starting fluid in the intake, if it starts then you have a fuel prob. If it doesn't start, pull a spark plug wire off and check for spark. If you have spark, check for injector pulses. If you have no injector pulses then it's probably the crank sensor. The only way to know for sure though is see if a mechanic will stop by after work and plug into the car with a scan tool. Best of luck.

 

[wood4heat]

The only way to know for sure though is see if a mechanic will stop by after work and plug into the car with a scan tool. Best of luck.

Do you think one of the $40.00 CEN TECH OBD II scan tools would do the trick? I might pick one up on my way home tonight and be done with it if so.

 

[goblin]

Off the top of my head.....vehicles that run fine and then all of a sudden quit and will not start again..... broke timing chain. Particularly given the age of the vehicle.

 

[wood4heat]

Off the top of my head.....vehicles that run fine and then all of a sudden quit and will not start again..... broke timing chain. Particularly given the age of the vehicle.

I hadn't thought about that. I just looked it up and his motor has a timing belt, 170,000 mi on the car. I'm a bit concerned. He's my wife's cousin and trying to put himself through college on a handful of part time jobs. I try to help him out when I can and wanted to fix this as an early Christmas present. Bent valves would be BAD news.

Guess I'll hold off on the scan tool until I pull the timing belt cover and see if it still has a belt.

 

[TDunk]

Rather than tear the timing covers off, just do a compression test. The plugs are real easy to get out on those engines. Usually when a belt breaks and you try to roll it over it'll make a diff. noise. I know this is corny but instead of the engine going ta-ta-ta-ta-ta-ta and fire up. When a belt breaks it'll have a constant wwwwaaaahhhhh noise while turing over. Worth checking into.

 

[TDunk]

Just did some checking. Those are an interference engine, so it the belt did break the valves are probably junk, but since he wasn't driving it he might be ok.

 

[wood4heat]

Rather than tear the timing covers off, just do a compression test. The plugs are real easy to get out on those engines. Usually when a belt breaks and you try to roll it over it'll make a diff. noise. I know this is corny but instead of the engine going ta-ta-ta-ta-ta-ta and fire up. When a belt breaks it'll have a constant wwwwaaaahhhhh noise while turing over. Worth checking into.

That makes sense, it does make the ta-ta-ta when turning over but sounds like its spinning pretty fast. I want to check the belt anyway. Even if it's not the problem I would like to see what kind of shape its in.

 

[TDunk]

That makes sense, it does make the ta-ta-ta when turning over but sounds like its spinning pretty fast. I want to check the belt anyway. Even if it's not the problem I would like to see what kind of shape its in.

Deffinetly a very good idea, especially with 170 K.

 

[2000ssm6]

Do you think one of the $40.00 CEN TECH OBD II scan tools would do the trick? I might pick one up on my way home tonight and be done with it if so.

The cheaper scan tools will only show the code and erase, no live data/parameters. I was speaking of a higher end scan tool that would show cranking rpm as the engine is spun over. Tdunk has given some great info. A compression check can help but remember if it has been spun over several times, the cylinders may be washed out from fuel(if you have pressure). Squirt a few drops of oil in the cylinder, if you think the compression reading could be false. Bent/f-ed up valves will show very little or 0 psi. With 170K, I would put on a new belt anyway. Alldata is saying 4.2 hrs to replace the belt and $92 msrp for a oem belt. Requires a 3 jaw puller for the crank pulley too.

 

[TDunk]

A compression check can help but remember if it has been spun over several times, the cylinders may be washed out from fuel(if you have pressure).

Many techs i know (my dad and my self included) have mis-diagnosed bent valves/f'd up valves due to the cylinders being washed down with fuel. I.E. No compression. Trust me, that's a mistake you'll only do once. But anyways that's some VERY good advice to try.

 

[wood4heat]

Thanks to all for the advice. I didn't have a chance to look at it last night and may not tonight. Got an e-mail from a friend about a broken four wheeler about an hour ago. She's suposed to load up and leave for the dunes tomorrow and it won't start so she's bringing it over tonight.

One of these days I'll gt back on my 250R project.

 

[wood4heat]

My wife hasn't been feeling to hot so I haven't had much of a chance to do anything with this car. Last night I got a neighbor to crank it over while I shot starting fluid at it and it sounded like it was firing but apparently it wont run on starting fluid alone. I looked around but didn't find any valve in the fuel line but I'm feeling better about my fuel pump theory. We're leaving for the beach tonight so I wont do anything else with it until Monday at the earliest.

I'll post again when I know more.

 

[wood4heat]

So I went back out there yesterday and I must of been looking too hard for that fuel valve. Once I quit looking in the deep dark recesses of the engine compartment I spotted it right up front plain as day. Anyway it seems to have plenty of fuel pressure so I borrowed a scan tool from a buddy and it has a code for "no signal at crank sensor". I called my tool loaning buddy and he thought the crank sensor on these was on the bell housing but he wasn't positive. I didn't see it but I was probably looking too hard again, anyone have any suggestions where I might find this thing?

edit: I told my buddy it sounded like it was firing when I sprayed starter fluid into it and he said that stuff will ignite on compression alone so I pulled a plug and it has no spark.

 

[TDunk]

I've got one in the garage right now. After lunch i'll put it on one of the racks and see if i can find it.

 

[wood4heat]

Thanks, I think I found its location online:

http://www.dodgeintrepidchat.net/02lhe/ "The crankshaft sensor is located on the passengers side of the transmission housing, above the differential housing. The bottom of the sensor sits above the drive plate."

It amazes me the stuff you can find on the web!

 

[TDunk]

I got side-tracked but that's where it at. Good luck.