Aftermarket Oil Seals for Stihl 045/056

[PogoInTheWoods]

Has anyone had experience with the aftermarket seals for the 1115 saws? I just installed them on an 045 rebuild and the flywheel side went in wayyyy too easy. Was a double lip rubber covered seal. PTO side was a normal double lip seal with a normal metal body. I always use Dirko on the O.D. just for good measure and that may be the only thing holding vac and pressure on the flywheel side at the moment. Can't say I have much faith in it for the long term, especially since this will be a guy's milling saw.

I can get an off-the-shelf SKF (which I would have thought the vendor would have included anyway since they're all of like 4 bux). Just don't have much faith in the one I installed and am less than thrilled with the particular vendor right about now.

Would be interested in anyone else's experience with these -- especially long term.

 

[hotshot]

Part numbers & manufacturer?

And no, I’ve never tried a “no name“ aftermarket seal in the 045 saws. Those thin width seals need to be metal cased in order to properly hold in the bore. I’ll pass on the coranochina crap!
.
As far as I’ve seen, in over 35 years, the PTO side seal & bearing was Stihl only. Seal is an oddball 23.8/33.4/4mm size.

However, I have seen a German outfit by the name of Saegenspezi that supposedly offered AFM, but would not provide their source/manufacturer.

The FW side is a standard 20/30/5mm metric.

 

[PogoInTheWoods]

PTO side is now being re-popped and appears to be a decent HMS5 RG type quality seal. No complaints there at all. F/W side not so much. As mentioned, an SKF is probably what I'll do for the F/W side because of not being comfortable with the ease of installation of the aftermarket. I was literally able to press it into position by hand just using a washer and minimal force. That said, it's held pressure for nearly 1/2 an hour and is going on that now with vacuum. Dirko is good stuff, but...

https://www.ebay.com/i/223018123652...pmqWrZ33-JWp9awaunC3Pj7_ZpUmJXLRoC25gQAvD_BwE

 

[hotshot]

Good luck with those, was the PTO side seal coated too?, looks like bare steel from the picture. CR/SKF 7906 works on the FW side, but it’s a single lip.

 

[PogoInTheWoods]

Bare steel as pictured (and as mentioned in my initial post).

 

[brandonstc6]

I have one NOS 045/056 clutch side seal.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[PogoInTheWoods]

CR/SKF 7906 works on the FW side, but it’s a single lip.

https://www.grainger.com/product/SKF-Dual-Lip-with-Spring-Rotary-40J974

I have one NOS 045/056 clutch side seal.

Could you post a pic? This is the OEM seal (presumably, since they were proprietary) that came out of the saw I'm working on. Basically the same rubberized type as the aftermarket Proline F/W side seal. Has BAB and the dimensions on it. I'm guessing it wasn't the original seal.

​

This is the Proline PTO seal installed. Metal body, double lip with spring. Very nice fit and far superior to the one I pulled out. Too bad you need to buy both of em to get one good one. That said, the Proline rubberized seal on the F/W side has held both 7 PSI and 12 inHg of vacuum rock solid for 24 hours each. I just don't trust it to last.

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[brandonstc6]

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[PogoInTheWoods]

Thank you. That's what I pulled out.

And disappointingly, I received the CR/SKF flywheel side seal today and it was not as pictured, but another ribbed cover seal like the Proline seal that's in there now, (but that I'm reluctant to use). I've never seen a coated/ribbed seal anywhere except in clamshells, but now one on each side of a 50 year old saw. Spooky, huh?

I'm honestly not sure what to do. Something tells me the CR/SKF version of the same coated seal that's in there now will also go in just as easily with hand pressure and a washer to seat it. It would be silly to remove the one that's there just to end up with the same exact situation again. So can anyone comment on whether there is that much of a difference in the fit between metal framed and ribbed/coated seals in traditional seal pockets? Like I said, they're certainly holding pressure and vacuum without issue. And the O.D. is also sealed with DirkoHT..., which may be the saving grace when all is said and done. Thing is, I always expect having to drive a seal into position. Not simply press it into position by hand.

I did notice today that customchainsawparts has an aftermarket seal set with both seals being steel framed. I'm guessing they're the Saegenspezi offering. Wish I'd have seen those initially.

And I misspoke/misunderstood about the HMS5 RG seal type being of the metal frame type. That designation is indeed for the ribbed/coated type..., at least in SKF terminology. Sorry if I misled anyone on that.

So I guess I'm back to the original question -- Does anyone have any experience with these seals? Or the coated ones in a traditional seal pocket application?

 

[PogoInTheWoods]

For the record, and as suspected would happen, the Proline f/w side seal failed to hold up. Also for the record, searching for a CR/SKF 7906 doesn't produce much in the way of tangible results as an alternative except for a place in Hungary.

Would be grateful for any suggestions to a source for a suitable f/w side seal. Everything I'm finding domestically in 20x30x5 seem to be the rubberized versions. Haven't gotten too deep into the cross-reference exercise yet. Saegenspezi in Germany has their aftermarket versions but still isn't shipping to the US.

 

[hotshot]

Would be grateful for any suggestions to a source for a suitable f/w side seal.

**** ton of those steel cased FW side seals for Stihl 045 & 056 (9633 003 2210) on fleabay, plus my Blue Mountain Texas dealer may have some too.

 

[Vintage Engine Repairs]

Thanks for the update pogo, it took me ages to find the OEM seals and bearings for the 045 I recently overhauled and I nearly went with the proline. OEM ones ended up appearing on eBay in the UK. They wouldn’t ship to Australia so I had them send it to my family home in the uk where they sent it to Australia. Not exactly a big deal, but inconvenient. Do keep us updated

edit to update: from memory, you can get double lipped FW side easily from any bearing supplier just not OEM (it’s the clutch side that’s proprietary and a PITA to find ).

At the time here in Aus they only had 7mm deep rather than 5mm. From memory, I think there is the clearance in the pocket. Worth checking. Request nitrile seals rather than rubber.

My experience of them is they go in like OEM - that is, requiring a few firm blows to seat them. You won’t get them in pressing by hand.

For a few dollars I’d suggest the tractor supply and see how you go.

 

[PogoInTheWoods]

**** ton of those steel cased FW side seals for Stihl 045 & 056 (9633 003 2210 ) on fleabay....

Thanks, Randy. Was wondering why my search didn't provide more results..., and why the part number I used looked a little weird. 4773 709 2102 is what's listed in my version of the SSC software as the current part number. Obviously an error since there is not even a 4773 prefix for anything in the Stihl parts and accessories price list. No part number evolution detailed in SSC, either. That said, that particular part number is indeed used to describe the f/w seal from a couple of aftermarket sources including Sawzilla/Proline and in the 1115 gasket kit Bryce sells.

from memory, you can get double lipped FW side easily from any bearing supplier just not OEM (it’s the clutch side that’s proprietary and a PITA to find )

And thank you, sir. Yes, there are plenty of sources for the double lipped nitrile seals. Unfortunately, they're primarily the rubber covered versions. I chose to inquire here before diving into the cross-referencing and telephone call routine just to find what should be a fairly common 20x30x5 seal with a completely steel body.

Kinda reluctant to buy a 50 year old OEM seal, but may not have much choice if I want the all steel version. May also give the one I got from Grainger a try to see if it's a better fit than the Proline. Was supposed to be a steel housing, but looks identical to the Proline and is probably from the same source.

I appreciate the input, fellas.

 

[Vintage Engine Repairs]

Thanks, Randy. Was wondering why my search didn't provide more results..., and why the part number I used looked a little weird. 4773 709 2102 is what's listed in my version of the SSC software as the current part number. Obviously an error since there is not even a 4773 prefix for anything in the Stihl parts and accessories price list. No part number evolution detailed in SSC, either. That said, that particular part number is indeed used to describe the f/w seal from a couple of aftermarket sources including Sawzilla/Proline and in the 1115 gasket kit Bryce sells.

And thank you, sir. Yes, there are plenty of sources for the double lipped nitrile seals. Unfortunately, they're primarily the rubber covered versions. I chose to inquire here before diving into the cross-referencing and telephone call routine just to find what should be a fairly common 20x30x5 seal with a completely steel body.

Kinda reluctant to buy a 50 year old OEM seal, but may not have much choice if I want the all steel version. May also give the one I got from Grainger a try to see if it's a better fit than the Proline. Was supposed to be a steel housing, but looks identical to the Proline and is probably from the same source.

I appreciate the input, fellas.

Keep us updated I must admit I have always had great luck with old OEM seals. Gaskets not so much!

 

[sean donato]

Just had an 045 av dropped off for me to get going again. (In 2 boxes disassembled) can't say I like what I've been reading about getting parts for them.

 

[PogoInTheWoods]

Parts can be had. Biggest challenge is finding a pto side bearing (if you need one). Treat the one it already has like gold.

And you're in the right place if you have questions.

 

[PogoInTheWoods]

Yay!

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[64poncho]

Put seals in an 031 that I got from EBay. They had a steel case. Actually looked real nice, fit well ! I used Loc-Tite
bearing retainer (green) on the outer rim. Worked great!

 

[PogoInTheWoods]

There are different viscosity bearing/sleeve retaining formulas. The key word there is 'retaining'. While they're great at filling gaps and retaining thread contact, they're technically thread lockers, not sealants. The super thin stuff can sneak right past a seal and into the bearing before it actually sets up permanently. Need to be careful when using something other than an actual silicon or solvent based sealant for crank seals..., depending on what type of seal pocket is involved and what you're trying to accomplish, of course. Lots of folks don't use anything at all and just drive the seal in. After all, that's pretty much how they come from the factory. I prefer a thin coat of Dirko, myself. Good stuff.

 

[cookies]

apply sealant and stake the case around them?