Beach Combing & Milling
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gr8scott72
Addicted to ArboristSite
Canada, almost as worthless as France. :greenchainsaw:
losttheplot
ArboristSite Lurker
Wow ! Not sure what I said to deserve having my head Cut off with a chain saw.
If I have offended anyone I apologize.
Avoir un bon soir.
If I have offended anyone I apologize.
Avoir un bon soir.
Don't worry about it - it is worth stating the relevant laws somewhere in the discussion. What an individual does about these is up to them.
gr8scott72
Addicted to ArboristSite
No one is offended. I, personally, am in disbelief of how many crazy rules you crazy canucks have.
I actually enjoyed reading all that you typed.
I was gonna ask about the effect of saltwater on your equipment. Seems it'd be tough on your saw. Do you wash it off with fresh water after you finish cutting?
Not that it matters anymore now that we know you will be drawn and quartered if you ever mill found wood again.
Not that it matters anymore now that we know you will be drawn and quartered if you ever mill found wood again.
losttheplot
ArboristSite Lurker
With fear of flogging a dead horse.
I am not against cutting drift wood. I was trying to give the OP some information he may like to know, other than the speculative things people were posting.
I may have come across a little biased so to keep a long story short.
The waterways of south coastal BC are mostly a series of passes, channels and protected bodies of water. The logging companies use these to transport the cut logs much like the rivers were once used in other parts of the continent.
A tug and 3 men will move as much wood as several hundred logging trucks.
The saw mills are/were located on the waterfront. They store their inventory in the water. Bad weather and bad handling techniques allow some logs to escape. These form the "driftwood".
My house fronts a channel of water approx 3 miles long and less than a mile wide. One side has several mills and the other is used as bulk log storage. Within a 5 mile radius of my house there are hundreds and hundreds of thousands of dollars stored in the water in the form of cut timber. No one guards these logs although some mills/tugs work 24hrs. (I can here them working at the moment)
If a log salvage guy were allowed to sell his wood to anyone, in any form, how would this be policed. If I were to take a trip in my boat at night I could have all the wood I wanted. If questioned I would say "I found it".
If I went to the beach, would I walk past the yellow cedar butt log to mill the half rotted spruce so the log salvage guy could have the good stuff ?
The coast of BC, from Washington to Alaska, is around 1000km, however it has over 25,000 KM of coast line. The timber is cut by multi national corporations. The log salvage guys number in their 10's. The rules are strict because there is no way to enforce any compromise. The rules as they stand sound good to a pen pusher 1000's of miles from here.
As far as regulations go I would say western Canada is paradise compared to European countries I have lived in. I also believe new chainsaws are compromised so they can be sold in certain states of America.
I am not saying milling driftwood is good or bad, I am just trying to ad information to the driftwood topic. Hopefully if someone reads about milling driftwood they are aware of all the pitfalls.
I know people that try to make a living from log salvage, people who mill drift wood and people who burn it for firewood. I have also damaged my boat by hitting it.
The U.S.A is as much good as a chocolate tea pot, especially their junior hockey team
oke:
I am not against cutting drift wood. I was trying to give the OP some information he may like to know, other than the speculative things people were posting.
I may have come across a little biased so to keep a long story short.
The waterways of south coastal BC are mostly a series of passes, channels and protected bodies of water. The logging companies use these to transport the cut logs much like the rivers were once used in other parts of the continent.
A tug and 3 men will move as much wood as several hundred logging trucks.
The saw mills are/were located on the waterfront. They store their inventory in the water. Bad weather and bad handling techniques allow some logs to escape. These form the "driftwood".
My house fronts a channel of water approx 3 miles long and less than a mile wide. One side has several mills and the other is used as bulk log storage. Within a 5 mile radius of my house there are hundreds and hundreds of thousands of dollars stored in the water in the form of cut timber. No one guards these logs although some mills/tugs work 24hrs. (I can here them working at the moment)
If a log salvage guy were allowed to sell his wood to anyone, in any form, how would this be policed. If I were to take a trip in my boat at night I could have all the wood I wanted. If questioned I would say "I found it".
If I went to the beach, would I walk past the yellow cedar butt log to mill the half rotted spruce so the log salvage guy could have the good stuff ?
The coast of BC, from Washington to Alaska, is around 1000km, however it has over 25,000 KM of coast line. The timber is cut by multi national corporations. The log salvage guys number in their 10's. The rules are strict because there is no way to enforce any compromise. The rules as they stand sound good to a pen pusher 1000's of miles from here.
As far as regulations go I would say western Canada is paradise compared to European countries I have lived in. I also believe new chainsaws are compromised so they can be sold in certain states of America.
I am not saying milling driftwood is good or bad, I am just trying to ad information to the driftwood topic. Hopefully if someone reads about milling driftwood they are aware of all the pitfalls.
I know people that try to make a living from log salvage, people who mill drift wood and people who burn it for firewood. I have also damaged my boat by hitting it.
The U.S.A is as much good as a chocolate tea pot, especially their junior hockey team
oke:I was gonna ask about the effect of saltwater on your equipment. Seems it'd be tough on your saw. Do you wash it off with fresh water after you finish cutting?
Not that it matters anymore now that we know you will be drawn and quartered if you ever mill found wood again.
Chain looks a little rusty after milling but looks ok after next use. Mill only rusts on wear areas and rust wears off on next use. Muffler on the 365 seems to be getting a little rusty. Bar seems ok to. The bar oil keeps most things from rusting to much and most of the saw is plastic anyway.
Andrew96
ArboristSite Operative
That makes me laugh....I like a good bit of US bashing. Its funny...we sell them hydro...clean water..., fuel, wood of all kinds at 1980s prices (thanks to Nafta), provide them with all the good actors, comedians, good medical treatments..., put up with their wars....one week it's terror..the next?, then they bash away. Better watch it...we 'might' turn off your light switch and faucet.
Above is all in fun.
However, Losttheplot, I'm glad you wrote some of the rules out. I have lots of family over on the island and whenever I visit they always want to take me to some beach. I cannot see the beach for the Logs. I joke about how "polluted" their beaches are and how I should cut some of it up. It really get's them wound up (little sister a bit of a granola girl). I understand it a bit better now.
I kind of thought the BC softwood industry was so good that other countries have used it as a model to modify their own? Even if they mess up the beaches a bit. Kind of like the UN just used the Canadian banking system as a world model. (Don't mention that to the US people...they might figure out why everyone down there is loosing their houses).
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mtngun
Addicted to ArboristSite
Canadian laws are not that much different than U.S..
In many U.S. states, it is illegal to salvage logs from lakes and rivers without the proper permit.
Typical woodcutting permits discourage hobby milling by limiting the lengths of wood. Forest Service rule is 8 foot, my state has a 4 foot limit.
Some states require each pick up load of firewood to be tagged, similar to tagging a deer. If caught with an untagged load, you can be fined and lose your woodcutting permit.
These rules are intended to discourage commercial poaching of timber, which is a big problem in some parts of the world. However, it is not a big problem in the Western U.S., because softwoods are not very valuable and logging costs are very high.
These rules are frustrating to the hobby miller because there is lots and lots of deadwood in western forests that is rotting and/or fueling wildfires.
My personal moral code is to buy whatever permits they are selling, take only deadwood that would otherwise rot, don't take wood that is part of a timber sale, and if I should happen to bend the rules a little, don't get caught.
In many U.S. states, it is illegal to salvage logs from lakes and rivers without the proper permit.
Typical woodcutting permits discourage hobby milling by limiting the lengths of wood. Forest Service rule is 8 foot, my state has a 4 foot limit.
Some states require each pick up load of firewood to be tagged, similar to tagging a deer. If caught with an untagged load, you can be fined and lose your woodcutting permit.
These rules are intended to discourage commercial poaching of timber, which is a big problem in some parts of the world. However, it is not a big problem in the Western U.S., because softwoods are not very valuable and logging costs are very high.
These rules are frustrating to the hobby miller because there is lots and lots of deadwood in western forests that is rotting and/or fueling wildfires.
My personal moral code is to buy whatever permits they are selling, take only deadwood that would otherwise rot, don't take wood that is part of a timber sale, and if I should happen to bend the rules a little, don't get caught.
clearance
Addicted to ArboristSite
The loggers and the sawmill guys sure have been innovative and smart, but the big picture, no way. Very complex topic.
Andrew96
ArboristSite Operative
It's been a very interesting topic. I hope I'm not just naive but I'm not aware of any permits or anything required in Ontario. I don't really do much milling on crown land but finding a good fallen tree is all that's stopping me. The lumber industry rarely uses waterways for log moving around here so the only thing you do is stay out of an area they are actively logging. I know the working guys are very suspicious when you show up in the woods until they find out what you are up too. Sounds like you guys all have a bit more hassle to go through with permits and everything.
Canadian laws are not that much different than U.S..
In many U.S. states, it is illegal to salvage logs from lakes and rivers without the proper permit.
Typical woodcutting permits discourage hobby milling by limiting the lengths of wood. Forest Service rule is 8 foot, my state has a 4 foot limit.
Some states require each pick up load of firewood to be tagged, similar to tagging a deer. If caught with an untagged load, you can be fined and lose your woodcutting permit.
These rules are intended to discourage commercial poaching of timber, which is a big problem in some parts of the world. However, it is not a big problem in the Western U.S., because softwoods are not very valuable and logging costs are very high.
These rules are frustrating to the hobby miller because there is lots and lots of deadwood in western forests that is rotting and/or fueling wildfires.
My personal moral code is to buy whatever permits they are selling, take only deadwood that would otherwise rot, don't take wood that is part of a timber sale, and if I should happen to bend the rules a little, don't get caught.
This reminds me of eastern and western water law in the U. S. Very different legal history, laws and regulations.
As far as I know, in most of the southeast U.S. you can do what you want with wood. Some highly populated cities/counties have rules about cutting but generally out in the sticks you can do with it what you want as long as you're not stealing or trespassing.
mtngun
Addicted to ArboristSite
It's been a while, but years ago Norm Abram did a TV show on salvaging cypress logs from a river somewhere in the South East. Florida or Georgia or some such place. The logs had sunk to the bottom of the river, leftover from a logging operation in the olden days. The salvage logger was dredging up these sunken logs and selling the cypress boards to woodworkers like Norm. A special permit was required to salvage the logs.
When I was growing up in Arkansas, the bayous along the major rivers were chock full of cypress, including thousands of fallen dead cypress. I never saw anyone trying to salvage it -- there may not have been much demand for cypress wood back then. Boy, if I lived there now, and if it were legal, I'd be making lots of cypress sawdust.
Yeah, the laws for the woods and wood cutting here are all messed up. It is a hodgepodge of stuff that big timber companies wanted at one time or another, then filtered through what a man in an office back east thought it should read like. Taken all together you have a mess.
Despite all that you still have hard working men and women making a living and taking care of their families. Good people trying to make the rules work in a sensible manner, apply them fair and just for all involved.
You still have theft of forest products too. People will steal anything.
We tease our forest patrol guys "Did you catch anyone today smuggling the endangered wooly rock?"
Most timber companies have their own security people and they patrol land owned by the timber companies. Mostly they are keeping the violent tree huggers from destroying trees and machines. They also keep out the party kids and poachers, but those seem to be a minor problem overall.
A few years back we had a running war over mushrooms, the legal kind.
Competing families of mushroom hunters were shooting it out in the woods over the best picking grounds. That is what happens when stuff is worth a lot of money.
Not really forest products related but you know the number one reason to take a gun when hunting? To protect yourself from the people who shoot hunters.
Might sound crazy, but it has happened a few times and the eco-freaks are training more people to do it. There is some indication that they plan to target loggers too. Stay safe out there.
Mr. HE
Despite all that you still have hard working men and women making a living and taking care of their families. Good people trying to make the rules work in a sensible manner, apply them fair and just for all involved.
You still have theft of forest products too. People will steal anything.
We tease our forest patrol guys "Did you catch anyone today smuggling the endangered wooly rock?"
Most timber companies have their own security people and they patrol land owned by the timber companies. Mostly they are keeping the violent tree huggers from destroying trees and machines. They also keep out the party kids and poachers, but those seem to be a minor problem overall.
A few years back we had a running war over mushrooms, the legal kind.
Competing families of mushroom hunters were shooting it out in the woods over the best picking grounds. That is what happens when stuff is worth a lot of money.
Not really forest products related but you know the number one reason to take a gun when hunting? To protect yourself from the people who shoot hunters.
Might sound crazy, but it has happened a few times and the eco-freaks are training more people to do it. There is some indication that they plan to target loggers too. Stay safe out there.
Mr. HE
losttheplot
ArboristSite Lurker
I took my camera down to the beach today. There is a little poplar stump that fell off the cliff and has been washing around for years.
Curiosity finally got me to open it up.
Hopefully this picture thing works OK.
Curiosity finally got me to open it up.
Hopefully this picture thing works OK.
mtngun
Addicted to ArboristSite
I can believe that. I've seen people get pretty pushy over a patch of huckleberries.A few years back we had a running war over mushrooms, the legal kind.
Competing families of mushroom hunters were shooting it out in the woods over the best picking grounds.
Around here, that would be other hunters. :agree2:
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mtngun
Addicted to ArboristSite
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