Best 11mm climbline?

[TrillPhil]

I'm thinking of trying this line out, it's not specifically for tree use something like 7,500 and 6,500 minimum tensile strength, 8lbs per 100ft, and 600ft is the price of 200ft of any other climbing line.

http://www.fsbraiding.com/index.htm

I was asking him questions about it and this was the response

"We manufacture our own line so we know it is high quality. The is 100% polyester which has a 15% elongation at break and
minimum tensile would be 6500 lbs. You should have a large safety faction for this usage.You can also go to our 5/8" size if the rope is getting alot of abrasion. There are no yarn stops or starts in this rope ,each yarn runs the full length of the rope."

And also

This is 48 strand cover and 24 strand core.

I'm not sure if I'm missing something that is important. And if polyester or polypropelyne is better.

 

[arborsoldier]

I'm thinking of trying this line out, it's not specifically for tree use something like 7,500 and 6,500 minimum tensile strength, 8lbs per 100ft, and 600ft is the price of 200ft of any other climbing line.

http://www.fsbraiding.com/index.htm

I was asking him questions about it and this was the response

"We manufacture our own line so we know it is high quality. The is 100% polyester which has a 15% elongation at break and
minimum tensile would be 6500 lbs. You should have a large safety faction for this usage.You can also go to our 5/8" size if the rope is getting alot of abrasion. There are no yarn stops or starts in this rope ,each yarn runs the full length of the rope."

And also

This is 48 strand cover and 24 strand core.

I'm not sure if I'm missing something that is important. And if polyester or polypropelyne is better.

Seems to me that 15% elongation would feel like climbing on a rubber band. Most Arborist lines are under 3%, with the max being around 4.5%. Just thought I would throw that out there. Too much stretch can make extra work for yourself.

 

[pdqdl]

No, that is only 15% elongation at breaking strength. Stable braid is polyester, so we should presume that they are similar in stretch. How they are woven would have an influence on stretch, too.

Stable braid is 3% stretch at only 30% of breaking strength. Most rope manufacturers don't publish the stretch at breaking strength, so we really can't compare.

 

[TrillPhil]

Seems to me that 15% elongation would feel like climbing on a rubber band. Most Arborist lines are under 3%, with the max being around 4.5%. Just thought I would throw that out there. Too much stretch can make extra work for yourself.

I noticed that too but wasn't sure if they were measured differently. For example look at this chart

This is in relation to Yale XTC blaze and blue moon 24strand. Which I was under the impression were some of the lowest elongating and equivalent to pi.

I can imagine that since it is not a polyester/nylon blend it may have more elongation than say blue moon or ivy... Also I'm 190lbs so I don't think it will be too bad, if I don't like then I have 3 200' 1/2" rigging lines.

chart from: http://www.yalecordage.com/arborist-rope/climber-s-line/xtc-24-strand.html

 

[arborsoldier]

No, that is only 15% elongation at breaking strength. Stable braid is polyester, so we should presume that they are similar in stretch. How they are woven would have an influence on stretch, too.

Stable braid is 3% stretch at only 30% of breaking strength. Most rope manufacturers don't publish the stretch at breaking strength, so we really can't compare.

My bad!!! A simple misunderstanding!!

 

[WolverineMarine]

Hmmm..seems like alot of you guys like the Fly..my only qualm with that is its low breaking strength..now I'm not saying I'm a giant guy..5'10" and 195..I just want a little more..assurance...if something happens..theres a guy here in town that all he does is sell lines..for like anything you can imagine..climbing ropes like from back in grade school to our rigging lines and everything else you can imagine..I might hit him up and see if he'll let me demo one or 2 or see if he has one of those he recommends..thanks for the input guys..I appreciate it..hope you all had a nice holiday!

 

[pdqdl]

Trillphil, that is a very informative chart you found. I didn't know that any of the rope makers published that kind of information.

A really dedicated arborist could learn the weight per foot of their rope, the density of their tree variety, measure the size & distance a log was going to fall, and could make a pretty scientific guess as to whether the rope would hold.

Of course, we would probably need to invite Moray along to do all that math for us!

 

[JCONN]

I have to say that I switched to poison ivy about a year ago with a bee line tail and I love it. However this is the only other line besides the half inch high vee that I learned on.

 

[TreeAce]

Can anyone recommend a climbing line that doesn't "hackle" up ? I get so tired of my rope turnin into a twisted cork screw lookn mess all twisted all crazy n stuck under my blakes . I like my blue moon but it still hackels up to much . I had used arbormaster and I thought it hackled up unGodly bad . That rope is tough as heck though . Is the FLY noticably thinner than blue moon? I wouldn't want anything thinner than 11.7 or whatever blue moon is suppossed to be,my hands are kinda big . Also been wanten to tryn lava/tachyon (samething right?). Did my old safety blue twist and hackle like that and I just don't remember?? Maybe....I only remember the good times.....

 

[moss]

Can anyone recommend a climbing line that doesn't "hackle" up ? I get so tired of my rope turnin into a twisted cork screw lookn mess all twisted all crazy n stuck under my blakes .

Never climbed a rope that didn't get hackled by a hitch if given the opportunity. Is the tail of your rope hanging free enough while you're climbing? If not making that happen will solve your problem is well as it can be solved. If you have too much rope on the ground for the usual trees you work in try climbing on a shorter rope.
-AJ

 

[TreeAce]

Never climbed a rope that didn't get hackled by a hitch if given the opportunity. Is the tail of your rope hanging free enough while you're climbing? If not making that happen will solve your problem is well as it can be solved. If you have too much rope on the ground for the usual trees you work in try climbing on a shorter rope.
-AJ

The tail of my rope is just goin through a minder that I clip with a small biner to the bottom ring of my swivel that is on the bridge of my sequoia .It even twists so bad sometimes that the swivel on my saddle is twisting and the minder is like ..tryn to twist with it but can't . The way to fix it (at that moment) is to actually get wieght off of rope and the hold blakes with one hand and then twist line back the other way...clock wise..ya , it always seems to twist counter clockwise . I wouldn't think length of rope could matter could it? But I was wondering....just tossin this out there....if a rope is dirty could that make it twist more? Just a thought cuz I would SWEAR it wasnt that bad when it (my bluemoon) was new . As I recall I was happy as ever with it .( I still like it ,pretty much) Thanks for your input .

 

[TrillPhil]

Do you coil your rope or use a bag? I coil mine opposite everytime... I think it helps a little.

also pdqdl, yale has those specs published for most of their arborist lines.

 

[pdqdl]

TreeAce: It occurs to me that there are two kinds of "hockling", and I don't know which is the problem. Quite frankly, I have never had a climbing line cause any sort of bunching up problems since I gave up 3-strand twist rope.

problem #1: twists in the rope cause kinking when they are accumulated by the friction hitch. Solution: make sure there are no twists in your rope!
[twists are usually accumulated by coiling the rope in arm lengths, then pulling the coils off the laid down pile of coils. Each arm length adds a twist when it gets pulled off the pile.]

problem #2: double braided or kernmantle rope is loosely assembled and the cover swells up and bunches in front of the friction hitch. Solution: seal one end of the rope, binding the cover to the core. Stretch it all out, milking the slack out of the rope. Burn/glue/whip, or knot the second end so that the cover is the same length as the core.

problem #2 is a bigger problem on long runs of rope when you get close to the end of the rope. Problem #1 seems to go away completely if you flake your rope into a bag with no coiling whatsoever.

About 1/2 my ropes are stored in coils, and I just put a reverse direction coil in the bunch whenever I feel a twist accumulating. Sometimes I let a coil form a figure-8, other times I just store the twist on the "backside" of the coil instead of the front. This style of coiling a rope forces you to uncoil the the rope one coil at a time! No tossing on the ground and feeding it into the tree.

I coil bigger ropes by tossing a loop over my neck and down in front of the opposite shoulder. Left shoulder, right shoulder, left...Each coil is in the opposite direction and there are no twists in the rope. As with my other method of coiling, you can't just throw the bundle on the ground and have it feed nicely into the tree. Uncoil it first, tossing each coil on the ground. Start up the tree with the last coil you throw on the ground; no problems!

I hope these comments are some help; I'm not trying to tell you how to coil your rope. Almost every climber I have hired has coiled his ropes differently, and not all methods are equal. I had one climber that could coil his rope up, then just toss it on the ground and feed it into the tree. I never got the hang of how he did it; particularly since he never seemed to have twists, either.

 

[Slvrmple72]

I flake my rope into rubbermaid totes, no coiling, no problems.

Been using Velocity and XTC Dragonfly but tend to favor the XTC more. I do not think I will be going back to the big heavy half-inch line ever again. Put Poison Hivy on the Christmas wishlist.

 

[himiler]

Friend of mine that works for Oncor Electric in Texas showed me a trick with long extension cords that I'm interested to see if anyone else knows. Since extension cords have a twisted strand inner core, a covering, and then an outer jacket I'm thinking it's a lot like climbing and rigging ropes.
He would take the first coil and lay it normally in his hand, the second coil he would flip underhand and lay that then alternate back and forth. When it came time for him to use the cord he would just hold on to the male end and toss the rest. He never got tangles and never had any hockling.
I'll get my teenage daughter or son to show me how to post a video if I can get em to stop long enough, then hopefully the picture will make more sense than this weak explanation.
Steve W.

 

[TreeAce]

Thanks guys! pdqdl...I am thinkn its problem 2 . Cuz like I said before...didn't seem so bad when it was new . Ya know how bluemoon has a red flake in it? Well , sometimes it twists so bad that that red is actually like..like..it looks like a drill bit turning slowly in a drill as it goes through (up) my blakes . Does that make sense ? Anyway...I will milk it and see if that helps . I did notice one end had about a 1/4 or 3/8 inch of core sticking out . I figured not enough to matter .And when I look at it and when this problem bothers me...I am busy !! LOL . Shawn at WesSpur told me last year how to use 2 rubber bungee straps to milk a rope . Basically just find center point of rope put that to something secure . attache each bungee to a side of the rope like a prusik . Just one time through though otherwise it will never slide . And then tell someone to pull evenly on these bungees and walk backwards . Find a chair . Do that a few times . It worked great on my double E work rope. You may have to pull bungees yourself : )

 

[Damon]

I coil bigger ropes by tossing a loop over my neck and down in front of the opposite shoulder. Left shoulder, right shoulder, left...Each coil is in the opposite direction and there are no twists in the rope. As with my other method of coiling, you can't just throw the bundle on the ground and have it feed nicely into the tree. Uncoil it first, tossing each coil on the ground. Start up the tree with the last coil you throw on the ground; no problems!

.

this is how i coil all my ropes, the reason is simple my back has know problem suporting the weight of 3/4 bull rope where as my arm does,

sometimes i speed coil rope which is when you pull about 4 feet at a wack and intentionally impart half a twist and then the next pull you impart it in the opposite direction, on the last pull you take the last loop flip it under and through the coil and tie it to the bitter end with an over hand knot

i know this is a poor discription perhaps ill video the process one of these days, but it completely iliminates and twisting



Tom

 

[pdqdl]

this is how i coil all my ropes, the reason is simple my back has know problem suporting the weight of 3/4 bull rope where as my arm does,
...
Tom

Yep. Big, heavy rope. Too much for one hand, no matter how strong your arm!

That's why I do the "over the shoulders" coil too.

 

[pdqdl]

...

He would take the first coil and lay it normally in his hand, the second coil he would flip underhand and lay that then alternate back and forth. When it came time for him to use the cord he would just hold on to the male end and toss the rest. He never got tangles and never had any hockling.
...Steve W.

That is pretty much how I coil my rope, but it tangles up if I just toss it on the ground. It only takes about one minute to uncoil it, rather than tossing, so I prefer to not risk any tangles. Tangles take WAY longer than one minute to fix.

 

[WolverineMarine]

I have rope bags..I hate coiling the damn stuff..twists never bother me..I just pull the free end out of the bag when I start..stuff it back in when I'm done..coiling takes too damn long..I know to some of you guys that learned climbing old school take pride in a perfect coil job..but I like having my bag to go kinda like my rappeling lines..