Biner, Snap or Knot?

[tree MDS]

The only time we use a Biner is when the ground'y can't untie a Knot

Yeah, I'm not seeing any significant time savings happening with a biner..

Groundy that can't untie a knot? I've had my share of bad ones, but they all managed that one..

 

[TonyX3M]

The only time we use a Biner is when the ground'y can't untie a Knot

Oh, I've seen some some groundys who couldn't untie their shoelaces - I always tell them "work smarter not harder - get you some slack in line !" 8 out of ten times newbies just don't listen - I would of get myself fired when I started, over stuff like that -we even took climbers spikes off for him- climber waiting for a goundy -that was unheard of!!!

 

[tree MDS]

Oh, I've seen some some groundys who couldn't untie their shoelaces - I always tell them "work smarter not harder - get you some slack in line !" 8 out of ten times newbies just don't listen - I would of get myself fired when I started, over stuff like that -we even took climbers spikes off for him- climber waiting for a goundy -that was unheard of!!!

Any dude asks you to take his spikes off for him deserves fifty rapid to the head with a pole saw section.. just saying.

BTW: welcome to the site!

 

[TonyX3M]

Hell fire son - that is hes saying - but I do agree to take your spikes off if yo have actively climbing over 40 years -if not for nothing else I do respect elderly
BTW thank you

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Larry, that is almost a marl, your turn is upside down. It adds that extra twist in the line.

A marl is like what you start tying your shoes with, and overhand knot; but with a load in the turn.

It should dress out neatly and tail fair to the backup, which you are using a running bo'lin.

This is a marline, note the z-like pattern that forms with the dress. Here is an animation:

http://www.marinews.com/Marline-Hitch-615.php

The importance is that the bend of the line is less acute, which means a higher WLL.

Do i make sense?

 

[treeclimber101]

I used a biner once on wood and bent it at the gate , so it wouldn't open and we had to beat it off, first and last time ....

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

I used a biner once on wood and bent it at the gate , so it wouldn't open and we had to beat it off, first and last time ....

I was running ropes once and watched the gate roll open, and the rod start to bend. Got it on the ground in the nick of time. Tensioning the system moved the carabiner, and the knurling on the gate hung up on the bark, the movement was in the direction of turn to open the gate....

 

[treeclimber101]

I was running ropes once and watched the gate roll open, and the rod start to bend. Got it on the ground in the nick of time. Tensioning the system moved the carabiner, and the knurling on the gate hung up on the bark, the movement was in the direction of turn to open the gate....

It seems a little dangerous to use too many parts in the rigging I like rope to tree and on the ground rope to a porta wrap , I have started to use a false crotch in removals as well , ropes have jumped alot in price ..

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

It seems a little dangerous to use too many parts in the rigging I like rope to tree and on the ground rope to a porta wrap , I have started to use a false crotch in removals as well , ropes have jumped alot in price ..

It is when you do not understand the forces involved, add new things a few at a time. Even when you've been doing things for years, you can be thrown for a loop.

I will not use sewn loops, because I have seen two cut themselves under light loading. One edge abrades another and cuts like butter.

 

[treeclimber101]

It is when you do not understand the forces involved, add new things a few at a time. Even when you've been doing things for years, you can be thrown for a loop.

I will not use sewn loops, because I have seen two cut themselves under light loading. One edge abrades another and cuts like butter.

Less moving parts the better for me , I even keep my saddle simple , I think that when you physically tire , your already mentally tired and forgetful ...

 

[treemandan]

Very creative John. I'm gonna give that one a try.

OK, here is the knot I tie to back up my rigging knots. I'm not good with names. Marl, overhand, half hitch?

Oh yeah! I see it now. Not! And I just use a knot too.

 

[tree md]

Larry, that is almost a marl, your turn is upside down. It adds that extra twist in the line.

A marl is like what you start tying your shoes with, and overhand knot; but with a load in the turn.

It should dress out neatly and tail fair to the backup, which you are using a running bo'lin.

This is a marline, note the z-like pattern that forms with the dress. Here is an animation:

http://www.marinews.com/Marline-Hitch-615.php

The importance is that the bend of the line is less acute, which means a higher WLL.

Do i make sense?

Yep, makes perfect sense. Looks like I've been tying it backwards. I've studied it in the ABOK and I think I've even got a Sherrill shirt with it illustrated on the front. Just kind of hard to translate what you see in an illustration to a real world application sometimes...

 

[pdqdl]

I only use hardware for a termination when the load is light.

Regardless of the load rating of the hardware used, the radius of the rope bending around small diameter steel weakens it. You will break the rope at a load much reduced from the rated capacity.

I broke a 3/4" bull rope once using a rescue-8 as a friction device. The rope went "PING", and I crushed a stone wall. That same rope had handled many larger loads before, but it couldn't handle the shear going around the 1/2" round steel.

The rescue-8 was unblemished.

 

[mattfr12]

Almost 25 years now and a marl and running bowline have yet to fail me.

for sure ive yet to see a half hitch slip off if seated properly let alone a marl slipping.

 

[sgreanbeans]

we use both, always watching the dynamic load, I dont like butt hitching big stuff with biners, but I have. Have never had one fail(yet). I like using them with the i2i big green sling at Sherrill, I like the speed of the biners as goundies move faster, also, I take up multiple sets, so while I am waiting for the rope, I can set another and soon as I get it, I clip in and send another to them,job moves real fast that way. I always use a false crotch (CMI stainless), tired of ropes getting burnt from running over the bark
In other words, I use alot of metal! I trust it pretty well, as long as you stay within its KN rating it should be fine. The thing I look at is the gate, I like the ones with the screw gate, the twist ones make me nervous as I think it would be possible to flip one open in mid air with a big swing, so I stay away from those.

 

[Bermie]

I have a steel biner in the end of my 9/16 bull rope...

Either I use a 1 ton polyester round sling (the slings are those nice fat soft ones, polyester core with a cover, they have no sharp edges) and clip the biner to it...or...tie the half hitch/clove hitch and the biner finishes the knot...clipped.

That is, until Saturday when my rigging kit fell off the bucket truck (I didn't load it) bye bye, 200' of 9/16, two steel biners, two 1 ton round slings, 1- 6" cmi pulley and two log tongs...

 

[tree md]

I have a steel biner in the end of my 9/16 bull rope...

Either I use a 1 ton polyester round sling (the slings are those nice fat soft ones, polyester core with a cover, they have no sharp edges) and clip the biner to it...or...tie the half hitch/clove hitch and the biner finishes the knot...clipped.

That is, until Saturday when my rigging kit fell off the bucket truck (I didn't load it) bye bye, 200' of 9/16, two steel biners, two 1 ton round slings, 1- 6" cmi pulley and two log tongs...

Ouch! That's gotta hurt.

 

[Bermie]

Ouch! That's gotta hurt.

Yeah...at least $350...on a $150 job No sign of it, checked and rechecked the route...radio announcements, called the talk show...facebooked...nada

 

[tree md]

The whole neighborhood is prolly hanging clothes on it now...

 

[Bermie]

The whole neighborhood is prolly hanging clothes on it now...

Or got their boats tied up nice and tight for the storm...