CANADA (bc) CUA vs FALLER whos got the better shot?

[raininbrush]

Hey everybody.....

The question that gets everyone goin, who has better aim? A Certified Utilty Arborist? or a Certified Faller?

In my own opinion, Being a CUA myself, I believe we have the better shots. Theres been times where if I was 10 degrees off, I could nail the three phase and put my crew in immense danger.... I believe that fallers have a little bit more play on where their trees land. Im not saying one job is more dangerous than the other

Anyone out there feel the same? Argument against?

Not looking for a huge fight haha, just a heated discussion....

 

[Tree Pig]

I am not sure I have never cut with a professional feller but I would have to guess just by shear numbers (them dropping 10,20, 30 trees a day) that they have far more practice and though they may not need pinpoint accuracy they have it if needed.

I am sure you can find top notch people on both sides though. A best of the best competition would be something to watch. Also you can leave the Arborist tag off the end, you would have to include the numerous tree removal professionals that have also polished their skills (just to expand your heated debate)

 

[Hddnis]

I would suspect that either profession is good at what they do. Saying a feller does not have to be as precise shows a glaring lack of understanding of the work that fellers do.


Mr. HE

 

[raininbrush]

I would suspect that either profession is good at what they do. Saying a feller does not have to be as precise shows a glaring lack of understanding of the work that fellers do.


Mr. HE

Point taken, I understand that fallers do have the dangers of snags, hangers etc... However a partner at my company is a cert. faller with 15 years production logging exp. and feels the same way i do.... powerline vs snag, its a close match, with the power line 33 ft around the base of the tree is going to be energized, which could take more lives than just the guy falling the tree... But a snag can blow into pieces and create a hazardous area that could be over 100ft, so its definately close, theres a lot of CUAs out there, who have bought their way in, and cant direct a tree without a rope and I have personally gone through over 11 certified fallers who couldnt cut their way out of a wet paper bag.... I only give a natural bias because of my own title.... i cut on a conventionl block for a little over a year so i have a vague understanding, not a glaring lack thereof:check:

 

[Rftreeman]

I am not sure I have never cut with a professional feller but I would have to guess just by shear numbers (them dropping 10,20, 30 trees a day) that they have far more practice and though they may not need pinpoint accuracy they have it if needed.

I am sure you can find top notch people on both sides though. A best of the best competition would be something to watch. Also you can leave the Arborist tag off the end, you would have to include the numerous tree removal professionals that have also polished their skills (just to expand your heated debate)

CUA's can dropped some big numbers also, get on a transmission ROW were you don't trim, you notch and watch, I've had days were I probably cut a 100 trees or more as for who is better, I don't think one is better than the other but utility guys do have a higher risk factor because there's the risk of falling trees then you throw high voltage lines on top of that.

 

[raininbrush]

CUA's can dropped some big numbers also, get on a transmission ROW were you don't trim, you notch and watch

you notch and watch.... well put very well put

I hear ya on those green and yellows, they gave a close buddy of mine the shaft as well...

 

[Rftreeman]

you notch and watch.... well put very well put

I hear ya on those green and yellows, they gave a close buddy of mine the shaft as well...

yep, push pole heaven.......

the lay off was pretty much a blessing, gave me the reason to go full-time owner/operator..to hell with working for the man anymore..........

 

[raininbrush]

Haha yeah there's 3 guys I know up here in Canada who have done the exactly the same thing, and said they wish they had done it sooner, enough of the politics eh

 

[clearance]

Rope in the tree ain't really falling

If you are falling trees beside a powerline in B.C. you have to have a rope in the tree, that is a rule cast in stone, by B.C. Hydro. If you are falling in the bush, no rope. I have fell many trees without a rope, beside the line many times, its a lot more fun, but not allowed.

I have heard a few cuas talk about how they are good fallers and some are certified fallers, but they have never been production fallers. I can fall, but compared to an experienced west coast production faller, I am nothing special. I have worked with a couple, and I am glad I did, they are not the climber or bucket guy I am, and they don't have a problem admitting it. And thats the way it should be.

 

[raininbrush]

If you are falling trees beside a powerline in B.C. you have to have a rope in the tree, that is a rule cast in stone, by B.C. Hydro. If you are falling in the bush, no rope. I have fell many trees without a rope, beside the line many times, its a lot more fun, but not allowed.

I have heard a few cuas talk about how they are good fallers and some are certified fallers, but they have never been production fallers. I can fall, but compared to an experienced west coast production faller, I am nothing special. I have worked with a couple, and I am glad I did, they are not the climber or bucket guy I am, and they don't have a problem admitting it. And thats the way it should be.

Yeah ropes ropes and more ropes, no harm in em, i wouldnt want my ticket pulled by hydro if they figured it out tho, too big of a risk, they just make you re write pssp i believe, however i couldnt afford insurance after a tree went through the line... havent had it happen personally, but i rope anything that could potentially hit just because i wouldnt want to deal with the **** show that followed.... ive seen and want no part of that situation let me tell ya

 

[TreeClimber57]

I would suspect that either profession is good at what they do. Saying a feller does not have to be as precise shows a glaring lack of understanding of the work that fellers do.


Mr. HE

Agreed. Fellers do some very precise and dangerous work. You may look at them on the television, working in the middle of thousands of acres of wilderness.. and precision may not be needed 90% of the time there.. but don't think they do not pick their spot and drop where they want to. (their main reason here is usually easy extraction and lower cost) However, there are times when fellers are doing work near hydro lines, transformer stations, etc and precision is paramount. They can drop it on a dime if needed, at least the good ones can. I would put my money with a good feller personally, they typically have a lot more experience in dropping big trees and dropping them where they need to be dropped. Not saying others can't and don't do it, but they do not have nearly the practice.

 

[Tree Pig]

CUA's can dropped some big numbers also, get on a transmission ROW were you don't trim, you notch and watch, I've had days were I probably cut a 100 trees or more as for who is better, I don't think one is better than the other but utility guys do have a higher risk factor because there's the risk of falling trees then you throw high voltage lines on top of that.

Hmmm well Ill have to chalk that one up to my lack of knowledge on what a CAU does.

 

[Blakesmaster]

I'd have to go with a feller. When working residential and commercial trees there's no room for error so we take less risks. We have the equipment to take a tree apart in pieces so we obviously use it if there's any potential for something to go wrong. In the woods though, if a tree goes bad on ya, you only need to worry about getting out of the way and a little loss in production not losing your insurance or everything you've worked for so you take more risks and learn more about felling in doing so. If you've ever spent some time doing lot clearing or logging you know this. You learn how to spin trees 180 degrees off their lean without wedges, how to use other trees to push bad leaners or hangers over, pulling #### off that you'd never try next to a 2 million dollar home or serious juice. And they do this all day everyday. Yeah, they're gonna be a TON more skilled at felling than your average bucketman or climber.

 

[Nailsbeats]

I am gonna say it's the man behind the saw not the title behind the man that matters here. Many guys that can put a tree on a dime have worn many hats, it's not an exclusive club.

 

[TreeClimber57]

I am gonna say it's the man behind the saw not the title behind the man that matters here. Many guys that can put a tree on a dime have worn many hats, it's not an exclusive club.

That I would agree with for sure.

 

[Bearcreek]

:agree2: I worked with a guy that called himself an arborist that couldn't fell a tree in a particular direction to save his life. On the other hand I know a farmer that can put them right where he wants them pretty much every time.

 

[SAWIT]

It's the man behind the saw, where a good faller works is irrelevant.
If we are talking averages, a production faller will take the win in my opinion.

 

[Dayto]

I live on Vancouver Island the true west Coast B.C , we have the biggest timber , and I know as a Faller my self .. You cant beat a Good Production faller , Aint gonna happen.. Arborist try to come out all the time into the Bush with us and they cant handle it , they wanna get all Technical at the wrong times . We work under Extreme Danger and Have to have pin point accuracy when dealing with 8-10 Cedar/Firs . You cant brush timber and you cant break either .. I would never consider comparing a Arborist to a true WESTCOAST FALLER.

 

[murphy4trees]

"I would never consider comparing a Arborist to a true WESTCOAST FALLER."

Agreed... the experienced timber faller has faced so many more different situations than even the most experienced arborist.

Check out this vido of an arborist falling two trees.. 3 parts.. 25 minutes... This guy is a wannabe tree faller... . Though somewhere deep inside, he knows he never will be. So like all of us, he just does the best he can with what he's got.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hNJajLg4Qi4

ps. these trees are within striking distance of a $2 million house.

 

[Greystoke]

I knew this question would get asked

Hey everybody.....

The question that gets everyone goin, who has better aim? A Certified Utilty Arborist? or a Certified Faller?

In my own opinion, Being a CUA myself, I believe we have the better shots. Theres been times where if I was 10 degrees off, I could nail the three phase and put my crew in immense danger.... I believe that fallers have a little bit more play on where their trees land. Im not saying one job is more dangerous than the other

Anyone out there feel the same? Argument against?

Not looking for a huge fight haha, just a heated discussion....

I would personally take on any CUA, unless he has had some considerable experience, (5 years is a good number to be proficient), as a Professional Timber Faller. Put this CUA in some of the rougher jobs that I have worked on, and his head would spin. I am not a "certified faller", and I am definitely not one of the best, but I have worked with some of the best fallers in the country, and on some of the most dangerous and challenging timber and landscapes too, so I feel that qualifies me. I know when I fall a tree I have the confidence that I can read the tree and the ground, and utilize these readings to my full advantage. I have gained this confidence throughout the years of watching hundreds of thousands of trees fall, and learning the trees behavior as it is toppling, and how to alter that behavior to do what I want, (or sometimes can), with it. I have worked on jobs where one wrong lay and someone is going to die. Also have worked on jobs where if you don't hit your lay and you blow up tens of thousands of dollars worth of wood, you get fired. Also, as in your case I have worked around power lines, large and small, where you were told not to hit them or your fired, or fried! Usually on these jobs your strip is bordering a power line, so every tree on that border can potentially hit the line, including the rotten trees and snags that are hard, and sometimes impossible to control. I am not on here to rant:rant:, and I am sure there are guys in both fields that are good; I know guys that have been falling timber for 30 years and their strip looks like a hurricane hit, but they are the minority, as generally if a guy has a good five years under his belt as a Professional Timber Faller, especially in Pacific Northwest, he is usually good at hitting his lays, and I would pit him against a CUA of same experience, any day of the week:bringit: I respect the job that Arborist's do, especially the climbing, rigging and tree science part, so I feel that Professional Timber Fallers deserve that same respect.

Cody