Cross section of spiked & unspiked coco

[Koa Man]

Got a rare opportunity to take a picture of a coconut trunk cross section that has never been spiked. Usually coconut palms get cut down when they out grow the area there are in. All most all have been spiked numerous times. In 25 years I have cut down only 3 coconut palms that have never been spiked.

Photo 1 is a picture of the trunk of a coconut palm that has never been spiked.

Photo 2 shows the side of a coconut palm that has been spiked hundreds of times. This one got trimmed 4 times a year for more than 50 years. It was about 85 ft. tall when I cut it down a couple of months ago.

Photo 3 show that cross section of that trunk.

As our local university study on spiking coconut palms in Hawaii showed, other than appearance, spiking did not appear to harm the palms in any way. This study was done on coconut palms only. I am not saying that same would apply to ALL palms.

 

[Rftreeman]

Got a rare opportunity to take a picture of a coconut trunk cross section that has never been spiked. Usually coconut palms get cut down when they out grow the area there are in. All most all have been spiked numerous times. In 25 years I have cut down only 3 coconut palms that have never been spiked.

Photo 1 is a picture of the trunk of a coconut palm that has never been spiked.

Photo 2 shows the side of a coconut palm that has been spiked hundreds of times. This one got trimmed 4 times a year for more than 50 years. It was about 85 ft. tall when I cut it down a couple of months ago.

Photo 3 show that cross section of that trunk.

As our local university study on spiking coconut palms in Hawaii showed, other than appearance, spiking did not appear to harm the palms in any way. This study was done on coconut palms only. I am not saying that same would apply to ALL palms.

opcorn:

 

[ozzy42]

Makes sense, since palms are the oppisite of trees being they [palms] have a layer of dead on the outside and living tissue on the inside .

Most damage done to palms here is over trimming.
A lot of people ,and condos insist they be hurricane cut twice per year to avoid berrys from dropping.
Some get needle top eventually while others seem to thrive from the same trimming.

 

[RAG66]

Those are really cool pics. I know nothing about palms. That one of the outside looks real bad. Then the inside is considerd solid for a palm?

 

[treeseer]

Nice pics W, thanks.

Chew your popcorn all-day long RF, Spiking a coco is not like spiking a red oak, so no one will throw rocks at spiking cocos unless for aesthetics (then like with some trees[palms are not trees}, get a lift up as high as you can and then spike if you have no skill with ropes or ascenders.)


read ANSI to see this is no cause for argument. :taped:

 

[treevet]

so no one will throw rocks at spiking cocos unless for aesthetic

get a lift up as high as you can and then spike

Can't believe as a self proclaimed spokesman for our profession you advocating injuring plants.

I am not familiar with the physiology of palms but my intuition tells me you are at least opening the stem up for infection or insect attack.

If not aesthetics are not out of consideration.

While in SoCal a few months ago and in a drop dead beautiful park the first thing I noticed was the spike scars all over palm stems.

And they are disfigured for what?.....to make them look better after cleaning the heads? :monkey:

 

[BlueRidgeMark]

I am not familiar with the physiology of palms but my intuition tells me you are at least opening the stem up for infection or insect attack.

Palm are pretty much dead on the outside. The living tissue is inside. I've seen a palm that was totally black on the outside from fire, sprouting green green fronds at the top a few weeks after the fire.

This was beside a freeway, never trimmed, so it had plenty of fuel in the form of dry fronds all the way up the trunk. A car fire touched it off, and it went up like a blowtorch, I'm told. It was on the news, as it happened at rush hour.

So, a very hot fire, fed by LOTS of fuel, and leaving a very deeply charred trunk...

Sprouting green fronds just a few weeks later.



Try that with a red oak!

 

[beowulf343]

Can't believe as a self proclaimed spokesman for our profession you advocating injuring plants.

I kind of agree. While i've learned to tune treeseer out, still smacks of hypocrisy to me.

So, a very hot fire, fed by LOTS of fuel, and leaving a very deeply charred trunk...

Sprouting green fronds just a few weeks later.

Try that with a red oak!

I have seen that done to an oak-hit by a log truck, on fire, one side with the bark tore off, the other side pretty well charred, lower branches burned right off. It happened on the corner of our road when i was a kid, far enough out in the boonies that it burned for half an hour before the fire department got there-
it recovered and is still there twenty years later.

Heck, look at boxelder, there are dozens i've taken down to stump that have shoots popping right out again. Willows aren't much better.

 

[Bermie]

It seems to me that coconuts handle spike wounds the best with little or no adverse effects.
I just hate how ugly they look having been spiked.

I have spiked my share when a lift won't get there. I cut one down earlier this year and the spike wounds were evident up to 1.5" into the healthy tissue, but appear to have compartmentalized, however that works in palms!
Now chinese fan palms bleed after spiking...and washingtonias don't seem to care for it either!

BUT....and there is always a but...we have a bud rot of some kind here, and it would stand to reason that a spike wound up near the crown would give a point of entry...however most cocnuts that go over from rot do so after serious wind events. My supposition is the extreme flexing that some take, or even twisting causes a deeper defect than a spike wound, allowing deeper penetration of the pathogen...and the head takes a thrashing sometimes, perhaps injuring the heart itself.

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/pp143

Thielaviopsis Trunk Rot of Palm infection is related to nails and spike climbing

 

[Rftreeman]

I just want to know one thing, what makes a 1/2 inch spike hole more damaging than a chainsaw cut to remove a limb, you are creating a "wound" (for lack of better word) on both but the saw cuts is a lot worst than the 1/2 inch hole.....educate me please....

 

[Koa Man]

http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/pp143

Thielaviopsis Trunk Rot of Palm infection is related to nails and spike climbing

We don't see hardly any of that here. Years ago when Florida lost a lot of their coconut palms to some kind of yellow lethal disease, Hawaii did not get a single case of it.

Most all the commercial places that plant new coconut palms require the trimming be done spikelessly. They don't want to see the ugly spike marks on the newly planted trees.

 

[treevet]

I just want to know one thing, what makes a 1/2 inch spike hole more damaging than a chainsaw cut to remove a limb, you are creating a "wound" (for lack of better word) on both but the saw cuts is a lot worst than the 1/2 inch hole.....educate me please....

First.....I have never seen just one spike hole when someone spikes a tree.

In a professional scenario.....there is a distinct reason for the pruning cut....not so with the spike wound.

Again in a professional scenario the pruning cut is made in a natural target method removing just branch material and not breaking into the tree's defense system (as opposed to a flush cut or leaving a stub....both giving opportunities for insects and pathogens).

Conversely EVERY spike wound is breaking into the tree's defense system. This attracts opportunistic pathogens and insects carrying microorganisms that cause serious diseases such as Dutch Elm Disease and Oak Wilt.

(reply based on Shigo's research)

 

[tree MDS]

I just want to know one thing, what makes a 1/2 inch spike hole more damaging than a chainsaw cut to remove a limb, you are creating a "wound" (for lack of better word) on both but the saw cuts is a lot worst than the 1/2 inch hole.....educate me please....

I don't get you.. what are you aspiring to be the resident advocate for hackery or something?? is that it?

Good response vet!

 

[Rftreeman]

I don't get you.. what are you aspiring to be the resident advocate for hackery or something?? is that it?

Good response vet!

what is there to get.....I just wanted to know why it's ok to hack off a limb with a saw but not ok to sink a spike in to a tree, besides, I can't be an advocate for hackery (is that even a word) because I don't trim trees, I remove them.....

 

[tree MDS]

what is there to get.....I just wanted to know why it's ok to hack off a limb with a saw but not ok to sink a spike in to a tree, besides, I can't be an advocate for hackery (is that even a word) because I don't trim trees, I remove them.....

Well, I think vet did a pretty good job trying to break it down for you. Why not go back and actually read his post. Explains it pretty well.. Fatty!

 

[Rftreeman]

Well, I think vet did a pretty good job trying to break it down for you. Why not go back and actually read his post. Explains it pretty well.. Fatty!

what makes you think I didn't read it, jackass....

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

First.....I have never seen just one spike hole when someone spikes a tree.

In a professional scenario.....there is a distinct reason for the pruning cut....not so with the spike wound.

Again in a professional scenario the pruning cut is made in a natural target method removing just branch material and not breaking into the tree's defense system (as opposed to a flush cut or leaving a stub....both giving opportunities for insects and pathogens).

Conversely EVERY spike wound is breaking into the tree's defense system. This attracts opportunistic pathogens and insects carrying microorganisms that cause serious diseases such as Dutch Elm Disease and Oak Wilt.

(reply based on Shigo's research)

Or, spiking is like making 100 flush-cuts on the tree

 

[david miller]

lethal yellowing is spread by a leaf hopper, it closely compared to a virus and bacterium it will kill palms, here in broward county if caught they will fine you for spiking unless it a take down. spiking can spread the disease, but my argument is who disinfect there saw

 

[Bermie]

We do not have lethal yellows here, or that trunk rot...YET.

All live palm products are banned for import, seeds, everything, except husked coconuts...

Looks like there is a groundswell for spikeless palm pruning both for aesthetics and health...can only be a good thing.

As for the difference, a PROPERLY placed pruning cut from a chainsaw takes into account the position of the tree's natural structures that best enhance compartmentalization and wound closure...spike wounds are random...topping cuts are like spike wounds, pruning cuts are not.

Get it?