How Would You Cut this Dangerous Hung-Up Tree?

[Hermio]

Just bought some Husqvarna safety gloves. They are rated category 0, which is 16m/s or 36 mph. My MS 500i has a no-load chain speed of 62 mph or 28 m/s, so a category 3 would be recommended. But my local stores do not carry category 3. On the other hand, I expect my chain brake would get the speed below 16 m/s by the time it could hit my hand; probably down to zero. Then it would just be a matter of cut protection. I plan to use them in the woods when removing the smaller branches from trees or treetops, as that is when kickback is most likely. When I drag them out into my fields for bucking, my footing is better and there is almost no chance of a rotational kickback, so I might not use them then. I could still get a linear kickback, but I don't think the gloves would help with that. I have had that happen a few times, but it never even caused the saw to hit me. The chain brake was triggered by that kind of kickback also.

 

[moxiemaul]

There is no certainty either way- but I'm sure not sticking the bar at substantial throttle into somewhere I can't see regardless of which side. That old steel fencepost hiding in the brush will jack up your chain either way...

I've gotten my share of bits and pieces sucked into the sprocket and/or derailing the chain too.

 

[Paul Bunions]

It has happened to me, but I have to deal with trip hazards.

 

[BeatCJ]

I said 16 to get you farther from the stump, if the log decides to roll, it will happen more slowly. 8 feet makes sense, too. I wouldn't burn it to get rid of it, I would be cutting firewood, but that's my bias. But I would also be looking at merchantable logs.

And while I do understand that a chainsaw isn't the best tool for cutting weedy brush, I sure wouldn't be changing tools.

Sounds like you're on top of it at this point.

 

[benz66]

A couple months ago I had an elm leaning like that, not quite as long and no support branch beneath- about 2' diameter at the base, it was all in the air. I put a heavy ratchet strap (2" wide) around the trunk above where I was cutting, tight in case the trunk split, and another around the trunk, over to a nearby tree and back, also pulled tight. The theory being the straps would restrain a jump in my direction while I got out of there. The saw I brought was too short for a good face cut on the underside but it was ok-ish. I didn't need much back cut.. at least the tree went down straight.

But I'd first put a line over it far out along the trunk and give it a good hard tug, see if it might be inclined to go over. I do that with most any stuff hung up in the canopy before cutting. Probably easier said than done when the stuff is high up. But if you can get a throw ball over and pull a 1/2" line at least you can see how hard its stuck before getting intimate with the thing.

Ilke this answer. I don't have those big straps, but I could use chains. Do clear your paths. This is a great strategy for this tree. On logs more vertical. I try to cut a notch 1/3 the diameter, on the underside, (compression) as high up as practical, then about 2-3' up from the ground, so you can run away; notch the topside (Tensiion) 1/3 through. Then alternately cut the top high up, and the bottom of the lower cut a litte at a time until it gives. This is so the log in the middle acts as a hinge, to control the tree as it comes down. The log in the middle guides the bulk of the tree to prevent, or slow any twisting or kicking sideways. (in theory). This is for junk trees where you are not trying to save saw or veneer logs. In that case, use moxiemaul's method.

2 1/2 years ago, I had half a dozen big, tall leaners after a storm. One was on the garage, in addition. The worst one was hung in a huge white pine at the center back of the garage. It would have smashed the peak of the garage if it came straight down. There was a small maple near the white pine at an angle that I thought could guide the top of the leaner away from the garage, if I cut the leaner just right. The maple was pushed partly over by a big tree that just missed the garage to he left. I used the hinge cut as described, and when I thought it was about to go, we got scared. I chained the log to the tractor and pulled. Cut a little, pull, cut a little, pull. Neither of us wanted to be around when the leaner let go. I finally got the hinge to work, and it came down safely, and the top slid down the maple, just as I had planned. The other leaners were simple. I like to do that hinge cut when they are 45º or more vertical. The butt of the log kicking sideways can get you, and even going straight out uncontrolled can be dangerous. Every leaner is a hazard.

To clarify, this top of this leaner was to the right of the big pine, and a normal cut would have crashed the leaner right on the peak of the already battered roof. By popping out the hinge, the top backed away from the white pine, so it could ride the maple down to the left. The top cut of the hinge was not as high as I would have liked it, but I made it work. Paul Bunyan could have cut it higher, and made a better hinge.. I've had smaller trees where I had to cut a second hinge to get the top to drop, when the first hinge didn't bring it down.

 

[Hermio]

Ilke this answer. I don't have those big straps, but I could use chains. Do clear your paths. This is a great strategy for this tree. On logs more vertical. I try to cut a notch 1/3 the diameter, on the underside, (compression) as high up as practical, then about 2-3' up from the ground, so you can run away; notch the topside (Tensiion) 1/3 through. Then alternately cut the top high up, and the bottom of the lower cut a litte at a time until it gives. This is so the log in the middle acts as a hinge, to control the tree as it comes down. The log in the middle guides the bulk of the tree to prevent, or slow any twisting or kicking sideways. (in theory). This is for junk trees where you are not trying to save saw or veneer logs. In that case, use moxiemaul's method.

2 1/2 years ago, I had half a dozen big, tall leaners after a storm. One was on the garage, in addition. The worst one was hung in a huge white pine at the center back of the garage. It would have smashed the peak of the garage if it came straight down. There was a small maple near the white pine at an angle that I thought could guide the top of the leaner away from the garage, if I cut the leaner just right. The maple was pushed partly over by a big tree that just missed the garage to he left. I used the hinge cut as described, and when I thought it was about to go, we got scared. I chained the log to the tractor and pulled. Cut a little, pull, cut a little, pull. Neither of us wanted to be around when the leaner let go. I finally got the hinge to work, and it came down safely, and the top slid down the maple, just as I had planned. The other leaners were simple. I like to do that hinge cut when they are 45º or more vertical. The butt of the log kicking sideways can get you, and even going straight out uncontrolled can be dangerous. Every leaner is a hazard.

To clarify, this top of this leaner was to the right of the big pine, and a normal cut would have crashed the leaner right on the peak of the already battered roof. By popping out the hinge, the top backed away from the white pine, so it could ride the maple down to the left. The top cut of the hinge was not as high as I would have liked it, but I made it work. Paul Bunyan could have cut it higher, and made a better hinge.. I've had smaller trees where I had to cut a second hinge to get the top to drop, when the first hinge didn't bring it down.

I wish I could visualize what you are describing.

 

[Paul Bunions]

I cut some big pieces out of the trunk today. I'm running a 24" bar, and it's just long enough to go through.

I shoved the base of the trunk off the stump that was holding it, and it was suspended off the ground, which was convenient. I cut down into the top side around 8". Then I pounded wedges in. Then I cut into the bottom around 4", a few inches up from the first cut, into the side that was going to stay put when the log fell.

After that, I went back the original cut and kept doing down until the log fell off. The bottom strap kept the kerf open until it broke, and when the log fell, the wedges fell out and the top edge of the log fell against the part of the tree that was not falling. This kept everything open so the tree didn't close on the saw.

Because I cut the bottom toward the tree's canopy, the strap didn't hold the log up. It peeled off and fell with the log.

It was really easy. I did it three times.

I spent a lot of time clearing grape vines off the canopy side of the tree. Really annoying, and the grapes are tiny.

 

[moxiemaul]

I thought of this thread today. I found a long black locust widowmaker suspended up in a maple, a remainder from storm cleanup months ago. OTOH that thing was so jammed up there it wouldn't make widows for a while, I had to tear it mostly out with the truck- being all bound up with interlocking branches and brambles, thankfully nothing bigger than 8" or so. I couldn't pull it all the way out so had to take sections via face-cut on the top and back-cut below so it would fold. The last bit was the worst, all the remaining detached branches woven together with brambles and I wanted to avoid damaging the maple more so had to be careful with the cutting. And one of the pins had failed in the 14" saw's chain (spare back in the shop, naturally) so I was benchpressing the long bar homelite up to get at it... whew.

 

[Paul Bunions]

I am still not done.

The tree had two trunks, and the bigger trunk breaks off into three large branches big enough to be trees on their own. The tree is held up on two of them, and it's impossible to tell which way it will rotate if either is cut. I am in the process of cutting back the third one, which is on top. It had branches that could have come down on me if the tree rotated the wrong way.

There is also a huge widowmaker on one side, stuck in another tree. It came loose from the tree that feel and broke off. Not much is holding it up. A lot of things in the area around and below it need to be moved out, but I'm not going to stand under it.

I am still removing stuff from around the tree so I will be able to move if something bad happens.

If this tree had landed off by itself, it would have taken maybe 8 hours to clear. I guess I will have put in twice that much sawing and dragging time before the road is clear and the cattle can use it. After 2-3 hours of this work, I am ready to go back to the house.

 

[Paul Bunions]

RE cutting weeds with the chainsaw, I worked on this stupid tree today, and before I went out, I sharpened the chain on the 562XP and checked under the clutch cover. It was packed with long shavings from cutting grapevines. The bar was pretty dry, too. I think the debris got in the way of the oil or rubbed it off.

The hedge trimmer is too weak for grapevines. The saws get clogged up. You can't use a brush cutter up high because it's unsafe. I don't think there is any tool made for this job. I used a pole saw today, and I also ripped some out with the tractor fork.

 

[BeatCJ]

Brush Hog on your tractor? That would be my first choice.

 

[Paul Bunions]

These stupid vines are both on the ground and way up high.

 

[BeatCJ]

Sounds like a horrible project. FWIW, you really shouldn't be reaching over your head with a chainsaw, either. But, sometimes needs must. When cutting brushy junk like that, cleaning under the clutch cover becomes a much more common task. The brush itself shouldn't make your chain drier. I'm a big fan of a hedge trimmer for anything viney, but it takes some pretty decent horsepower. I have some briars that won't fit between the teeth. Those need the saw. Last time I backed into there with the tractor one of the tires was squirting beet juice at me. Luckily, a plug held...

 

[fields_mj]

Glad you were able to get it done safely. My general rule is to always start on the tree top first and get as much weight off as possible. For problem trees like that (especially doing storm clean up) I've REALLY come to appreciate my gas powered pole saw. It lets me take a lot more of the limbs off than I'd be able to otherwise get without it. On a blow down like that, eventually the root ball can try to stand back up, but it normally doesn't happen until the I'm down to the pole. Once I get the non-supporting libs off, I re-evaluate what to cut next. If the is obviously going to want to go one way instead of the another, I may start removing some of the supporting limbs. If not, I"ll probably try to do some rigging to make the tree go a specific direction, or at least KEEP it from going the other direction and then take it off as close to the stump as I can. I think it looks too sketchy, I'll walk away for a few days and let mother nature play with it for a while. If its disaster recovery where waiting really isn't going to work, we have equipment that we will use to push/pull/lift or otherwise control the tree and protect the sawyer. Keep in mind that I'm just a weekend warrior who does occasional volunteer work and cuts his own firewood, so if there's a error to my logic/technique I'm not going to be offended if someone points it out. In fact, I'd be quite grateful.

 

[Paul Bunions]

I used to think the grapevines were kind of neat, but I am over it. When you can make a baseball bat out of a vine, you have let it grow too long.

RE pole saws, I am having better luck with cordless than gas. My Echo pole saw doesn't seem to have half the guts my cordless ones do, but maybe it just needs work. Seems to get dull in a hurry. No idea what that's all about.

The main part of my tree is considerably smaller now, and I dragged it off the smaller stuff under it. I am going to try to drag it away from the two 20-foot widowmakers stuck in the other tree at the canopy end. I need to clear things away so I can get a strap on one of the widowmakers and pull it down from a safe distance. Maybe the other will come with it.

I have cut up bigger trees in 2-3 hours.