CS vs Band vs Blade

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FLtreeGuyVHTC

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So Ive come acrossed some rare wood with a tight grain and havent access to a ton of black walnut. The rare wood is kentucky coffee wood. I plan on making end tables and coffee tables out of this and maybe reselling some of the lumber. The Alaskan Mk-III 36" will cover anything I will run into and is affordable without taking out a loan. But is it. really worth the abuse on my saw? I can get most my logs milled up at a band mill for five cents a bf. We have a woodstove in the basement to dry the wood down to indoor use. Alot of the kentucky coffee wood are small and wont fit in a band mill. So I plan on getting the mini mill for sure. But for sawing up black walnut and any other species would it. be more profitable to start with the Alaskan or take a loan on a mill.

If I go with the loan. Which is more profitable... Saw blade mill or Band mill? I would like to be able to quater saw red oak and some of this black walnut. I have access to couple thouand bf in log form and plan on experimenting with drying in the basement vs the home made kiln I plan on making. Got 3000 bf log form of spruce 16' long. I do mostly tree removal but would like to expand my business and start a new hobby. My first hand carving came out amazing!
 
Ebay has some band mills for relatively cheap. The Hudson mills on there seem affordable, as do the Norwoods. Hudson has a $2500 delivered mill that'll do a 21" log. $2500 delivered is pretty darn cheap, and i'd bet you can fit any of your coffee trees on it so long as they're at least long enough to fit between cross members.
 
The Alaskan Mk-III 36" will cover anything I will run into and is affordable without taking out a loan. But is it. really worth the abuse on my saw?
What saw?
I can get most my logs milled up at a band mill for five cents a bf.
How do you get them there?

But for sawing up black walnut and any other species would it. be more profitable to start with the Alaskan or take a loan on a mill.
Depends on your financial situation. You will probably NOT make a profit ($$ in greater than your costs plus say $15/hr for your time) either way.

would like to expand my business and start a new hobby. My first hand carving came out amazing!

As a HOBBY get an Alaskan and a spare 660. Your only gambling ~$300 for the CSM and some chains. You'll need a 660 anyways just to get the bigger trees to lie down.

If you can transport logs to a mill at 5 cents/bf vs transport logs to YOUR mill it would take about 60,000 bf to equal $3,000 dollars of your own mill. And on your own $3K sawmill it would take about 2 months of your time AT least to mill 60,000 bf.
 
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What saw?

How do you get them there?


Depends on your financial situation. You will probably NOT make a profit ($$ in greater than your costs plus say $15/hr for your time) either way.



As a HOBBY get an Alaskan and a spare 660. Your only gambling ~$300 for the CSM and some chains. You'll need a 660 anyways just to get the bigger trees to lie down.

If you can transport logs to a mill a 5 cents/bf vs transport logs to YOUR mill it would take about 60,000 bf to equal $3,000 dollars of your own mill. And on your own $3K sawmill it would take about 2 months of your time AT least to mill 60,000 bf.

I have a 395xp I planned on using. I use a 16' dump trailer with a pully and another truck. Lift the logs then back under them. Usually useing a tree near by. Soon I will be getting a cheap power wench and building a moveable cross member so it drags them to the trailer then re-tie lift one end then re-tie again on the far end. Should slide right on. we get access to a skidsteer now and then but found this is ruff with logs and damges them.


The sawyer I'd use is a omish and is only aviable randomly. Also not sure if he knows how to mill quater boards. I Checked around for setups. With a couple saw horses and the mini mill and lots of time and patience I can saw up quater boards. Mini mill was $95.
 
Some logs/wood is better flat sawn, walnut is one of them... That is if you plan to sell the lumber? A lot of folks think quarter sawing is the best for everything, it isn't...

Rob
 
Logs is not my problem. Have red oak to make q boards. Actually I have access to a ton of large trees of various species. Plan on experimenting making my own end tables and selling execptional lumber to my uncle who does wood working that I domt have tools for.... yet.... Would like to get a haydrolic band mill. My father had one....
 
Some logs/wood is better flat sawn, walnut is one of them... That is if you plan to sell the lumber? A lot of folks think quarter sawing is the best for everything, it isn't...

Rob


So I guess it depends on what your really making if you want quater boards. Saw some black walnut quatered up... It looked alright. I would use it for gun stocks. Which is kinda what I want to do.... Repair damaged stocks and carve traceries for friends and family...


Posted this on the wrong form to start. Someone said you CAN'T make money with a cs mill... I have a hard time beliving this since the mini mill is 95$ and a couple saw horses are Cheap... I already have access to a large supply of red oak and black walnut... With just the mini mill I can make quater boards... What am I missing?
 
So I guess it depends on what your really making if you want quater boards. Saw some black walnut quatered up... It looked alright. I would use it for gun stocks. Which is kinda what I want to do.... Repair damaged stocks and carve traceries for friends and family...


Posted this on the wrong form to start. Someone said you CAN'T make money with a cs mill... I have a hard time beliving this since the mini mill is 95$ and a couple saw horses are Cheap... I already have access to a large supply of red oak and black walnut... With just the mini mill I can make quater boards... What am I missing?

I guess your time isn't worth anything to you??? And how about the time it takes to get that lumber dry???

I find the gas/oil/bar oil/shorter life of power heads/chains/bar's and time, plus what it does to your body, the REAL cost of chainsaw milling. As a hobby it can be fun, to make real money, the cost goes up in every way!

Walnut gunstock blanks are not usually quartered, at least all of the ones i bought and sold weren't, but then again, i was into HIGH end blanks as there's not much money in anything else.

You must be trying to make a little "hobby" money, not trying to make a liveing...

Rob
 
<snip>
Posted this on the wrong form to start. Someone said you CAN'T make money with a cs mill... I have a hard time beliving this since the mini mill is 95$ and a couple saw horses are Cheap... I already have access to a large supply of red oak and black walnut... With just the mini mill I can make quater boards... What am I missing?
I wrote:
You will probably NOT make a profit ($$ in greater than your costs plus say $15/hr for your time) either way.
You apparently have an unlimited supply of everything others have to pay for - skidsteer, truck, trailer, fuel for all the above and the trees to cut.

If it was that easy to make money JUST with a CS mill hundreds of others would be doing it and the price of the product would fall like a rock.

Give us some examples of your profits after a few thousand board feet, and the hours it took to produce.

For me the big advantage of a CS mill is ultimate portability.
 
Ive had a couple of years to build up my supply and I got good friends. 95% odd the time I figure it out on my own... 16Ft dump trailer with 10 ft side racks. Place a removalable beam acrossed them and tie a pully to it... Block the wheels and skid the logs on with a ramp... Samething when I got to the wood lot... Or a chain hoist.... Transporting and supply isnt my problem. Kilning and cutting accurate boards... Already have 272xp and a 395xp... I run my own tree service... Been climbing since 03... Would like to fill my time doing it as a hobby or installing custom hard wood floors. Gives me future work by maintaining them down the line. Most my supply of logs comes from trees removals. With the mini mill I can make planks which are easier to lift out soft woods and sell to the pulp mill and the soft maples for pallets to stack firewood on instead of being on the ground. Yes a band mill would be nice but I got no credit and cant afford 4000$ in december.

Figure a 95$ mini mill 3 ripping chains at $40 each. The 272xp only cost 150$... $400 and I can ripp a couple thousand bf... Would leave them think for drying then have my uncle or the omish band mill them... Not sure what bw flooring is going for... Not cheap I imagine... Not to mention these logs where grade A walnut. Almost veneer... even if I dont sell the lumber I can make end tables and sell them at the craft shows my girlfriend goes too. Cant do anything about gas. Gets covered in my bids when I take the trees down....
 
Sounds as though you have the raw materials to start milling, wood, and it's free. If you want to get started now, I would suggest a CS and a mini-mill. You are already familiar with chainsaws because of your business, so with a CS would should be comfortable using/operating. With the CS you can cap your logs and then square them with the mini-mill and then cut them into boards or cants. You can then test the water in your area for a market on milled wood. Take a milled slab(s) to a craft fair that your GF can setup and use for a table, but also include a for sale sign on the slab(s), you just may find someone making wood crafts that needs your new product or just someone who wants a slab for making their own table. Just a suggestion.

jerry-
 
So I guess it depends on what your really making if you want quater boards. Saw some black walnut quatered up... It looked alright. I would use it for gun stocks. Which is kinda what I want to do.... Repair damaged stocks and carve traceries for friends and family...


Posted this on the wrong form to start. Someone said you CAN'T make money with a cs mill... I have a hard time beliving this since the mini mill is 95$ and a couple saw horses are Cheap... I already have access to a large supply of red oak and black walnut... With just the mini mill I can make quater boards... What am I missing?

missing:finding a market to buy the lumber.
 
I wrote:

For me the big advantage of a CS mill is ultimate portability.

that's why I went that route first, but if I had a little extra cash I probably would of went with a blade type the the Peterson ATS. If I ever do upgrade to another type I will likely lean that direction.
 
Look for a used mill- get one of each!

You might check Sawmill Exchange. They've got a lot of used mills listed. I use a band mill for nearly all of my cutting, but have an Alaska mill with a 48" bar that lets me put a chainsaw engine on both ends. Takes two guys that know what they're doing, but it does chew through the wood! I've only used it four times in the last three years, but it paid for itself on the first log-- slabbing out a 42" diameter by 10' long walnut. I built a special jig for my Norwood band mill that lets me cut "logs" as short as 2' long, and up to 24" diameter (the throat length of the mill). It also holds walnut crotches for gun stocks. Forestry Forum and Woodweb also have listings for sawyers. Might have one bring out a portable band mill or swing blade mill so you can see what you think. Just be prepared to pay five to six times what the Amish folks charge. I don't know how they can cut so cheaply.
 
<snip>but have an Alaska mill with a 48" bar that lets me put a chainsaw engine on both ends. Takes two guys that know what they're doing, but it does chew through the wood! I've only used it four times in the last three years, but it paid for itself on the first log-- slabbing out a 42" diameter by 10' long walnut.<snip>

Where the heck were you when I had this thread:

http://www.arboristsite.com/milling-saw-mills/151749.htm

:)

I always thought two heads were better than 1 :)
 
Just signed on to the forum

Gemniii,

I'm new to the forum, and the opposite of most members-- mainly a sawmill guy moving toward arborist. As far as cost effective, a pit saw would be cost effective-- if you had one, and if the lumber were valuable enough to make it worth your time. Typical milling cost, including my time ($25/hr) runs about $.30/ board foot with the band mill. Two people, half an hour, two tanks of fuel & oil, plus another 1/4 hr to sharpen the blade, plus wear & tear on the saw (thank goodness aspirin is cheap)-- all to get one 2" thick by 40" wide by 10' slab comes out to roughly $50 for 67 board feet, or $.75/ bd ft. You're not going to stay in business cutting dimension lumber that way. On the other hand, I took a center slab of that walnut log as payment, which I air dried for two years, then sold to a woodworker for $250. The owner of the log, the woodworker, and I all came out smiling. As far as I'm concerned, the double-headed chain saw is just another tool to pull out when I need it. Some folks start out with a chain saw mill and decide to move up to a band or circle mill. Others decide not to mill because they didn't like the chain saw mill, but would have enjoyed running a band or circle mill. Oh well, more logs for the rest of us!
 

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