Different Rate Schedule

[tnttreeman]

I live and work in the corner or a tri-county area. In two of the three counties, I can barely manage to get bids at times and make the work worthwhile. In the third county, I can charge at least 50% more, usually 75% more for the same work. In the first two counties, my bids are regularly being matched if not beaten by reputable tree companies (i.e., not hacks). I don't know how they're making money and staying in business. I am far from being outrageous on my rate schedule, in fact up until this year I certainly haven't been charging enough money. We're doing the same job, with the same equipment, and in the same amount of time, yet I'm being lowballed I guess.

I posted a thread about two months ago asking what others are charging for labor rates. Seems that the median was $60-65 per man hour. In the first two counties I mentioned, the man hour rate has to be around $40 per hour. In the third county $60-$75 is acceptable. I would forego working in the other two counties, except that I live in one and it has alot of my repeat customers from when I started in business. Anybody else have this happen?

 

[newb]

I understand your complaint. In my area people laugh me off if I ask more that $300 for a TD with complete cleanup. I have to go 50 miles into the big city where I can easily get $700-$1000 for the same size trees. Thats the difference between rural and city I guess. My problem is I wont live in the city to be near work, and I wont work our here just to be busy.

 

[tnttreeman]

Had that problem recently. A neighbor wanted crown reduction done on a maple in his back yard. Had to work around a few things(shed, built in grill, etc.). The guy is in his 80's, so I cut him a break on the price. He looked at the quote -$325- and laughed. "You must be kidding! That's way too much," he said. I didn't bother to tell him that was a discounted price. There are 3 other tree services based locally and I told him to have them quote if he thought my price was high. Needless to say, the tree hasn't been touched by any of us. Can't afford to give my work away anymore.

 

[topndrop]

Really I suppose it has to be based on the timer involved and any other factors such as risk, etc. My company has an over-head expense of $125 / hr. and if we DO do charity cases it is rare. Also the time involved in the clean-up (hauling all the debris ALL the way from the farthest corner of the BACK yard to the street through a small garden gate, etc....
We can charge a god deal in Palm Coast because there is money here, but in the county (especially the out-lying areas we have found we have to reduce the price dramatically to be competitive.
Also, we have a lot of HACKS, no insurance, etc. running around dropping trees for $50...
I ran into a bunch of them recently and stopped to educate the home owner on the hazards of removing trees with no permit ($5000 fine), having people not qualified to remove trees ( danger to life, limb and property) and also not ensuring that the persons doing the work are insured and licensed (lots of fines!). Needless to say we ended up finishing the job... the BOZOS in question didn't even have business cards! AND they wanted to argue with me about the need for permits... Goofballs!
I could go on all day...

 

[dhuffnmu]

I know exactly what you mean. We have our company in the suburbs of Detroit making great money. We have a cabin up north about 3 hours. We do side work up there some weeks. A 1000$ tree down state will get you about 350 with clean up up there and most times the people look at you like you are crazy still. Just the way it is I guess.

 

[Stumper]

TNT, Don't slap me for smarting off but...... What problem? You already have customers in the cheap zone. Charge them a fair price. The ones you keep are still customers-the others won't waste your time in the future. In the territory where you aren't having a problem-no problem.

 

[tnttreeman]

Guess what it boils down to is that it sucks doing the same work for less money. We don't change our work ethics or quality of our work, but the people expect you to work fo less money. When we're booked 5-6 weeks out in the top dollar area, it's not an issue. But at times like now when business is slow, and you have to take the lower dollar area jobs and still bust your butt, it blows.

 

[Trignog]

It is different all over CT. I love the stereo type that we are all the Greenwich type with sweaters tied around our necks and everyone is named Buffy or Chad. The truth is, ct is like any other U.S town, jacked up trucks, mullets, and close familliesif you know what I mean. hahaha

 

[ulk77more]

I'ts nice to know that people have more overhead per hour than I have invested in all my climbing gear.
people accross the street had dead white birch that overhung their house price for removal-- a soda -- why? they had kids and it was right over the kids room . a local removal company quoted them 500.00 + change due to the power line and they had to "rent a differant truck than the one they had specially for the job" I removed it with ropes and my climbing equipment.
Now since then I have bought a portable band-sawmill and was looking for wood to buy and went accross the street to ask my neighbor if I could buy some standing timber that he had -approximately 200 cords standing timber on 265 acres and he just went into his garage and pulled out a paint can and went through marked out about 100 trees and told me I could have them for removing that birch. NOW who made more money?

 

[ulk77more]

oh yes I am fully insured and have worked as a lineman and logger for a # of years

 

[WMTP]

where i am im really the only companie doing this sort of work there were a couple others but they were pretty un prof so they didnt last long but still people dont ususally understand what its going to take to do some of the really nasty stuff they call us for but they know they cant doit and they still dont want to pay any decent amount of money and it seems like when i try to cut people a break those are the ones who thing there getting ripped i cant understand it

 

[texasnative]

i went to give a lady an estimate for a takedown of a large Quercus stelleta. the lady said "we're on a fixed income". i told her that i was on "no income unless i get paid fairly for my work". hehe, she hasn't called back, but the tree is still there. she will probably wait until the tree is rotten and limbs fall on her house before she decides to do anything.

 

[WMTP]

yep and thats pretty funny

 

[Mike Barcaskey]

TNT, I assume you are talking about Allegheny, Beaver and Butler counties

By far Beaver County is the "poorest" for tree work, Hopewell, Aliquippa, Ambridge, Baden and others
Allegheny can be as bad if you're in certain areas, but I can usually hit my target. Love working those North hills for the $, but hate the drive.
Will go up to Bradford Woods and over to McNightmare Road, but no further.

Have only done 2 or 3 jobs in Butler, so I really cant comment other than the fact that I get lots of calls and turn them down, too far

A couple of the good services in western Allegheny are running a straight $50.00 per hour,
but there's too many two guys and one truck working for beer money
I lose alot of work to Tall Timbers Tree Service in the North Hills, I cant see how they're making anything. They must pay their guys $hit

The rates you posted seem high to me, when you say the median was $60-65 per hour, do you mean for every man hour on the job?

say you look at the tree with two guys to do the work,
Tree time (climbing) 3 hours
coressponding ground time 3 hours
both guys to clean up 4 man hours
dump time 1 hour

total time to TD tree and empty truck 11 hours
multiply by the $60 per hour and your bid's $660.00

I think that's going to get under bid easily

my bid based upon my rates would be $550.00 and I would expect to land that job 2/3's of the time
That's Allegheny/North Hills,
in Beaver County I would trim that bid down to $450.00 and expect to get it 1/2 of the time, but I wont work cheaper

I view my profits running the business like a store, some jobs I make alot of money, some jobs I hit my minimum target and others I lose money (end up making 20-25 per hour because of a bad bid or other unforseen problem)

are you operating under TNT Tree Service?

What do you know about Admiral Tree Service in the North Hills?

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

I do not raise the price for rich people, but will drop it for those who are "econimicly disadvataged"

Otherwise I will work with a potential client to do less work for less money, eg higher "impact" removals, they do the fine raking....

We've all had the people who think we should work for them for nothing. I may get a little ironic with them, but i stay polite. If they shop long enough they will get the price they want, if they are lucky the right guy will come along.

The bottom line is you need to price for what you need to make a proffit. Another way to work those "in your area" is to sell it "at my conveniance" so that if you have a good day, you can pick up the low bid stuff on the way home.

 

[Ny finest]

it seems like when i try to cut people a break those are the ones who thing there getting ripped i cant understand it

THats because they're manipulating you.They see compassion and they run with it.