We own a large chuck (250 acres) of 25 year old aspen stand that we are looking to log. We had several logger look at the property. We will probably only cut 40 acres and let the rest mature for another 10-15 years. We have the equipment to cut, skid, and haul it to the local company specifically using aspen. We have the time to do this ourselves. Is there any reason we shouldn't?? I appreciate your feedback on this.
Do it yourself Aspen logging operation
- Thread starter dmccarty
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KYLogger
Professional Tree Assassin
If you have got the time, equipment and gumption, I say log it! Do you all have the experience in a timber harvesting operation? Even if your answer is no by all means don't let that stop you. Everyone has to learn sometime. Just be careful (that goes without saying, experienced or not) It will be alot more profitible on your end to log that boundary out yourself. Minus expenses it's all profit. Pay a logger to come in and you are looking at losing anywhere from 30 to 50 percent off the top. Just my two cents......
Tom
Tom
Oldtimer
Addicted to ArboristSite
The crux of the issue is how much can you produce per day- delivered in to the mill.
If it takes you 6 months to do the 40 acres..leaving a bunch of wasted slash and tops.....then you are no where near as well off as you would be having a bio-mass / chipping crew come and snap it out in 2 weeks or less.
IMO $100 made today is better than $150 made over a week. If that makes any sense.
Plus, a chipping crew leaves the land ready for re-planting- if that is a goal.
If it takes you 6 months to do the 40 acres..leaving a bunch of wasted slash and tops.....then you are no where near as well off as you would be having a bio-mass / chipping crew come and snap it out in 2 weeks or less.
IMO $100 made today is better than $150 made over a week. If that makes any sense.
Plus, a chipping crew leaves the land ready for re-planting- if that is a goal.
Thanks guys. We ideally would like to get the property chipped. We can't find a chipping operation to do the work though. One logger said it would need to be winter work due to the marshes and wetness of our property, but he is booked for the next three winters. If we chipped it, we would look at doing 200 acres over the next several years. Since we can't find a chipper we are looking at doing this ourselves. Any ideas on where to find a good chipper? I've talked to the DNR, Country Forester, called several companies, loggers, etc.
hammerlogging
Addicted to ArboristSite
You can have a forester represent you and sell it outright, you get your cash and the logging has a time restraint condition. (like w/in 2 years). A chipper is going to do like 6 or more loads per day of a perfectly sized chip into chip vans, this is the real deal, so don't expect to borrow or rent this kind of thing.
Oldtimer
Addicted to ArboristSite
Where in Wiscony are you?
I think you can find a chipping crew, just need to keep digging around...
As for renting a chipper...you can rent the 125 - 200 hp morbark / Bandit chippers...but you could buy 2 of them outright for the cost of renting one for a 40 acre job...$6-8K is the going price.
And a bigger chipper is more or less impossible to rent, unless you go into a lease with a major equipment dealer...at which point you might as well become a chipping crew yourself...since it sounds like there's a lack of crews to go around there..
Another thing to consider is: How will you load/feed the chipper? And who will truck the chips?
Chipping it onto the ground is a complete waste of time, money, and energy. Poplar rots quick, I'd just pull it into a wet hole, and limb it all there. Crush it in with the skidder.
What sort of equipment do you have now?
Oldtimer said it right. Before you do anything else, find out if there's a market for the chips. The market, and it's price and consistency, is almost always the determining factor in whether you'll make any actual profit or not.
I don't know how the chip market is where you are but out here most of it goes to co-gen plants. They're real fussy about what they'll take and they'll drop the price on you in a heart-beat if your product doesn't meet their specs. They also will just shut you off if they start to have too much material on hand and you're not one of their main suppliers.
That's one of the problems in any kind of logging operation...you have to sell, they don't have to buy.
I don't know how the chip market is where you are but out here most of it goes to co-gen plants. They're real fussy about what they'll take and they'll drop the price on you in a heart-beat if your product doesn't meet their specs. They also will just shut you off if they start to have too much material on hand and you're not one of their main suppliers.
That's one of the problems in any kind of logging operation...you have to sell, they don't have to buy.
guys, thanks for all the responses and feedback. We ideally would like to get the property chipped. We can't find a chipping operation to do the work though. One logger said it would need to be winter work due to the marshes and wetness of our property, but he is booked for the next three winters. If we chipped it, we would look at doing 200 acres over the next several years. The average size of the aspen is 6-7 in diameter. We are located near Jump River in southeast Rusk County Wisconsin. We use the property for hunting and would like to chip the majority of it, leave 30 yard wide strips for windbreak and travel corridors for the deer until the cut grows back. Plus, we would like to redo our trail system and plant large sections of white spruce and put in food plots.
We had 15 acres chipped right by our cabin and it is the best habitat we have, but that company went out of business. Since we can't find a chipper we are looking at doing this ourselves. If we do it ourselves it is cutting and hauling the logs to a local company specifically using aspen. We wouldn't chip it ourselves. We would cut 40 acres which would be 5 acres around the different tree stands on the property.
We have a C190 skid steer with graple attachment, tractor, goose neck trailer,ect. The mill is less than 30 miles away. We could get someone to truck it for us as well. Some work would need to be winter, but some good be this late summer and fall.
Based on the numbers one logger gave us, we could get $2000-3000 for the 15 acres we looked at clearing or $16,500 (what I figured off his numbers) for the same 15 acres if we did it all ourselves. He gave a low estimate of 10 cords per acre, a load to the mill brings in $1100, $300 goes to trucking and then he splits the remaining 800 between himself, the cutters, and the property owner. Does this sound right?
We had 15 acres chipped right by our cabin and it is the best habitat we have, but that company went out of business. Since we can't find a chipper we are looking at doing this ourselves. If we do it ourselves it is cutting and hauling the logs to a local company specifically using aspen. We wouldn't chip it ourselves. We would cut 40 acres which would be 5 acres around the different tree stands on the property.
We have a C190 skid steer with graple attachment, tractor, goose neck trailer,ect. The mill is less than 30 miles away. We could get someone to truck it for us as well. Some work would need to be winter, but some good be this late summer and fall.
Based on the numbers one logger gave us, we could get $2000-3000 for the 15 acres we looked at clearing or $16,500 (what I figured off his numbers) for the same 15 acres if we did it all ourselves. He gave a low estimate of 10 cords per acre, a load to the mill brings in $1100, $300 goes to trucking and then he splits the remaining 800 between himself, the cutters, and the property owner. Does this sound right?
imagineero
Addicted to ArboristSite
It sounds like you're logging very select areas on your property. Before you go ahead yourself or contract someone else to do the job, sit down and have a think about which areas you don't want damaged. In the longer term, keeping those areas untouched is probably worth more to you than saving a couple thousand dollars. Think 10-20 years from now.
If you do want select areas done, you could well be better off doing it yourself, assuming you have the skills. The gear is only part of the game. You will need to be able to fall(a whole trade by itself), plan out the falling so that you can skid it efficiently, have sufficient labour, know how to limb and buck to sizes that the mill will pay for, stack your logs and be able to load them quickly enough that truck drivers wont charge you waiting time, and get the whole thing done in a manner that is timely. Since you're only doing 5 acre blocks, you maybe be able to just chip away at it when time presents. On the other hand, there's a lot to be said for getting someone in to just git 'er done in short order if they can do the job and not damage your property. Especially if you need to take time off work to do this. Removal of stumps can be a bargaining chip too. If you can have the wood removed, stumps done and the site left exactly as you want it and walk away with nothing spent and nothing earned, that may well be a good outcome for you. To get the same outcome by doing it yourslef you may end up at a big loss.
It seems initially that there's a lot of money to be saved doing it yourself, but labour, fuel, broken things, that extra tool you forgot about, chains, saws, chokers etc etc... all start to add up. Bringing in sub contractors for stumps or other things gets pricey quick. Plus, you may damage a lot of timber trying to get it out. Remember that fallers aren't doing all that well at the moment, but they already have all that gear and do the job every day and have quoted you that price. Shop around a little, but if the prices come back similar then (as unlikely as it sounds) you probably wont do better doing it yourself, even if your time is worth very little.
Long term, the outcome for your property is going to be the big thing. In 10 or 20 years time, if it wasnt handled well, the cost of correcting it will be enormous. It may seem like a good bit of quick money, but that same money could easily be earned working 6 months for someone else. I'd be thinking about how you want the property to be, and working from there.
Shaun
If you do want select areas done, you could well be better off doing it yourself, assuming you have the skills. The gear is only part of the game. You will need to be able to fall(a whole trade by itself), plan out the falling so that you can skid it efficiently, have sufficient labour, know how to limb and buck to sizes that the mill will pay for, stack your logs and be able to load them quickly enough that truck drivers wont charge you waiting time, and get the whole thing done in a manner that is timely. Since you're only doing 5 acre blocks, you maybe be able to just chip away at it when time presents. On the other hand, there's a lot to be said for getting someone in to just git 'er done in short order if they can do the job and not damage your property. Especially if you need to take time off work to do this. Removal of stumps can be a bargaining chip too. If you can have the wood removed, stumps done and the site left exactly as you want it and walk away with nothing spent and nothing earned, that may well be a good outcome for you. To get the same outcome by doing it yourslef you may end up at a big loss.
It seems initially that there's a lot of money to be saved doing it yourself, but labour, fuel, broken things, that extra tool you forgot about, chains, saws, chokers etc etc... all start to add up. Bringing in sub contractors for stumps or other things gets pricey quick. Plus, you may damage a lot of timber trying to get it out. Remember that fallers aren't doing all that well at the moment, but they already have all that gear and do the job every day and have quoted you that price. Shop around a little, but if the prices come back similar then (as unlikely as it sounds) you probably wont do better doing it yourself, even if your time is worth very little.
Long term, the outcome for your property is going to be the big thing. In 10 or 20 years time, if it wasnt handled well, the cost of correcting it will be enormous. It may seem like a good bit of quick money, but that same money could easily be earned working 6 months for someone else. I'd be thinking about how you want the property to be, and working from there.
Shaun
Last edited:
lmbrman
stumped
PM sent-
Go forth with caution as these guys have mentioned, but no reason you can't do it. First thread to read is Brad Snellings "dont get complacent out there". Gives you a glimpse about safety and stupidity.
Pretty good specialty mills around my area,, i tried chipping once and like roundwood better. Chipper is retired to sawmill refuse
Be safe -
-dave
Go forth with caution as these guys have mentioned, but no reason you can't do it. First thread to read is Brad Snellings "dont get complacent out there". Gives you a glimpse about safety and stupidity.
Pretty good specialty mills around my area,, i tried chipping once and like roundwood better. Chipper is retired to sawmill refuse
Be safe -
-dave
