Falling wedges. What's good, what's not, and why?

[dave k]

Good posts coming along on this thread, I see you are hovering around HBRN and I note it took almost two hours to come up with the waffle in reply to Gologit's correct observation. Perhaps you should only keep one thread at a time to play with ?

Back on topic, NW I see what you mean about the axe head and would not have thought about it, we over here tend to use a sledge or in my case a splitting maul made to also drive wedges so has a straight handle.

 

[lfnh]

Not to be pushy, Ifnh, but I'd take those edges on your axe and give them a little grind. I do like the collar, though. Seems like it would prolong the handle when the hand to head to wedge doesn't seem to match up like it sometimes does.

Thanks! Bad angle on the pic. The radius is there, just hiding - less than yours though.
Used to be a lot of new axes came with the radius already ground.
Now just happy to find the rare straight grained handle.

btw, interesting thread and info from all the posters.

 

[T_F_E]

Pardon the minor derail.

Expect some have seen these shoulder collars before.
Just a simple piece of backstrap, saddle stitched.
Help a little to keep the handle shoulder from getting chipped and beat up.

Another way is to use 14-18" of raw hide strap wrapped on wet and tight.
When it dries it will be harder and tougher. No pic of this as old Kodak
power supply went to lunch.

View attachment 188853

Thats a good idea I like your fancy handle saver. Around these parts we just buy electrical tape by the truck load and use it for everything.

 

[2dogs]

I am not a thief the owner the company told me what do. He was told to burn the trees, he told me to salvage the good logs to help recoup the money they failed to pay us. I take being called a liar as fighting words so let us not go down that road:mad2:

Far be it from me to harass a fellow AS member but HBRN you are a fool talking like this. Get rid of your keyboard and just read and learn (yeah right). Don't go making threats of violence against against members.

 

[bitzer]

You know, we talk about axes and wedges and what works and what doesn't. One of the things that isn't talked about too much is how to hang an axe so that it maximizes your wedging abilities. It's been my experience that most people aren't too familiar with how to properly hang an axe handle. In my travels it looks as if most guys just put the head on the handle without seeing how it's hung. The driving surface of the axe needs to be parallel to the length of the handle. If it's hung too far forward or backward it will result in lots of damaged wedges as the surface of the axe won't stike the head of the wedge square. As the head of the axe is driven on the axe handle the position of the head relative to the handle can be maneuvered by rasping the axe handle so that it is sitting square on the handle. Takes a little time but results in an axe handle that you can be consistant with while wedging.

Yep, I square my heads up to the handle too. Once I think they are set I stand how I would pound a wedge and smack a cross-cut log to check how I did. If the indent looks pretty even I should be good to go. I can not for the life of me find an axe with a straight handle in these parts. I have to buy the axe with the curved handle, knock it out, and replace it with a staight handle bought seperatly. In the meantime I add weight and length to the pall while its off the handle. I've got a couple different ones laying around. A 4.5lb and a 6.5lb are in the regular rotation. The 6.5lber is a mutilator if you're not careful.

K&H and Stihl make triple taper wedges. They are in 8 or 10" (can't remember which) and start out double tapered until you get to 2-3" from the butt and then they flair out to the thickness of a 12". I've never used them. My K&H 7"er also has nearly the butt thickness of a 12" . The 10"ers seem seem to have a much finer taper.

Just to add to the list: I've got some Husqvarna wedges that are ok too. My guess is that all wedges are made by only a few companies and are just colored or branded differently.

 

[nw axe man]

Yep, I square my heads up to the handle too. Once I think they are set I stand how I would pound a wedge and smack a cross-cut log to check how I did. If the indent looks pretty even I should be good to go. I can not for the life of me find an axe with a straight handle in these parts. I have to buy the axe with the curved handle, knock it out, and replace it with a staight handle bought seperatly. In the meantime I add weight and length to the pall while its off the handle. I've got a couple different ones laying around. A 4.5lb and a 6.5lb are in the regular rotation. The 6.5lber is a mutilator if you're not careful.

K&H and Stihl make triple taper wedges. They are in 8 or 10" (can't remember which) and start out double tapered until you get to 2-3" from the butt and then they flair out to the thickness of a 12". I've never used them. My K&H 7"er also has nearly the butt thickness of a 12" . The 10"ers seem seem to have a much finer taper.

Just to add to the list: I've got some Husqvarna wedges that are ok too. My guess is that all wedges are made by only a few companies and are just colored or branded differently.

Not to push one shop over another but Madsens sells an assortment of axes with straight handles from 24" to 36". They carry Council heads and they seem to be a good head. If you'll go back to my pics in the first of this thread it's the kind of orange one. I had painted it that color when I was cutting in about 4' of snow and didn't want to lose it. The blue one is a Strohs axe and I'm not sure you can even buy them now. It cost me $50 for the head alone back in 88. The steel is of high quality. I think it will probably push over the 5lb mark. I have a good story on that one from a flood in 96.

 

[madhatte]

I remember the '96 flood. Was working out near Boistfort somewhere and couldn't get across 6 to get back to Centralia, ended up taking the 1000 line over from Doty to the far end of Lincoln Creek. It was flooding there, too, but at least I could get across.

As for axe handles, I have been hanging them so that when the far end of the handle is touching the bench, the head is contacting about 2/3 of the way down. This puts the back of the handle about parallel with the back of the head, which is as it should be. I also prefer the bent "doe's-foot" handles because it puts the weight of the axe a few degrees ahead of the swing when cutting, and a few degrees behind when pounding wedges. I have several, but my favorites are an old Collins 2 1/2# and an old True-Temper 5#, both of which live in my work rig. I like shorter handles most of the time because they're easier to move around with, even though they're more work to use.

As for wedges -- I like the Madsen's cheapies, especially the seconds, mainly on account of the fact that I kill 'em fast and am probably not actually that good with 'em so there's no point in spending the big bucks on nice ones if I'm just gonna destroy 'em anyway. I carry 4", 8", 10", and 12" in the truck, and will load out the wedge pouch as appropriate. I have a couple of the triple-tapers and don't really like 'em -- by the time you get back to the sharper slope, you're not lifting much any more, at least in softwood. I can guess that they might be more useful in hardwoods.

HBRN: chill, man. Serious.

 

[plasticweld]

Please do take some pics of this Sampson. I have a picture of it in my head but would like to see it in action.
The wooden wedges you speak of don't work too well out here. The US Forest Service used to keep them around till they finally realized that they just don't work too well out here where the trees are so tall. The ones they used just fell apart in a little bit. They did make great door stoppers, though. The plastic ones seem to hold up the best and are the most common. There's still a few guys that use the aluminum wedges but not too many. Most grind out a handle and use them for pounding a wedge or at least getting it started.

I will see what I can do about getting some pictures of the Sampson and the wooden wedges work well in conjunction with the plastic wedges not just by themselves. Also type of wood may have something to do with it, We have iron wood here and normally I can use a wedge made of this for many days, splitting is the big problem with any of the wooden wedges but they are used more to take up the slack so that you can drive the placstic wedge and if while driving the plastic wedge it pops out you still have the wooden one in place

 

[Rounder]

Probably preaching the the choir, but I was in a hurry to get my BS done after work the other day and stopped in the hardware store and grabbed a couple of the stihl wedges. Pretty imppressed with how well they drive into a tree that's really sittling back. Good enough to get something a little more serious in there.

The ####in' wind has been blowing straight up the ####in' hill the past four work days (downhilling tree lengthing for the yarders) so these little bastards have really come in handy. All the damn Larch grow uphill anyways. Yep...I get in a hurry and #### myself every now and then (okay....alot). Good thread.....Most of it, lol-Sam

 

[stihl 440]

Probably preaching the the choir, but I was in a hurry to get my BS done after work the other day and stopped in the hardware store and grabbed a couple of the stihl wedges. Pretty imppressed with how well they drive into a tree that's really sittling back. Good enough to get something a little more serious in there.

The ####in' wind has been blowing straight up the ####in' hill the past four work days (downhilling tree lengthing for the yarders) so these little bastards have really come in handy. All the damn Larch grow uphill anyways. Yep...I get in a hurry and #### myself every now and then (okay....alot). Good thread.....Most of it, lol-Sam

If you got production on the brain everyone will get hurry and try to cheat a little bit...but it most of the time ends up bighting you in the A$$ anyway.lol

 

[Rounder]

If you got production on the brain everyone will get hurry and try to cheat a little bit...but it most of the time ends up bighting you in the A$$ anyway.lol

Lol. I have a bad habit of giving a tree a quick glance, and saying to myself, "If it sits back I can push the little ####er over". One problem.....I'm kind of a little ####er. So wedges are nice. Just like 4 wheel drive....use it before you need it.

 

[madhatte]

Just like 4 wheel drive....use it before you need it.

Interesting you should say that, as I was trained the exact opposite: use 2WD to get INTO trouble, save 4WD for getting OUT of trouble. It's the "Use A Bigger Hammer" principle. If you start with your biggest hammer, well...

It's always neat to compare methods with other folks.

 

[forestryworks]

The ####in' wind has been blowing straight up the ####in' hill the past four work days (downhilling tree lengthing for the yarders) so these little bastards have really come in handy. All the damn Larch grow uphill anyways. Yep...I get in a hurry and #### myself every now and then (okay....alot). Good thread.....Most of it, lol-Sam

That's how it was in Oklahominy. Lots of north and south facing slopes. Where did the wind come from? The south. Where were the pine? The south slopes.

Lots of cussing.

But no yarders.

It was fun while it lasted.

Oh and K&H and Double Taper wedges worked well for me. In my really limited experience anyways.

 

[Gologit]

Ax handles

Does anybody have a good link on where to buy quality handles? Last week-end I went to just about every store in the area and I found mostly junk. I bought the least junky one I could find but it still isn't real great.

 

[slowp]

There's a cranky guy who makes and brings wooden handles for most everything at the Packwood Flea markets. The next one is on the Labor Day weekend. I don't know about quality, but have heard folks say they think his are good, and some people wait and buy a supply from him. I have a pulaski handle I bought from him. The handles are reasonably priced. But he's not on line.

Maybe JP can tell if they are really any good.

I see I should wrap some PINK duck tape around my pulaski handle. I use the pulaski to weed the flower beds. It is also good for killing slugs.

 

[Rounder]

Interesting you should say that, as I was trained the exact opposite: use 2WD to get INTO trouble, save 4WD for getting OUT of trouble. It's the "Use A Bigger Hammer" principle. If you start with your biggest hammer, well...

It's always neat to compare methods with other folks.

I guess I was trying to say go with the gut feeling. If I even have the slightest inclination that a tree will sit back on me, I slip a wedge in as the back cut proceeds. If I think I'm gonna go off the road, I throw her in 4. Have you seen my car?, Lol. -Sam

 

[Rounder]

Does anybody have a good link on where to buy quality handles? Last week-end I went to just about every store in the area and I found mostly junk. I bought the least junky one I could find but it still isn't real great.

Bob, the shop I deal with has been getting some really nice ones. I can send one your way if you want. Just might take a little longer than you want.

 

[stihl 440]

Lol. I have a bad habit of giving a tree a quick glance, and saying to myself, "If it sits back I can push the little ####er over". One problem.....I'm kind of a little ####er. So wedges are nice. Just like 4 wheel drive....use it before you need it.

Exactly...if you think it will set back 9 times out of ten it will....unless the wind is helping you...which is very seldom....sadly and most of the time the exact opposite. Which is why you adapt to the situation....and learn how to cut in the wind. If you think you'll need a wedge stick one in it..it wont hurt anything even if you dont end up needing it.

 

[madhatte]

If I think I'm gonna go off the road, I throw her in 4. Have you seen my car?

Aw, hell, I've munched a few fenders putting momentum where it oughtn't be, so I know no "rule" is perfect. I hear you on the wedges, though -- such a simple bit of insurance, why not? Plus they're like a bobber telling you when the tree is starting to tip.

Ax handles: I think we're gonna be stuck with not-so-good handles for the foreseeable future, as the big ol' hickory trees the good ones come from are none too abundant any more. Best one in the box will be the one I buy every time. I've seen some pretty lousy ones for sale recently and don't know what to think.

 

[bitzer]

Bob, the only place I've found STRAIGHT straight handles are at old hardware stores that get very little traffic. Even then I go through every one they have. When I'm looking through them I can just about cut the dust off of them with a butter knife.



Sam, the wind is like a woman....

I wish I could think of something clever to finish that with. Kinda cloudy today. Sounds like you're havin fun though!