First Milling Done

[AaronB]

Well it went okay, I am some what of a perfectionist so I am trying not to be to picky for being my first time. Some boards came out great, others not so much. Not that they board is unusable and can't be finished down to 3/4" just has some rough sawing marks in them.

The first couple of cuts came out great and I thought this is going to be good, but once I started getting into the thicker part of the tree that is when the rough cuts started showing up. Sometimes I think it was because I let the mill rise up on the nose end by accident, some of it probably was my technique, some was probably me playing with the throttle up and down braking the saw in, but since those first cuts came out nice I guess I was expecting the rest to as well, but I'll move on.

Here is the log that I ran my attempt on. Not to large but large enough for my first and it is red oak.

Here are my rails attached, since the log didn't have much taper to in in that first 8 ft section I was able to screw both slabbing brackets into the end of the log.

This was after the second cut. Where things were still smooth.

Here is the first slab on the ground.

This was what was left when I was done. I might of been able to get one more cut but I had enough by then. lol

Here they are all stacked up, as you can see it was dark by the time I got this far.

Here it is in the morning, but I removed some bark on some of the slabs. I wanted to test for myself is leaving the bark on matters or not, & because I ran out of time to do them all.

Some things I noticed that I wasn't aware of:
1.)First off was that when milling it wanted to pull the entire mill toward the nose, pull it into the log, I wasn't expecting that. At first I was fighting it letting it do that, so I was pushing and pulling the mill back toward me at the same time, talk about a fight, and tiring to boot... Those first cuts still came out good with me doing that, but I learned just to let the saw pull itself into the log and just push. (Hope that was right)
2.)Almost put the chain on backwards, father-in-law caught me on that one.
3.)Take a bit to get some technique down, as I still don't have it, seemed like I was going really slow but that may be the way it is, not sure how long 8 ft cut is supposed to take.
4.)Need to learn where that pusher handle needs to be for optimum pushing effect, I really think I had it to far way from the chainsaw head and was causing some of my technique issues, which may of resulted in some chain dips, etc, in the cuts.
5.)Learned to make sure I check the chain tension after every cut.
6.)On the good note, it was a great workout....except it hurts when I sneeze or cough right now......:biggrinbounce2:

Other than that it was awesome, I really enjoyed it, it was more fun than "work" really. Just have to do it some more to get better and learn more about technique and it will get even better.

Thanks for looking and thanks to all those who helped me get started.

 

[Brmorgan]

That's a nice stack of boards for your first day.

Basically the helper handle and crossmember should be in the vicinity of the middle of the log you're working on. The crossmember has the added effect of keeping the mill rails flat on the top of the guides/log/cant and prevent the mill from dipping at the beginning and end of the cut. I have also put some foam grips on the long round support bar that runs end-to-end on the mill, and frequently push from there just for a change to give my hands a break once in a while. And at the end of a cut, I push right on the actual guide rail itself to help hold the back end of the mill down and prevent the front end from dipping down.

Don't bother fighting the pull of the chain unless the mill is hanging up on a knot or irregularity or something. As you found out, you'll just wear yourself out before too long. This is why a lot of guys like Bob have installed wheels on their mills on the powerhead end, to follow the curve of the log.

The sawdust and fumes can really get to you at the end of the day. Often the next day I've woken up and felt like I had a massive hangover. A dust mask helps a lot, though I hate wearing them in the summer because they're so hot.

 

[mtngun]

That's a nice oak log ! I'm way jealous.

The first boards I ever milled were far from perfect. You'll gradually find techniques that work well for you, no biggie.

My only suggestion, and maybe you are already doing this -- it's not clear from your pictures -- is to use the guide rails for each and every cut. Only takes a minute to lay the rails on top of the last cut and put one screw at each end.

Good job, and welcome to the elite chainsaw milling club.

 

[dave k]

Apart from the other guy's points did you touch up your chain ? sounds like you were working much harder than you should have too.

 

[AaronB]

Apart from the other guy's points did you touch up your chain ? sounds like you were working much harder than you should have too.

No, I did not, I wasn't sure when I should of touched it up. I did have another chain I could of put on which is probably what I would of done since I was only doing one log and then sharpen them at home.

I did have my sharpener with me, I just didn't know when I should, after how many slabs?

 

[1947wdx]

My only suggestion, and maybe you are already doing this -- it's not clear from your pictures -- is to use the guide rails for each and every cut. Only takes a minute to lay the rails on top of the last cut and put one screw at each end.

Hmmm, maybe it's because I'm using an old aluminum ladder, but I tried using it for each cut, and while it does limit the deviations, it took an extra 5 minutes per slab doing it this way. Milling with a chainsaw is already slow enough without adding time to each cut.

After a few issues with my Alaskan mill (which the folks here helped me with, thanks again) I've been fairly successful making the first cut and about every 4th one with the ladder/rails to correct any deviations.

Most of my cutting is in pine, a little in sugar maple, so I'm only a little ahead of you on the learning curve. Take the above with that in mind. The other folks here know much more then I.

Welcome to the world of milling. Nice slabs!

 

[1947wdx]

No, I did not, I wasn't sure when I should of touched it up. I did have another chain I could of put on which is probably what I would of done since I was only doing one log and then sharpen them at home.

I did have my sharpener with me, I just didn't know when I should, after how many slabs?

I usually touch mine up between milling days, but I'm usually doing pine. I do take a close look at the chain each time I fill the tank of gas. If you start out with a sharp chain and feel it is slowing down I would take that as an indication to touch things up.

I'm running Bailey's 404 milling chain on the 3120 (basicly regular 404 chain ground at a 5 degree angle instead of 35) and regular 404 chain on the 394. Both cut about the same, the milling chain may leave a bit smoother surface, but it is still obviously done on a chainsaw...

 

[woodsrunner]

Other than that it was awesome, I really enjoyed it, it was more fun than "work" really. Just have to do it some more to get better and learn more about technique and it will get even better.

That says it all. It really is fun. Crazy, goofy kind of fun, but fun. For me it is the challenge of taking a big piece of waste wood (usually) and finding something cool inside.
As far as chain sharpening goes, keep it sharp as much as you possibly can. I've found red oak to be very hard on chains. The real problem with dull chains is it is really hard on your saw. The time factor is increased but that really isn't the problem. Your saw has to work much, much harder and that greatly increases the heat load which can fry your saw.
On using the guide rails, I also recommend using them on each cut. I don't screw them into the log for each cut tho. I push the brackets up tight against the ends of the log and that usually will hold the rails in place. Sometimes it is necessary to lag them in but not always.
BTW, I think you did a really great job with that first log. Like I said red oak is hard to cut so you get a for the job you did.

Scott

 

[BobL]

Well done Aaron! That is a pretty good first effort.

RE: Fighting the saw away from the logs
As Brad says - Wheels - all else being optimized, wheels represent the biggest single improvement that can be added to a conventional alaskan. Another Aussie on another forum has come up with adjustable flip wheels - I could be using these on my next mill.

RE: Sharpening.
This depends how hard and dirty the wood is.
I touch up (~2 strokes per cutter) after every tank of fuel but in your softer woods you could go longer - your countrymen should be able to offer more advice about that than I.

RE: Exhaust fumes
I think 3 things matter here. One is the gas/lube mix ratio, and the others are the direction of the exhaust and the wind direction.
I always used 40:1 with my 076. On the 076 the exhaust points down and with the wind behind my back I never had any problems.

The first time I suffered was using a newer style saw with a forward pointing exhaust using 25:1 in still air. It was not long before I had a headache and a queasy stomach and at the end of the day my chaps were covered with black greasy gunk (which I have never been able to get out). I also like to apply forward pressure to a CS mill by leaning on the top of the wrap handle with my hip/thigh/knee which means my leaning leg is very close to the exhaust so my legs got quite hot.

I got rid of the headache by using 40:1 but still got hot legs and queasy stomach.

After thinking about it and then using a 660 in a mill and getting the same effect I believe it is a problem with newer saws with forward pointing exhausts. The exhaust reflects off the log and forms a fog around the operator

Which is why I went for this pipe mod on the 880.

In the first picture the black exhaust shows the conventional saw exhaust and resulting direction. The grey exhaust shows the 880 pipe mod. So far no problems with the 880.

 

[dustytools]

Looks good!

 

[BobL]

The real problem with dull chains is it is really hard on your saw. The time factor is increased but that really isn't the problem. Your saw has to work much, much harder and that greatly increases the heat load which can fry your saw.

I have a temp gauge on my milling saw and can see this effect very clearly.

At the start of a cut, the temperature quickly rises to a nominal working temperature (lets call it X) and then slowly creeps up during the cut (lets call the final temperature Y). If I touch up the chain before the next cut I see the same temperature profile repeated during the next cut. If I don't touch up, the starting working temperature will be closer to Y than X and rise well above Y during the cut.

I can make the temperature go up just by pushing a little harder, it makes sense, lower revs means less cooling means saw runs hotter.

I also worked out that it takes ~ 2 minutes to cool the 880 down to idling temperature.

 

[Can8ianTimber]

I have a temp gauge on my milling saw and can see this effect very clearly.

At the start of a cut, the temperature quickly rises to a nominal working temperature (lets call it X) and then slowly creeps up during the cut (lets call the final temperature Y). If I touch up the chain before the next cut I see the same temperature profile repeated during the next cut. If I don't touch up, the starting working temperature will be closer to Y than X and rise well above Y during the cut.

I can make the temperature go up just by pushing a little harder, it makes sense, lower revs means less cooling means saw runs hotter.

I also worked out that it takes ~ 2 minutes to cool the 880 down to idling temperature.

Bob, do you have pictures and parts used of the temperature rig, I am always worried about that and all I have to do is take a break every 4 ft or so. Thanks.

 

[BobL]

Bob, do you have pictures and parts used of the temperature rig, I am always worried about that and all I have to do is take a break every 4 ft or so. Thanks.

The gauge is a Traxas 4091 On-board Temp gauge made for model racing cars
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXHEM4

Some pics on what I did are here http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=103984

 

[AaronB]

thanks for all the tips that I can try next time.

The exhaust didn't bother me this time, but that was because the wind was blowing everything in front of me. didn't plan it that way just got lucky. Maybe also because I wasn't leaning on the power head like I have seen some do, I was more behind it with my arms more out pushing it with my arms.

I'll just have to try to remember to watch the wind so I can set up for it next time. Also I am going to try and have one end of the log higher.

 

[BIG JAKE]

Looks good Aaron, and you had fun doing it. That's the main thing. I'll tell you a few things that I learned that may buy you some speed, comfort, and more enjoyment to your milling experience. Some of it will take time to learn such as how long a log you can mill between fuel ups. Of course this is based on diameter, wood species, chain sharpness, etc. It matters because if you can go 16'8" per slab, you reduce your setup time by half over slabbing for 8 footers, which means more lumber at the end of the day. So here goes-
1) Mill the longest slab per cut that you can safely get away with WITHOUT RUNNING OUT OF FUEL.(You really should idle your saw down 1-2 minutes after milling). Reduces setup time. Slab 10', 12', 14'. 8ft is a PITA.
2) Always try to setup so the wind carries the exhaust and sawdust away from your face. If wind is variable mill the log from the opposite direction, but I try to avoid milling with the wind at my back. (If it's not obvious, try crouching up close to a smokey campfire with the wind at your back and see what happens).
3)Don't use a rail after first or second cut. This presents a few issues such as defects translating to successive slabs caused by wedging and end of cut where you run out of log to ride on. To eliminate wedge defects begin to angle the mill as you approach the defect and ride over it that way and she'll smooth right out. This is because you're not bumping that 1/8'' ridge with the entire leading edge of the mill and in effect spreading defect out. Never wedge in the same place on successive slabs.
4) Wedge defects-caused from going to idle midcut so you can wedge(you need to use wedges to maintain kerf width. Go too far and pinch). Better to wedge a little too much than not enough, and too soon rather than too late. Stop/start chainspin as quickly as possible for wedging and don't drag the mill excessively(pull back, then forward). I just let off the throttle but maintain push-chain stops at once, wedge, then ease bar back just enough to hit peak RPM immediately and then continue milling.
5) End of cut defects-eliminate these by technique(practice), and you have to wedge close to the end. If you leave your logs slightly longer you have room for checking and can end cut to remove end defects.

Have fun-Oh, and be careful carrying that mill around with chainspinning etc!

 

[Kicker_92]

4) Wedge defects-caused from going to idle midcut so you can wedge(you need to use wedges to maintain kerf width. Go too far and pinch). Better to wedge a little too much than not enough, and too soon rather than too late. Stop/start chainspin as quickly as possible for wedging and don't drag the mill excessively(pull back, then forward). I just let off the throttle but maintain push-chain stops at once, wedge, then ease bar back just enough to hit peak RPM immediately and then continue milling.

Have fun-Oh, and be careful carrying that mill around with chainspinning etc!

Another option is to cut some wood strips to use as wedges. Just cut them slightly thicker than your kerf. Then you can wedge in as many as you need without bumping up the guide rail.

If it's still functional, bumping the chainbrake when moving the mill on and off the rails is a good practice to get into.

 

[mtngun]

Hmmm, maybe it's because I'm using an old aluminum ladder, but I tried using it for each cut, and while it does limit the deviations, it took an extra 5 minutes per slab doing it this way. Milling with a chainsaw is already slow enough without adding time to each cut.

For subsequent cuts, I only use one 2" drywall screw at each end of the guide board. Set the board on top of the log, use a portable drill to install the two screws. One minute tops. No lags, no end boards (if you are using unistrut or a ladder, you might be using a small piece of angle at the ends instead of screwing down through the guide board as I do).

If I switch to unistrut, which I keep saying I'm going to do, I'll devise a system so that the unistrut can be screwed from the top similar to a wooden guide board.

Besides smoothing over imperfections, the guide board holds the weight of the saw while starting and finishing the cut. Easier and safer from my point of view.

But, obviously we have people doing it both ways and getting acceptable results.

 

[1947wdx]

For subsequent cuts, I only use one 2" drywall screw at each end of the guide board. Set the board on top of the log, use a portable drill to install the two screws. One minute tops. No lags, no end boards (if you are using unistrut or a ladder, you might be using a small piece of angle at the ends instead of screwing down through the guide board as I do).

If I switch to unistrut, which I keep saying I'm going to do, I'll devise a system so that the unistrut can be screwed from the top similar to a wooden guide board.

Besides smoothing over imperfections, the guide board holds the weight of the saw while starting and finishing the cut. Easier and safer from my point of view.

But, obviously we have people doing it both ways and getting acceptable results.

I agree. It does make it easier and safer to use a guide for each cut. I may have to look into a means of "quick attachment". And another to keep the distance to the top rail the same. With the ladder approach, on bigger logs there is about 3 inches from the top of the rails to the top of the log. (Ladder rails sit directly on the log.) So I set the mill at 4 inches to get a one inch board. On smaller logs or for the smaller portion of a big log, the rungs of the ladder sit on the log and the distance from mill rails to log top is about 2 1/2 or so. Readjusting the mill as you move down through the log to keep the same board thickness adds a lot of time to each cut. Maybe I'm just impatient...

For the most part, I've been practicing on some white pine logs that were left over from a logging operation last year. (Most of them are less then 7 feet long. Stuff I told the logger to leave as the price of pulp dropped and it didn't make sense to haul it off and loose $$$.) At this point they have gotten quite a bit of worm and carpenter ant damage so I'm more concerned with getting them sawed up and stacked so they can dry. (The worms/ants don't seem to like the stuff I've already cut and stacked... This is a classic example of biting off more then you can chew...)

I'll take another look at the "rails-for-each-slab" approach for keeping out the deviations. Once I get to some "good stuff" I want to have my technique down...

 

[AaronB]

Here is a couple of pictures of the bar. FIL said I might ask about the color, said it could be due to heat, any concerns or something maybe I didn't set quite right with the chain. or is this just normal and is some kind of buildup.

As you can see it was mostly in the middle of the bar and just on this part, on both sides of the bar.

A little closer

 

[stipes]

Great job on your first time out...

First one I ever milled on was a sycamore..That was last year,,and been doin alot of millin since then...Seems like you get hooked after the first time....I still have alot to learn setup wize...Seems like thats what takes up the most time for me...
I dont know if I can say that stain is from heat,,or from the red oak you was cutting...I have cut alot of redoak,millin and bucking and had the same stain as you have...It will come off with a good cleaner...What I would watch out for is if your bar if rolling a burr over the top..I dont know how long a bar your using,,but with my setup,,28 inch,,with a Jred 2186,,and if I was to go bigger,,I'd put me a aux. oiler on..
Great job!!! I hope you enjoy millin as I do!!!!