Footlocking

[murphy4trees]

I use the Kong dual handle ascender with a petzl chest ascender in line under the kong, attached w/ small screw links. Both tied to the same blue water tether. This system can be used safely for single line or doubled line. With single line the chest ascender serves as the back up... on doubled line the eye side of the line gets backed up w the chest ascender and the standing end of the line gets backed up with the climbing hitch... I use a biner chain on my climbing hitch and just clip the bottom biner to the big handle on the kong.... It is simple, quick and very safe from a practical standpoint... The biner chain would be frowned on by other high angle disciplines, yet I beleive the benefits for tree work far outweigh the risk (of side loading a biner) when using the auto locking triple action biners....

Jim Roach told me that he once had both sides of the dual handle kong open up at the same time when he was coming around a limb or something.... I really like the feel of the kong but wouldn't trust it without the solid back up...

 

[Tree Machine]

Hi Daniel. I was playing with this setup a few days ago, just because I hadn't used a tress cord in over a year, thought I would take it out and at least try to get the newness off.

I already knew that a VT hitch would not stop a climber's fall, but it would create quite a bit of the total friction needed.

If the cam were to fail, and you were unfortunate to lose grip on the tree, upon falling the angle of the ascender once weighted, with the handle being pulled upward, the bend through the ascender shell adds additional friction and becomes enough to arrest the fall.

Just an observation.

When footlocking, the VT added no appreciable friction and self-tended flawlessly.

I am not suggesting anybody back up your SRT ascender as such. I'm just sharing one of the many backup possibilities.

 

[Tree Machine]

This was one of the best published articles, June, 2006 TCIA.

 

[moray]

I already knew that a VT hitch would not stop a climber's fall, but it would create quite a bit of the total friction needed.

Is that true?! Is it true of other common hitches as well? I always assumed that any of the hitches that could hold you would also hold if you fell a short distance. Can you elaborate a bit?

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

The one shown in the pic does not have enough wraps at it's top.

I use more wraps then that on my flipline hitch!

In my everyday climbing I use four upper wraps and two lower braids and it grips well.

On my climbing VT I use 3:3 (or is that 3/3, it would be easier notation, because I would not have to use a shift stroke. I certainly do not want to confuse people with improper notation! )

 

[Tree Machine]

Is that true?! Is it true of other common hitches as well? I always assumed that any of the hitches that could hold you would also hold if you fell a short distance. Can you elaborate a bit?

Talking specifically of SRT only, which is 1:1. In a 2:1 doubled rope system the VT works better than any other hitch. I think you thought I meant something other than what I said and showed in the picture. Hitches (as a whole) on SRT don't do so well as a primary friction control.

If you were using a VT (or any other properly configured hitch) in a 2:1 doubled line system, and you fell a short distance, I don't think there would be any problem with the hitch's friction being able to stop you.

 

[moray]

Talking specifically of SRT only, which is 1:1. In a 2:1 doubled rope system the VT works better than any other hitch. I think you thought I meant something other than what I said and showed in the picture. Hitches (as a whole) on SRT don't do so well as a primary friction control.

If you were using a VT (or any other properly configured hitch) in a 2:1 doubled line system, and you fell a short distance, I don't think there would be any problem with the hitch's friction being able to stop you.

I understand your point that a hitch that works great for 2:1 may be quite poor in a 1:1 setup, and I have experienced that myself. In your last comment you assert what we all believe and hope to be true, even though few ever test it! But it would be true of a 1:1 system as well, would it not? That is, not considering its use as a primary friction control, would a hitch that can hold you also hold you after a short fall? And if it wasn't sloppy loose to begin with, would it reliably tighten up and grab during a short fall? The first one I am pretty sure about, but not the second...

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Also, I doubt that the handle is rated for fall arrest safety.

Tress hitches work well for holding on single rope, only if they are properly set. Like when advancing a pulley on a compression rig. Partially set hitches have been shown to slide under load. I'm not sure if they tore cover or not.

 

[Tree Machine]

Agreed, John Paul. The handle wouldn't be rated for that sort of thing.

Again, I'm not recommending using your ascenders in such a manner, but the idea, the actual physics of a pulleyless (and properly tied) VT, coupled with dual ascenders and a captive bar in the ascender shell, the series of curves in the rope, plus the rope-on-rope AND the rope-on-metal friction, the system will hold you.

See, Kong left us a little high and dry when they created the dual ascender. They took a single left and a single right and mated them together, added a dual handle and riveted it all together. It works great, except for one thing. Where a caribiner USED to be able to go through the top of the ascender shell and hold the rope captive, with it now being double-wide, a beener no longer can fit through there up top.

Kong never really did anything to solve this problem, so there's no real good attachment point atop the ascender, nor any beener shape that will fit through there. With the Kong Duals, a seperate bar needs to be used to hold the rope captive in the shell. This captive bar has a formal, technical name. It's called a PTO hitch pin and is available at farm stores and probably most hardware stores.

The Kong ascender still needs a bombproof upper attachment for connecting backup. Frictionless, self-tending back-up, and the captive bar, it offers much in the way of confidence while aloft.

Anyone speak Italian?