Fried my saw? But what's this yellow stuff?

[spacemule]

In my layman opinion, it looks like too much stuff to be corrosion. I would think something was stuck in the muffler. Mud Dobbers seems to me the likely culprit. Either that or a kid with an active imagination.

I've seen dobber nest here that were almost yellow. I would think the exhaust might and oil might have an effect on the color also. You could always send it to your local university's chemistry lab.

 

[Sprig]

Cool Mark because it certainly has piqued some interest, I asked a couple of the local mech's here and they just shook their heads and the basic comment was 'Whatever the heck it is it can't be good.' No chit Sherlocks lol
Bein' the curious sort Imma gonna go Goggle 'yellow nests' or 'yellow bug nests' an' see what happens. Ciao and keeps us posted!



Serge

 

[bobbyb13]

Had the very same experience.

028, would not start at all. muddobbers had packed the muffler tight. At least I didn't loose the saw. Mine just could not start.

 

[Bowtie]

I will ask this question again. Do you have a screen or spark arrestor in your muffler? Is it modded, IE, does it have another larger added port to allow mud dawbers to build a nest?

 

[BlueRidgeMark]

I will ask this question again. Do you have a screen or spark arrestor in your muffler? Is it modded, IE, does it have another larger added port to allow mud dawbers to build a nest?

Sorry, bowtie, I did mention it in my last post, but I didn't respond directly to you.

Yes, it HAD a spark arrestor when I got it, but that must have fallen out when the muffler rattled loose, because it's not there now.

No extra ports, just the guts removed.

 

[vegaome]

Hody Mark,

Not sure what it is, something with fuel, mud dobbers and hedge wood, all plausible theories. I'm going to throw another one out there. It looks like pollen to me. Last week were you cutting tops with buds or flowwers on them or cutting in a blooming weed field? I dont know if pollen is small enough to get through a filter or if it is in fact pollen. It sure does look like it though from the pictures.

At certain times of year it coats things around here. Wish I could help more, just guesing.

v/r

Mike

 

[BlueRidgeMark]

POLLEN!


Would bees have packed pollen in there? There are always quite a few buzzing around my garage this time of year. Small one AND the big carpenter bees.

I know how to test that - I'll be right back!

 

[Sprig]

Quote>
Lead adhesion
【Appearance】
The bottom of the insulator adheres yellow or yellow brown burning residue shaped substance, in addition the surface with gloss
【Result】
The misfire when accident accelerating or running with heavy load, but it will not appear under the usual circumstance
【Cause】
Use the gasoline with high lead contents. <Quote
Don't think its the problem but interesting.
But this makes more sense>
http://www.mzriders.com/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=2011
From the page> "by DAVID THOMPSON on Thu May 31, 2007 10:52 pm
droy what is your country
the quality of the gas may be the cause
it may be sulfur build up if sulfur content high in fuel
the high heat at valve may make it collect...
it is a bright yellow
almost the color of the yellow used to paint road lines
ar dave"

Don't have a clue if I'm on the right track, I go look more

Then I find this interesting> http://www.osti.gov/bridge/product.biblio.jsp?osti_id=117709
In the 'Abstract' (about halfway down the page) the mention of potassium postum bromide turning yellow on ignition made me wonder if you've been using a synthetic oil in your mix, just a weird Sprig-type stab in da dark at a black box.

But then! >
"The Haunter attacks and devours its prey in the most horrid of manners, charring the body and bones and leaving a yellow residue" Holy-Moly, you've had a Haunter attack in yer muffler! Quick, call Godzilla! Batman! (don't ask me where I found this quote, bizarre as the problem imho )

AND, did someone say ethanol?? > PDF] Isolation, synthesis and biological activity of Evolitrine and analogsFile Format: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - View as HTML
at room temperature for 30 min, the mixture was concentrated to give a yellow residue, which. was recrystallized from acetone/petroleum ether to afford ...
www.arkat-usa.org/get-file/19801/ -
*note, lead oxide is yellow, don't eat any Mark until sure it ain't lead *




Serge

 

[Brushwacker]

Went to do some cutting today, and first pull told me it was toasted. Failed the drop test.




So, pulled the muffler, which fought like crazy, and found some weird yellow powder caked in the exhaust port. It FILLED the port completely. I picked most of it out with a screwdriver, and this is what it looks like:








The history is this:

This is a John Deere/Efco CS-52. I got it from an AS member (a couple of years ago) who modded (gutted) the muffler. It's been a champ so far. A few weeks ago, I changed the spark plug and cleaned the air filter after some heavy use. Spark plug looked good - nice light brown, evenly colored.

I found the muffler nuts had some loose, and the front half of the muffler had been rattling around, apparently for quite a while. I put it back together, using some star washers to hold it together better. The metal around one bolt had fatigued and cracked, opening up the hole a bit, so the wide star washer I used closed that up.

I've run about a tank and a half since then with no apparent problems. Last use was about a week ago. Went to use it today, and no joy.

When I pulled it apart, I found the back half of the muffler had also fatigued and broken:





This was hidden by a backing plate inside the muffler, so I didn't see it when I fixed the loose front half:






So, clearly I've had exhaust conditions for which the saw was not tuned, to say the least. (Where's the 'stupid' smiley here?)

I had expected to find smeared rings, but no, they just look collapsed. I see no smearing at all:





So, obvisouly I need to tear it down and rebuild it, but what in the world is this yellow stuff, and how did it get caked in the exhaust port? And what, exactly, did I do wrong?

Is there a possibility a mouse was camping out in the muffler and ground his cornmeal in there ?

 

[Zodiac45]

That is some funky looking stuff! I clicked on your pix Mark and was looking at the blow up. It's deffinately something that came in through the bathroom, er.. rather muffler window I think. Has to be insect related. There's just too much of it too be anything else (besides Saddam's missing yellow cake). You did say you ran it not all that long ago and it was fine so that reinforces it. It would never have built up that fast from any other source. Truely one for the weird files.

 

[Lakeside53]

I'd go with a critter theory...

Spark screens.. I like them...

 

[Bowtie]

I'd go with a critter theory...

Spark screens.. I like them...

Sparks screens...I dont run my saws without them...and I inspect my saws to make sure they are in working order.

 

[BlueRidgeMark]

That is some funky looking stuff! I clicked on your pix Mark and was looking at the blow up. It's deffinately something that came in through the bathroom, er.. rather muffler window I think. Has to be insect related. There's just too much of it too be anything else (besides Saddam's missing yellow cake). You did say you ran it not all that long ago and it was fine so that reinforces it. It would never have built up that fast from any other source. Truely one for the weird files.

Agreed, and I think I've got it.

I got a look under a microscope - a cheapo children's model, but all I have available.

I could only get 100X to work, couldn't get anything useable at higher magnifications.

Anyway, very small, very uniform sized particles. Angular, almost faceted, and with reflected light (light coming down from on top of the sample) they look almost crystaline. With light from beneath, they are translucent.

So, I just did a quick image search, and take a lookey at the oak pollen down in the middle of the page:

http://www.aaaai.org/media/photos_graphics/pollen.stm

I've got PILES of oak pollen around my house right now!


Soooo, I went and collected some from my windsheild.

Bingo. That's what it is. Perfect match.

Some kind of bee decided to use my muffler port for a pantry! :jawdrop:


Okay, so all you muffler modding fools, now you know. The spark arrestor isn't really a spark arrestor, it's a pollen storage inhibitor!

Bleh. Now what? Clean it up, of course, but I guess I have to tear down the saw to make sure I get it all, then see how my rings are doing. Mebbe I'm okay on that.

Time for a new muffler, anyway, complete with spark arrestor!!!

 

[Sprig]

Agreed, and I think I've got it.

I got a look under a microscope - a cheapo children's model, but all I have available.

I could only get 100X to work, couldn't get anything useable at higher magnifications.

Anyway, very small, very uniform sized particles. Angular, almost faceted, and with reflected light (light coming down from on top of the sample) they look almost crystaline. With light from beneath, they are translucent.

So, I just did a quick image search, and take a lookey at the oak pollen down in the middle of the page:

http://www.aaaai.org/media/photos_graphics/pollen.stm

I've got PILES of oak pollen around my house right now!


Soooo, I went and collected some from my windsheild.

Bingo. That's what it is. Perfect match.

Some kind of bee decided to use my muffler port for a pantry! :jawdrop:


Okay, so all you muffler modding fools, now you know. The spark arrestor isn't really a spark arrestor, it's a pollen storage inhibitor!

Bleh. Now what? Clean it up, of course, but I guess I have to tear down the saw to make sure I get it all, then see how my rings are doing. Mebbe I'm okay on that.

Time for a new muffler, anyway, complete with spark arrestor!!!

(let me guess, you had your saw stored right where the wind swirled the pollen around )



Serge

 

[COLD_IRON]

At first I thought it was pollen too, but the particles looked too big to be that - guess I was wrong. Looks like you found your problem.

 

[2000ssm6]

Swing by Tom's and pick up a 361.

 

[Bowtie]

Sparks screens...I dont run my saws without them...and I inspect my saws to make sure they are in working order.

Uh huh +10,000

 

[Lakeside53]

lolol.. giving your own posts 10,000 :jawdrop: :jawdrop: :jawdrop:

 

[Bowtie]

lolol.. giving your own posts 10,000 :jawdrop: :jawdrop: :jawdrop:

You know what I mean. I never did understand why anyone would leave their engine unprotected on any mechanized piece of equipment.

 

[RAYINTOMBALL]

Agreed, and I think I've got it.

I got a look under a microscope - a cheapo children's model, but all I have available.

I could only get 100X to work, couldn't get anything useable at higher magnifications.

Anyway, very small, very uniform sized particles. Angular, almost faceted, and with reflected light (light coming down from on top of the sample) they look almost crystaline. With light from beneath, they are translucent.

So, I just did a quick image search, and take a lookey at the oak pollen down in the middle of the page:

http://www.aaaai.org/media/photos_graphics/pollen.stm

I've got PILES of oak pollen around my house right now!


Soooo, I went and collected some from my windsheild.

Bingo. That's what it is. Perfect match.

Some kind of bee decided to use my muffler port for a pantry! :jawdrop:


Okay, so all you muffler modding fools, now you know. The spark arrestor isn't really a spark arrestor, it's a pollen storage inhibitor!

Bleh. Now what? Clean it up, of course, but I guess I have to tear down the saw to make sure I get it all, then see how my rings are doing. Mebbe I'm okay on that.

Time for a new muffler, anyway, complete with spark arrestor!!!

Good job BlueRidgeMark 6 hours and 32 min. from first post to case solved. . CSI could'nt of done that good.