Good ground guys

[Greg]

Guys I thought it might be good to start a thread about the good things gound guys do. Namely saving climbers butts!! On a couple of occasions an alert ground guy has helped to save me from harm.
-Once working at about 75ft in a large loblolly pine I was waiting for clear ground, watching the bobcat moving the brush and limbs away I noticed that my climbing line snaked it's way into the brush pile that was just grabbed by the cat and my line was moving out with it. 4 guys on the ground, 1 in the cat looking backwards as he is pulling the brush away (with my line), 1 guy with a finger up his nose, 1 guy with a finger up his butt, and 1 other guy chasing after the cat to get him to stop because he saw my line being pulled. I watched the whole thing, and was yelling at the top of my lungs the whole time, but no one on the ground could hear me.
I did also have a lanyard tied in, but as my line was being pulled away I was frantically trying to get those Biners open to get off the line.

 

[geofore]

where's the whistle?

Why doesn't the ground guy have a whistle to get the cat operator's attention? The guy in the bobcat will hear the whistle before he'll hear you yelling as will the other ground guys. What is the signal for All STOP!, Look and Listen on the job? Did you go over that at the morning tailgate talk before you started today when you named the ground guy in charge? If the ground guy saves your life, do not forget to give him an Atta Boy in front of the others today. An Atta Boy in front of the others shows you apperciate the save and reward good work. A Thank you works too.

 

[Tom Dunlap]

Why doesn"t EVERYONE on the jobsite have Fox 40 whistles?

Mine is on a Croakie-type lanyard that I got at a trade show. The connector was used to clip the name tag. I put a whistle on the connector so that it will break away and not turn into a garrot.

Good thing you had a wide awake groundie!

When I have jobs like that I make sure that my rope is in a bag or draped over a limb in the tree not tailing around on the ground.

Tom

 

[Crispin Hoar]

groundies

On our crew we use two climbers. They seem to be the best groundies. They know what you are doing. I like a groundie that can and does reply " all clear" when I need to hear it:angel:

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

I've had a few draggers that are like ball boys at a tennis match. Nothing like coming dow and not having to do squat.

I like a groundie that keeps my rope free without having to be asked. Had a few guys that would regularly stuff it in the bag so it would not tangle on branches. One guy would stop me and tie it off so i could pull it through crotches...

One probelm I see with climbers grounding is that they will back seat the guy in the tree. With a team this can work great, but I know a few guys I've annoyed by making "suggestions".

 

[TREETX]

To me it is all about communication and understanding. Comminicating even more than neccessary ok, all clear,....Can't remember the last time I though, "he sure does tell me way too much about the status of things.."

Understanding that we are there to to do job together. Getting those limbs out of the yard is equally important to getting them out of the tree when it comes to getting a check from the customer.

It is not about who does what. I may do this and you may do that, but together WE get it done. Reguardless of who is climbing.

 

[Jumper]

I do carry a whistle, a holdover from the Army I guess. I never have worked for a climber that considered himself a prima donna, so guess I am fortunate. Everyone helped in the final clean up, and hopefully drove away from the site check in hand. The only problem I ever had was from another groundie, who took exception that I (in his eyes anyways) disappeared for a few minutes. I actually was letting the condo tree chairperson know we were on site and what our plan was for the day. I always ended up preparing the bill for presentation as I doubt the other two could write too well or do simple math-this is not an exageration, so if there was a total of ten minutes I was needed to be engaged in doing other things, that would be it. Otherwise we all dragged, chipped and cleaned up. I think we were a good team once the few rough edges were eliminated.

 

[Acer]

Originally posted by TREETX

Understanding that we are there to to do job together. Getting those limbs out of the yard is equally important to getting them out of the tree when it comes to getting a check from the customer.

Isn't it just! Perhaps there ought to be a "Cleaning up and clearing out" forum, with tips and tricks for the clean up work that must be at least 50% of the job time (certainy in the UK, with smaller gardens and more clutter.....often, everything has to be rammed through a 3' gate or passage). For example, when starting my business, I bought saws, ropes, pulleys blocks... only 3 years later I bought a blower. That blower has saved me hours and hours of cleanup..it's fantastic!!.. I wish I'd bought it earlier. The blower is probably the 3rd most important tool, after the climbing saw and ropes.. but I dismissed it because it wasn't helpful in the "important" work of pruning/dismantling.

As for prima donna climbers, I seemed to have worked with plenty..I'm wondering whether it's a national thing, but so many climbers here seem to think that their job is done once the last branch has hit the deck. As clearing up is beneath them (in every sense of the words), they never learn how to work in a style that helps groundies clear up the mess.

 

[treeclimber165]

I rarely rope huge pieces down because it creates such a mess of work for the ground crew. I enjoy setting a pace using similar size limbs when roping so everyone can work steadily without being overwhelmed.
Years ago I worked with enough climbers who would bury the ground guy (me) and then sit on their arse while I cleaned it up or else they would start chunking wood on a large pile of crossed-up limbs. I also worked with guys who could practically stack the brush from up in the tree.
I like making it easier for the ground crew when I can. The job isn't done until the tree is in the truck. If I create extra work for them while aloft, the job will take longer and I will end up humping more brush and logs once I come down.

 

[Acer]

Brian, you're right.

Before starting tree work, I was in manufacturing industry. Enginners the world over (especially the Japanese) realised that the whole process can only go as fast as the slowest operation - the bottleneck. If the bottleneck is the ground team..perhaps for reasons like difficult garden, full of ornaments, or long drag distance, there's no point in the climber dumping the tree and then sitting back, smoking and congratulating himself on how fast he is, On most jobs, I take my time, but try to cut everything "chipper ready". In that way, when I get back down on the ground, virtually everything's been done..

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Working with big peices, a good climber can keep several ground guys buisy on a removal. Granted there will be a lot of jobs where you have to work small, but if the job is palnned properly the team will be able to rig out big peices and the ground cleans up while the climber sets up for the next one.

Then if an ATV is put in the mix....

 

[Greg]

After my near miss in the big Pine I mentioned above, I did buy a whistle from Sherrill, I then lost that whistle working in the woods on the very next job and have not replaced it yet. I know I need to....

I realy want to get an ATV this year. I've used my brothers (150?) honda 4x4 and is has been a big help. I'd like to get one a little bigger however.
Greg

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Bombardier is the caddi of quadies, in all aspects incuding price.

 

[treeclimber165]

Greg-
I had a black Fox40 and promptly lost it as well. I replaced it with the orange one and still have it a year later. I leave it clipped on my belt so I always have it whenever I'm in a tree. Work, play, whatever. If I'm wearing my saddle I have the whistle.

 

[Herkfe]

A view from the bottom...

Since this was started about groundies I would like to add a few thoughts of my own. I spend the majority of my time on the ground, but do climb occasionally. The climber/owner of the company and I have a great repoire and it makes jobs go much quicker because we can bounce ideas off each other. Besides, he is just plain a better climber, but I'm working on it. Also, I tend to do a lot of reading and research (places like this) and then we work together to make things more efficient.

Anyway....when he adds new people to the crew we both go out of our way to teach these guys some basics, something that was not done for me with my former "Arborist". There are guys who really want to learn and then there are those who couldn't care less. The latter we obviously try to stay away from. My point is that we do try to really teach, including books, hands on etc. All too often the guy in the tree complains about the groundies but never works to solve the problem. I wish I had a buck for every new guy that said he knews how to tie a decent knot but instead follows the old adage "If you can't tie good knots, tie LOTS of knots!" Too often new guys say they know how to do things but are just unwilling to admit their lack of knowlege, or have bad habits from their former employers. Teach them YOUR way of doing it right!

And on the subject of prima donnas....the owner of another company I worked with was a big guy. Stress tested the rope if you know what I mean! Anyway, one fine summer day he is coming down out of a removal and was about thirty feet up screaming about a million different things, none of which were relevant. So as he is coming down his pants are sliding down giving us that plumbers smile. So....my friend just kind of steps on the rope to hold him in place. The moon was out early! We all had a good laugh and even our climber/boss thought it was funny.....once he was down and had a cold beer in his hand! We did ask him to ensure those drawers wouldn't drop the next day!

People will perform only to the level that you push them too. It's easy to complain but it takes work to solve things. If you find a good guy, work with him, teach them, it will pay off.

 

[Dan Flinn]

I agree with the idea that the best ground men are climbers. I work as a ground man with a friend of mine and it gives me ideas of what to convey to my ground men. I like it when the ground man unties the lowering line and then pulls it back to me. I like it when he sees when I have the line tied and puts it into the break before I ask.

I try to do what I can to ease the ground man's work as well. Like when cutting small limbs (with a handsaw) that can be caught and tossed, toss them towards the chipper with the butt first.

I have a couple of guys, now, that I still have to prompt, but I take some of the blame for that. I'm not the easiest guy to work for and I think they wait to find out how I want to perform a task before they take it upon themselves and don't do it the way I want.

All in good time....

Dan

 

[Jumper]

Originally posted by John Paul Sanborn
Bombardier is the caddi of quadies, in all aspects incuding price.

For the federal money that has been pumped into this Quebec Company, it had better be high quality.