Grind with the grain???

[ladderslug]

Is there a preferred direction of grinding a stump? Is there a grain or a softer side or something? It seems that all of the sides of a stump would be equally dense. I have heard of "grinding with the grain" but I can't seem to find it.

 

[BC WetCoast]

It's easier to grind the from the outside of the stump toward the middle than from the middle to the outside. The second way, you tend to cut across the fibres more. On larger stumps, I find it easier to grind from 2 or more sides towards the middle than right across the stump. But thats me, with the machine I use. Others will have different experience and opinions.

When I have to grind surface roots, especially large ones like flowering cherries, I like to grind across the grain rather than with it.

 

[ladderslug]

Thanks

Thanks for the info.

 

[arbor pro]

Is there a preferred direction of grinding a stump? Is there a grain or a softer side or something? It seems that all of the sides of a stump would be equally dense. I have heard of "grinding with the grain" but I can't seem to find it.

I think it depends on the teeth you're using and how sharp they are. When my greenteeth have a good edge on them (not necessarily new edge, just good), I can grind just about any direction on the stump without a real notable difference. When I grind runner roots with the grain, the teeth sometimes tend to 'overbite' but generally, those don't make much of a difference either.

I did notice a difference when using the older vermeer straight teeth. those were junk compared to the greenteeth I use now.

If you aren't using yellowjacket, greenteeth or sandvik teeth, I'd suggest looking into them. It costs some money to make the conversion to a new setup but, in the long run, they will be far more productive than the rayco super or vermeer old-style teeth.

 

[Mowingman]

I grind whatever direction is easiest to set up on the stump, and whatever direction will take the least moves of the machine to complete the job.
I do not think the grain makes any difference at all, if you have plenty of HP on your machine.
Jeff

 

[coolbrze]

I grind whatever direction is easiest to set up on the stump, and whatever direction will take the least moves of the machine to complete the job.

I'll 2nd that. We stump in a lot of relatively tight areas and sometimes you only have 1 angle to approach the stump.

 

[Plyscamp]

The grain in a stump runs from horizontal in the root to vertical in the tree trunk. Knowing that, think about whittling a stick with a knife when you were a kid. If you sliced the stick lengthwise (with the grain) you could pull off big chips real easy. If you tried to cut across the stick ( cross grain )it was very difficult. The sweet spot as some call it is nothing more than cutting with the grain.

When you start to grind a stump start about 12" in front of the stump and grind down in the dirt so you can grind through the stump (with the grain) instead of starting on top of the stump grinding cross grain. Just like your whittling knife you will pull nice long chips with less effort. If you have a low power unit it will become a little more difficult on the back side of the stump as the grain is changing from vertical to horizontal and forcing you to again cut cross grain. If space allows you can move to the other side of the stump and it will cut easier. I hope this explanation makes sense. Good grinding to all and to all a goodnight.

 

[NCgrinder]

I generally do the same as Plyscamp,in starting about 10/12" in front and grinding down...Then ,I raise the wheel back up,grind all the way across and all the way down..If it's a large stump and I have the access,the way my 252 is designed I have to grind around in a clockwise direction ( the cutter shaft belt drive cover hits the ground & keeps me from getting the depth) . It may all be my imagination ,but it seems that some stumps grind easier on different sides. Sometimes they start hard and get easier on the other side. Then others start easy and get harder on the other side..Could it be the side of the tree that has the prevalent sun exposure??? Maybe that side is denser..Magnetic pull, alien forces,voodoo,who knows what...Just seems that way..
Any other SWAG's ,actual knowledge,BS opinions,etc..

Stan

 

[Shadow]

"When you start to grind a stump start about 12" in front of the stump and grind down in the dirt "

Am I reading this right? You grind dirt before the stump? Along with rocks and chains and whatever else is around the stump?

I try not to touch any dirt until the whole stump is ground down to the dirt.

Grain does not make any difference.. gaurenteed.

If you have a long root running across the ground which is easier across it or length ways? Length ways you'll be there a long time.

 

[gr8scott72]

"When you start to grind a stump start about 12" in front of the stump and grind down in the dirt "

Am I reading this right? You grind dirt before the stump? Along with rocks and chains and whatever else is around the stump?

I try not to touch any dirt until the whole stump is ground down to the dirt.

Grain does not make any difference.. gaurenteed.

If you have a long root running across the ground which is easier across it or length ways? Length ways you'll be there a long time.

Not everybody has rocky soil. I grind starting just before the stump also.

Grain does make a difference. If you take a bigger forward bite, which makes you cut further across the grain, you get smaller chips and slower progress. If you take smaller forward bites but then lower the cutter head more on each pass, you make longer chips and will cut faster. This is even more true with greenteeth. They cut HUGE ribbons of wood (when sharp) when cutting with the grain. Still applies for my Sandvik wheel too.

If you cut roots across the grain with a large stump grinder, you chew up more of the customer's yard than if you run with the roots.

 

[Bigstumps]

Levco used to build a machine with a giant drum - about 30" across and probably 25" diameter. You would drum the drum straight down on the stump.

With all the teeth sharp this thing would demolish stumps - once the teeth were kind of dull the drum would bounce on top of the stump.

Levco's big selling point was grind straight down with the grain.

Hard to really cut 100% with the grain since any grinder is spinning in an arc and pivoting.

Sharp teeth and horsepower - doesn't make any difference.

 

[Steve-Maine]

Grind with the grain.

When I was grinding stumps. I had a Vermeer 2465A with 80HP diesel and a mini-chief with 35 HP diesel. I always started in front of stump and got the deepth first and then started working to the back of stumps.

 

[Plyscamp]

Shadow how many days does it take you to grind a stump? They are planted in dirt you cant avoid it. An no one grinds in more rock than we do. I was the reason rock teeth were developed for the Alpine Magnum. And how could it make any difference which way you cut the root if you gaurantee the grain does not make a difference.

 

[Shadow]

Of course I grind in the dirt! You cant help it. But I sure dont start out in the dirt and grind forward through a foot of dirt before I start grinding stump!

If I have 4 stumps in a back yard, I will go around and grind all 4 down to the dirt, without touching very little dirt.

Then I'll go back and grind therm down 6-8 inches below ground level. But if I'm in an area where no rocks are present I'll often just complete the stump and move on.

Before I start I take my trenching spade and jab it down close to the stump all the way around, if no rocks or chains or old clotheslines or ?, then I proceed.

I NEVER check to see which way the grain is running, I set up whichever side is convieniant for me to work and never move around the stump unless something inhibits me from finishing grinding.

If there are roots running above ground or just below, I'll go along and cut across the root about every foot and go along after and lift out the pieces by hand. I sure as hell dont grind lenght ways along a root going 3 feet out.So I think common sense dictates not to go with the grain in that situation.

I used rock teeth the first year or so because I thought you needed to, Now I havent used them in over 2 years. I can make a set of teeth last a long time and I have mastered sharpening them so they cut like brand new.!

And as for how long it takes me to grind a stump,with all due respect I'd be half done before some of you guys figured out which way the grain was running!

 

[gr8scott72]

Of course I grind in the dirt! You cant help it. But I sure dont start out in the dirt and grind forward through a foot of dirt before I start grinding stump!

If I have 4 stumps in a back yard, I will go around and grind all 4 down to the dirt, without touching very little dirt.

Then I'll go back and grind therm down 6-8 inches below ground level. But if I'm in an area where no rocks are present I'll often just complete the stump and move on.

Before I start I take my trenching spade and jab it down close to the stump all the way around, if no rocks or chains or old clotheslines or ?, then I proceed.

I NEVER check to see which way the grain is running, I set up whichever side is convieniant for me to work and never move around the stump unless something inhibits me from finishing grinding.

If there are roots running above ground or just below, I'll go along and cut across the root about every foot and go along after and lift out the pieces by hand. I sure as hell dont grind lenght ways along a root going 3 feet out.So I think common sense dictates not to go with the grain in that situation.

I used rock teeth the first year or so because I thought you needed to, Now I havent used them in over 2 years. I can make a set of teeth last a long time and I have mastered sharpening them so they cut like brand new.!

And as for how long it takes me to grind a stump,with all due respect I'd be half done before some of you guys figured out which way the grain was running!

Figure out which way the grain runs? Funny. I thought trees grew up which would make the grain go up the stump. It's not rocket science.

And cut roots every foot and then pick all the pieces up? Much faster to just grind the root starting at one end and travel down the root. With my Carlton, I don't even have to move the cutter head. I can just drive up the root with the cutter wheel on the root and adjust the travel so it eats the root as I travel up towards (or away from) the stump.

 

[Shadow]

"And cut roots every foot and then pick all the pieces up? Much faster to just grind the root starting at one end and travel down the root. With my Carlton, I don't even have to move the cutter head. I can just drive up the root with the cutter wheel on the root and adjust the travel so it eats the root as I travel up towards (or away from) the stump. "

And so your machine is sitting in the hole where you just ground out the stump? And if there is 3 or 4 roots going in different directions, you follow each one out then back up and turn things around to follow another one out? I guess you would have to. I'm using the Alpine Magnum so I can just pivot and make 5 or 6 cuts without moving. And yes if its a large underground root I'll grind it length ways but if its close to the surface it gets chopped up.

 

[Oly's Stump]

I never look at the grain of a stump. One thing I can say is that cutting a fresh cut green stump is quicker then cutting a stump that is a year old.

 

[Plyscamp]

As I stated in another post I ground 77 Eucs, ranging from 12"s to 50" in 5 hours the other day and that included lunch. I will be done with the stump while your still looking for the bike chain. If you read some of my other posts you will also find that razor sharp teeth love to shatter on rocks, semi sharp teeth don't. Actually I could care less how you grind as you don't work for me. I have been grinding stumps only for my living for the last 15 years. If I am not grinding stumps I am not earning a dime. I posted to assist somebody in understanding how the grain works in a stump so he could understand the grain and assist him in his grinding ability. If you feel that the grain does not make a difference your welcome to your opinion, I am 68 Years old and I will gladly stand and grind equal stumps with you anytime and I already know who will finish first. And this is the last I will post on the subject.

 

[Curbside]

I can see Shadow's technique working with the Alpine and he probably should have stated earlier that is the machine he was using because most people don't use the Alpine most use a standard type of stump machine. I'm not going to enter the grain debate but everyone knows the machines cut better at different angles. I know many hardcore Alpine guys say their machine is so fast ect ect. Well they don't compare to a high horsepower machine and if the teeth are sharp and the soil conditions are perfect they will outcut a 252 but how often is everything perfect and a 252 is not very fast either but it is steady in almost any conditions.

 

[Shadow]

I totally agree each machine must cut very different.

And different machines must work with the grain different. The part that got me and still does ,is digging 12 inches of dirt before approaching the stump.


If I was to sink the Alpine in the dirt 12'' before the stump and head into the stump nose first, It would hit that stump and pull me and it right over top of the stump!

You would have to get used to grinding with dull teeth. When I grind a 12'' stump on someones front lawn I sure am not going to leave a 24'' diameter hole. I pride myself in disturbing as little as possible soil around the stump.

And hey after all this is a discussion forum so its been a good discussion.