Help with a fireplace not drawing

[deakin]

Background on the problem.

Installed a heatalator type fireplace. Hearth is 14" off the floor. Installed as per manufacture regulations. No matter what wood is used or how the fire is built, ie paper to heat the chimney, the smoke will roll into the house from each corner of the unit.

Called the factory. They first suggested more pipe, I needed at least 12' of pipe no matter what the installation guide said. It stated to be above a line of level 10' from the pipe. Did that. Then went to the 12' idea. Now I have 8' of 8" pipe above the roof line which put the cap nearly 4' above the ridge. What an eyesore.

That didn't work. Another call and this time they wanted a fresh air kit installed. Did that. Still smokes into the house.

I make sure all fans are off. Central air is off. All the windows closed and all doors shut. Still back drafts into the house. Not all the time and not with any certainty except with a strong North wind. Pipe is on the North side of the house.

While smoking into the house you can open any window and the draw makes no difference at all. If you open the front door within just about 4' of the fireplace it draws like no tomorrow.

Short of taking out the wall and replacing the whole thing I have not a clue about how to make this thing draw like it should. It can be burning well and without a wind change or door opening or any change that I can tell you just smell the smoke and then the haze is there. Open the front door and no more smoke. With a North facing door and a blowing snow it just seems a wash to have the door open and the fireplace going.

Any ideas? Thanks for your help.

 

[blis]

sounds like its not getting enough fresh air incase opening the door makes it draw again, maybe next time try with central air ON...

 

[mga]

1. the most obvious: is the flu open all the way? ( i gotta ask...sorry)
2. what is the outside temp when this happens?
3. is the chimney on an outside wall or in the middle of the house?
4. when you get a fire going, does it continue to back-draft?

 

[deakin]

Yes the flu is open, no offense.
Chimney is about 18" off the North wall of the house.
Temp doesn't matter.
Even after the fire has been going for an hour perhaps more it just starts the back drafting.

I thought that the fresh air kit was the answer as the pvc is 2" and is on the North wall just out side of the fireplace. If it were fresh air wouldn't a window open take care of the flow? I have 4 windows in a bay doorway they are right around the door. If you open one or all of them it makes no difference. You can just crack open the front door and viola.

I am about to just throw a match on the old wood pile and buy some Oscar Meyers and marsh mellows and invite the neighbors over.

 

[mga]

If you open one or all of them it makes no difference. You can just crack open the front door and viola.

damn.....an interesting problem you have there....it's a head scratcher for sure.

 

[mga]

i was giving your problem some thought....do you have any fans that vent the house such as a Humidex or something similar?

 

[deakin]

No venting fans. I do have a wind turbine that vents the attic. I usually have a cover on them during the colder months. One is not working now and I haven't covered the other for a couple of years.

I will try that idea as I have exhausted almost every option except just to leave open the front door. I am in the process of replacing the front door trying to find an answer.

I had not finished the front of the hearth before this last burn test. I thought that the air was moving under the hearth area and creating a swirling action but after closing off the face of the hearth the smoke was still there.

 

[wobdee]

Sounds like a negitive pressure problem. The fireplace is sucking so much air from your tight house it runs out and sucks air back down the chimney. Does your fireplace have outside air hook up? Is that what your 2" pvc is, or is that just an air supply next to fireplace? Either way 2" is too small. Look in your manual or call the company and see if there is a way to hook the fireplace directly to outside air for combustion. I did this to my older masonary heatalator fireplace and I no longer have smoking problems.

 

[njtuna]

we have a fireplace xtrordinaire heatilator type fireplace. the fan is on the outside of the house, drawing that air through and into the house. the fireplace itself draws air directly from the outside, via two vents. maybe this will help you?

 

[deakin]

Will try and find out the outside air flow idea. The 2" was too small. Called the store and confirmed that the air intake is 4". I have it with a 90 up and out of the wall just under the soffit on the North wall.

I am thinking of a tee in the line and another air vent. I have called a chimney sweep and installer for a demo of the problem at the request of the salesmen. Just passing the buck I think.

 

[olyman]

as others said--need at least a 4 in intake line----got to use a good sized intake pipe on the new houses because they are soooo tight---older folks that dont leave the house very often--have died in a newer house that was too tight--no outside air in--and they aspixiated---no joke--

 

[RaisedByWolves]

Did the stoves manufacturer spec the 8" pipe?




If not, thats your problem more than anything.




.

 

[deakin]

Yes sir the stove pipe is standard. It came in a package. I know that it can't be a house too tight. In a good wind the curtains will move some. I am going to replace windows and doors as I can find the extra funds.

I may just have to build the fire in the middle of the floor and go native. Just take my 361 and open up the roof just a little and viola.

 

[leon]

stove etc.

Yes sir the stove pipe is standard. It came in a package. I know that it can't be a house too tight. In a good wind the curtains will move some. I am going to replace windows and doors as I can find the extra funds.

I may just have to build the fire in the middle of the floor and go native. Just take my 361 and open up the roof just a little and viola.

I have a feeling it is mostly both your attic turbines that are causing the trouble, as rhey both are drawing air out of the house even though one is covered; I think you will be forced to remove them during the wood burning season and plug the vents with a sheet metal plug with a tight fit mind you.

You should see about borrowing a manomometer and a wind speed meter to verify the draw of incoming air tot he stove at the nlet and outgoing air from the stove at the chimney/stove outlet; do you have a cap on the chimney? you may have a BIRDS NEST IN IT WITH OUT REALISING IT-HAPPENED TO ME WITH STARLINGS.:chainsawguy: