Inside the 372XP X-TORQ

[THALL10326]

What law am I breaking by modding a strato saw? They're no longer a new saw when they leave here and I'm not a dealer.

Brad lets not play stupid now, you know full well what your doing is illegal as hell. Do you really think your outside the law when Stihl, Husqvarna and all the rest, including the dealers have to abide by the law, somehow your specail and don't have to abide, come now, lets get real. I just find it amazing its all over the net for the world to see, any idea how it got there or better yet why its there? Carry on man, when the piper comes knocking one day you sure as hell can't say you wasn't told or pretend you didn't know. Not wishing you any bad luck but you know when you play with fire long enuff sooner or later you get burnt...

 

[WoodChuck'r]

And Woodchucker, I'm not suggesting you're jealous of me. You have no reason to be. But if you go back and read your post, reading it as from the outside looking in, it simiply reads as nothing but suggesting that this saw is not what it's claimed to be.

Brad, I was strictly talking about race saws in general, and an alky piped 281 which I had already mentioned before. Weime was talking about racing quads and whatnot so I figured I'd add to the conversation since he asked me my opinion.

Now maybe an outside reader would presume that I'm bashing this saw and your work with my post. Or maybe they would presume I'm talking about how easily something can be made to be great when it really isn't. I followed that post with one about my truck. If anything my comment could be taken the other way by others who know that it IS hard to build saws and seeing this one thinking it runs good. I was merely just sharing a separate thought - not every thread stays exactly on topic all the time!

That and (once again) I have no clue why my name or Eric's name was mentioned. This whole thinks REEKS of my 681. What happened happened, you and I settled it, it's over and done with. Besides it was almost 9 months ago.

How I got dragged into this **** AFTER things calmed down in this thread yesterday I have no idea.


Oh and I love whoever put the tag at the bottom of the page that says "woodchucker ballsac". That's real cute......

 

[WoodChuck'r]

Oh, and don't mind my typos. This iPhone corrects words but not always correctly!

 

[cpr]

wonder how the IRS see's that?

Enough with the threats.

You want someone to refute your premise, fine. You demand the thousands of dollars in investments for tools, dynos, and flowbenches for a hobby that has at most a couple of thousand potential customers. Ain't gonna happen. What's the going rate for a staff metrician these days? You compare Brad to FMF. How many pipes to they sell a year? Several 1000? 10,000? Also, they are a manufacturer, Brad isn't. Of course FMF is going to offer warranties, etc. They are responsible for the production of their pipes, porters are not. A bit like bawling out the Amish guy who made your table because Sauder puts it in a box and offers to take it back 30 days no questions asked.

You aren't the only one with motorsports familiarity. Dance around the warranty idea, but I GUARNATEE Sonny's, Sassy, Steve Schmidt, AJPE, Long Machine, Miner Bros., Fowler Engines, BAE, Hypermax, GMS, REI, Challenger, St. Clair, Indy Cylinder Head, Lemke Machine, Bultemeier Motorsports, Baker Engines, and a couple hundred other race engine builders I could name DO NOT offer a warranty on motors despite the time spent refining procedures, doing the design work, modeling, dyno pulls, etc...

 

[ChipMonger]

MODS if your around can you clean this thread up please. This is absolutely absurd now. Thanks.

 

[blsnelling]

Brad lets not play stupid now, you know full well what your doing is illegal as hell. Do you really think your outside the law when Stihl, Husqvarna and all the rest, including the dealers have to abide by the law, somehow your specail and don't have to abide, come now, lets get real. I just find it amazing its all over the net for the world to see, any idea how it got there or better yet why its there? Carry on man, when the piper comes knocking one day you sure as hell can't say you wasn't told or pretend you didn't know. Not wishing you any bad luck but you know when you play with fire long enuff sooner or later you get burnt...

I'm not playing stupid. You show me one place where the law forbids a customer from modding their saws. That would be news to me.

 

[weimedog]

Brad, I was strictly talking about race saws in general, and an alky piped 281 which I had already mentioned before. Weime was talking about racing quads and whatnot so I figured I'd add to the conversation since he asked me my opinion.

Now maybe an outside reader would presume that I'm bashing this saw and your work with my post. Or maybe they would presume I'm talking about how easily something can be made to be great when it really isn't. I followed that post with one about my truck. If anything my comment could be taken the other way by others who know that it IS hard to build saws and seeing this one thinking it runs good. I was merely just sharing a separate thought - not every thread stays exactly on topic all the time!

That and (once again) I have no clue why my name or Eric's name was mentioned. This whole thinks REEKS of my 681. What happened happened, you and I settled it, it's over and done with. Besides it was almost 9 months ago.

How I got dragged into this **** AFTER things calmed down in this thread yesterday I have no idea.


Oh and I love whoever put the tag at the bottom of the page that says "woodchucker ballsac". That's real cute......

And woodchucker you and your experiences had not even a little bit to do with my questioning the "mod for hire" culture developing here. This is something that has bothered me after being in the motorcycle racing world for everything as a rider to a vendor for many years. I don';t know this other guy at all although I have seen his work at our GTG's and I don't know a thing about Brad other than what he's has added to this website. My interest is to get folks thinking along the lines of "what am I getting for my money"? Brad wants to deal in the subjective and has clearly stated so..and really the only objection I have relative to Brad so far is the combination of attacks and the fact he seems to be so vehemently interested in KEEPING saw modding in the subjective realm! Damn why NOT be able to compare yours with other?

 

[weimedog]

Enough with the threats.

You want someone to refute your premise, fine. You demand the thousands of dollars in investments for tools, dynos, and flowbenches for a hobby that has at most a couple of thousand potential customers. Ain't gonna happen. What's the going rate for a staff metrician these days? You compare Brad to FMF. How many pipes to they sell a year? Several 1000? 10,000? Also, they are a manufacturer, Brad isn't. Of course FMF is going to offer warranties, etc. They are responsible for the production of their pipes, porters are not. A bit like bawling out the Amish guy who made your table because Sauder puts it in a box and offers to take it back 30 days no questions asked.

You aren't the only one with motorsports familiarity. Dance around the warranty idea, but I GUARNATEE Sonny's, Sassy, Steve Schmidt, AJPE, Long Machine, Miner Bros., Fowler Engines, BAE, Hypermax, GMS, REI, Challenger, St. Clair, Indy Cylinder Head, Lemke Machine, Bultemeier Motorsports, Baker Engines, and a couple hundred other race engine builders I could name DO NOT offer a warranty on motors despite the time spent refining procedures, doing the design work, modeling, dyno pulls, etc...

As all involved understand....I don't have an issue.....

 

[blsnelling]

yet again..you say it better than I could. They do this with a simple leap of faith...(I actually have to go work for my money so will have to chime in later.) And you really don't have to please me...I like to put my money where I know I will get a return. That implication is obvious to me now. My bet is the more you talk the more obvious it will become to others on the fence. I was good with you up to these last few posts..you have clearly articulated exactly my case. You do expect all to take the leap with you. You have no risk..as with no R&D to back up your mods, its all a gamble and no written warranty if all goes wrong. The customer has to rely on your resources and good nature to make them whole again. In this case you did....wonder if any chips got down there and scored a seal..maybe doesn't show up for a while? What would you do? Say that's the risk you took mr. chips? Like I said, I have to admit you are pure truth in advertising. So what would you do if one of your builds wasn't what the customer expected after spending $750 to $1000 on the project (saw & mods included)? What if one of your builds fell flat relative to to thers at a GTG or some other tangible arena and the customer was PO'ed as it wasn't what he expected? What woud you do if a month in after a mod the saw fried itself on the job for a logger trying to make his numbers? What would you do? Give him his money back? Return the saw to original condition? What? You act is if your some unwilling partner in this...wonder how the IRS see's that?

Now that you've been called out, all you can do is get mad and throw stones? Puuuuulease! First you state I have nothing to lose. Then you turn around and explain exactly what I do have to lose. I've demonstrated in this very thread what I would do if something did go wrong. Moderators, it's time you stepped in and did something about it. This man is threatening me and that is against site rules. Not only are you threatening me, you are throwing crap at my work when you do not own it or have any experience with it. Both of those are site violations. Please do something about it. I'm done with you.

 

[blsnelling]

Brad, I was strictly talking about race saws in general, and an alky piped 281 which I had already mentioned before. Weime was talking about racing quads and whatnot so I figured I'd add to the conversation since he asked me my opinion.

Now maybe an outside reader would presume that I'm bashing this saw and your work with my post. Or maybe they would presume I'm talking about how easily something can be made to be great when it really isn't. I followed that post with one about my truck. If anything my comment could be taken the other way by others who know that it IS hard to build saws and seeing this one thinking it runs good. I was merely just sharing a separate thought - not every thread stays exactly on topic all the time!

That and (once again) I have no clue why my name or Eric's name was mentioned. This whole thinks REEKS of my 681. What happened happened, you and I settled it, it's over and done with. Besides it was almost 9 months ago.

How I got dragged into this **** AFTER things calmed down in this thread yesterday I have no idea.


Oh and I love whoever put the tag at the bottom of the page that says "woodchucker ballsac". That's real cute......

Jason, I'll take your word for it, and thank you for always being amiable. I had nothing to do with the tags, and would not stoop that low. It's not how I feel anyway. I do like weimedogs new name though, lol But I didn't do that either.

 

[cpr]

As all involved understand....I don't have an issue.....

Okay.

I addressed your premise...

 

[mdavlee]

I don't see what the big problem is here. Brad builds work saws. If anyone is looking for a real hot cookie cutter he tells them to seek someone else. If the people paying for mods are happy with what he does then why all the complaining from people that don't have his saws.

 

[Metals406]

Hey Brad. . . How long has this crap gone on for? 2 years now? I don't know how you do it man -- this must be the 700th time you've been raked over the coals on here.

Maybe you should hang up you belt, and just mod for yourself and friends? I wouldn't want to eat all the crap you've had to swallow.

I know your day job pays pretty dang well, and this saw mod stuff just supports the saw stuff.

If you recall, this garbage started happening to almost all of your threads after you became a sponsor and offered a service. Before that, not so much.

*sigh* I hate to say it, but this thread should probably either be cleaned out or locked (as has happened to it's predecessors). . . And move on to the next one.

History has shown what will assuredly happen again.

 

[Andyshine77]

I took no issue with what dog was saying about Brad's work or his R&D, that is between them. I did take personal offense to being called a monkey, this showed dog's true self and intent. Than he promptly deleted wheat he said. End of story.

 

[blsnelling]

Hey Brad. . . How long his this crap gone on for? 2 years now? I don't know how you do it man -- this must be the 700th time you've been raked over the coals on here.

Maybe you should hang up you belt, and just mod for yourself and friends? I wouldn't want to eat all the crap you've had to swallow.

I know your day job pays pretty dang well, and this saw mod stuff just supports the saw stuff.

If you recall, this garbage started happening to almost all of your threads after you became a sponsor and offered a service. Before that, not so much.

*sigh* I hate to say it, but this thread should probably either be cleaned out or locked (as has happened to it's predecessors). . . And move on to the next one.

History has shown what will assuredly happen again.

It all started when I bought my sponsorship 2 years ago in January. I took my first paid port job two years ago this month, and figured I'd better get my sponsorship, rather than be banned. It always has been, and always will be about a hobby. The big difference with me is that I show nearly everything I do. That places me in the lime light, for good or for bad. There are several different reasons why people have hated on me, but they're all pretty pathetic. It's hard to believe that grown men act the way they do. Why this site allows it to go on the way they do is beyond me. They can ban me if they want to for saying that, but it's entirely in their power to stop this crap. To this point, they have choosen not to. I would not be the first builder that has been driven off for this very reason. It wouldn't take a whole lot for the haters to get the message, and the crap would stop for the most part. They simply need to get that message, but that message has not been sent, at least not strong enough. The crap continues. It would be a better place for ALL of us if it would stop. I just wish they would do what's right for all of us. I enjoy this place for the most part, but could sure live without all the drama and mud slinging.

 

[Outlaw5.0]

I commend you Brad, I would have given up long time ago. This crap is why I just do stuff for myself and friends, its not worth the B/S and stress!.

 

[blsnelling]

I commend you Brad, I would have given up long time ago. This crap is why I just do stuff for myself and friends, its not worth the B/S and stress!.

I held to that same opinion for a long time. Enough people were asking for me to port there saws, that I finally decided to let the hobby start paying for itself. Basically anything I get goes right back into saws. Besides, if I quit, I just feel like I've let them win. I have to admit though, it has crossed my mind.

 

[FATGUY]

" I don't like Bed Bath & Beyond, I don't like what goes on at Bed Bath & Beyond, so you know what I do about it? I DON'T GO THERE!"-Augie Smith, Bob & Tom show...

Weimedog, if you don't see the value in his work, don't have him work for you.
Brad, you built my personal favorite saw, bet a lot of people on here can say that....
Andre, you are a monkey:biggrinbounce2:

 

[Metals406]

It all started when I bought my sponsorship 2 years ago in January. I took my first paid port job two years ago this month, and figured I'd better get my sponsorship, rather than be banned. It always has been, and always will be about a hobby. The big difference with me is that I show nearly everything I do. That places me in the lime light, for good or for bad. There are several different reasons why people have hated on me, but they're all pretty pathetic. It's hard to believe that grown men act the way they do. Why this site allows it to go on the way they do is beyond me. They can ban me if they want to for saying that, but it's entirely in their power to stop this crap. To this point, they have choosen not to. I would not be the first builder that has been driven off for this very reason. It wouldn't take a whole lot for the haters to get the message, and the crap would stop for the most part. They simply need to get that message, but that message has not been sent, at least not strong enough. The crap continues. It would be a better place for ALL of us if it would stop. I just wish they would do what's right for all of us. I enjoy this place for the most part, but could sure live without all the drama and mud slinging.

My time guess was right on then. I commend you for your stick-with-it-ness. . . I would have called it a banana long ago, and found other ways of self torture!

 

[Brad101]

What law am I breaking by modding a strato saw? They're no longer a new saw when they leave here and I'm not a dealer.

This is from the EPA questions and answers from the New Small Engine Emission Rules Section. I do not have the time to chase down a statute number and fines listed, but I am sure they have one to prosecute on and it could be found. They surely can fine you even from a consumer standpoint. They don't care if you are a dealer or not if you do it willfully.

Here is the question and answer..

Can I make adjustments to the new engines at home?

Consumers should perform routine use and care maintenance
as recommended in the operator’s manual. However,
owners should contact a qualified engine technician
for adjustments not listed in the operator’s manual.
Owners should also be aware that it is against the law to
tamper with an EPA-certified small engine. Tampering
with a certified engine may involve adjusting the fuel or
exhaust system, or changing the engine’s performance so
that it no longer meets the manufacturer’s specifications.
Tampering may increase an engine’s exhaust emissions,
contributing to our air pollution problems. To stop customers
and repair facilities from tampering, manufacturers
have equipped many engines with special caps or plugs
that limit or prevent adjusting the fuel mixture or engine
timing. Removal of these special caps or plugs and
adjustments beyond the manufacturers specified limits are
considered tampering and may subject the violator to a
fine.

Take it for what you will but the laws are out there.