Insurance question

[darkstar]

be carful u may have to pay there self employment tax as well .... get the wc but dont go out of biz if u cant afforrd it yet ..... for cryin in tennesssee we r only requried to carry it by law if we ahev 5 full timers ....... come on state give us a level playing field dark

 

[Lumberjack]

Cross that bridge when you come to it.

I like to already know how to cross it, for me its not going to be a problem, I have employees, not contractors.

 

[Nickrosis]

I like to already know how to cross it,

For now we see through a glass, darkly... Having a system in place for bridge-crossing will leave you more flexible and adaptable in a competitive sense than learning bridge-specific crossing techniques.

In other words, if you can figure out how to cross bridges on the fly, you're in a better position than trying to learn each bridge on its own. The more you know about specific bridges, the more you have to develop an approach for other bridges. But at some point, you have to stop sampling and implement a strategy of "when we come to an unknown bridge we do this:".

I like analogies.

 

[Newfie]

fraud or not if someone working for the sub gets hurt and there is a lapse in the sub's WC or he does not carry WC, he WILL be sued.
I question your experience on insurance matters to give such flippant advice.

Fred

Who will be sued? The sub or Kentuckysawyer(that is who started the thread?)? In either event it won't matter because the sub is not his employee and the subs employees are not his employees so WC will not pay one red cent.

Thanks for the back-up Nick, I thought maybe I was missing something. He has all the insurances he needs from what he has said. WC in his instance will be a poor and expensive substitute for the others. In almost all cases his health and disabilty carriers will reduce any benefits they pay out by the amount paid out by the WC. His money would be better spent in making sure that he has adequate limits and coverage amounts on his life,DI and health.

And of course to muddy the waters, the rules tend to differ from state to state.

 

[vharrison2]

In Florida it is the law even though you don't "employe" anyone other than yourself

 

[Nickrosis]

In Florida it is the law even though you don't "employe" anyone other than yourself

Can you exempt yourself like you can in Wisconsin?

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

I would concider that you require your subs to carry a disability policy too, just to cover your assets.

 

[Nickrosis]

No, haven't required that. I would imagine that a one-man subcontractor who cut his leg open with his own saw would just be SOL. Someone working for a subcontractor who gets cut by his boss with a saw may have a bit more bite.

 

[KentuckySawyer]

Perhaps I am ignorant of what a "subcontractor" truly is. I assumed that if a person gets a 1099 then hes sub. Is this just flat out wrong, or does that vary from state to state? Is it the individual's insurance what determines their classification as an independent contractor? So I need the friend of mine dragging brush to have liability and his own WC policy in order to cover myself? Or at least to honestly consider him an independent contractor?

You veteran owners may find this amusing, but I never wanted to do this much office work. I just want to climb a freaking tree.

 

[Lumberjack]

I would think there is more to a sub contractor than what you describe. I aint a lawyer or accountant or Nick, but I would say you have an employee.

Nick posted this, might answer your questions:
http://www.irs.gov/businesses/small/article/0,,id=99921,00.html

 

[KentuckySawyer]

"To determine whether a worker is an independent contractor or an employee under common law, you must examine the relationship between the worker and the business. All evidence of control and independence in this relationship should be considered. The facts that provide this evidence fall into three categories – Behavioral Control, Financial Control, and the Type of Relationship itself."

Some of the facts listed point one way and some the other. I'd say that a brush dragger is just an employee. No offense to all brush draggers out there. I have another climber that I use, but he has NO insurance. I'm sure thats asking for trouble isn't it?

"I shoulda' learned to play them drums."

 

[Newfie]

One of the acid tests for sub or employee, as I understand it, has to do with a couple of basic things.

1) does your "sub" have a business name and/or FEIN?
2) Does he climb or drag brush for anyone else except you? Ie. are you his main or only source of income?

If these guys are just working for you then, they will probably be considered employees by the government especially after your first WC audit.

I would make sure that if your subs are legit as subs that they at least have their own liabilty coverage, especially since more and more liability policies are excluding coverage for subs.

It's a nasty business to be in business, ain't it?