low-impact logging

[Dalmatian90]

Thanks fmaglin. That gave me a much better picture.

To figure out what that $480 was relative too, I looked up the Ohio timber report that has Ash blocks @ $155/mbf, and made a guess trucking cost $400.

So he would've netted around $260 w/Amish, or $730 w/Skidder.

Guess it partly depends on how you view the glass...if $480 isn't that much and gives you a warm fuzzy feeling knowing that horses were used, or if you view it as 2/3rds of your profit gone.

 

[ShoerFast]

Just $0.02 cents worth....

Not sure what you call it in WsSconnie, but back home (Minnesota) if someone were really interested in low-impact, they just moved everything they could after freeze-up, and before the snow was too deep.

Spring offered a few weeks of less snow before the frost left the ground also.

Lot of people did not get to excited about cutting ruts in some areas. There only a problem in lower/wetter areas, and those areas just seem to fill themselves back in eventually, or are not that big of a problem.

Give it a try, stacking a few dimes is a good thing what ever your doing, just me, but I would stay flexible till I knew how well it would take off.

 

[redprospector]

I'm not even sure what the definition of low impact is. I consider some skyline thinnings to be low impact, when compared to carving trails in steep ground for a cat.

I guess it is up to the landowner to figure out their definition. Do they just care how it will look when done? Do they want future entries?

My friends also got their road system improved.

I think you're right. The land owner has to figure out their own definition of "low impact".
A lot of the jobs I do, the land owner's want it to look like a city park with stumps when I leave. Others just want the job done without tearing up leave trees, and too many ruts. It's hard to tell the difference between the two after 2 or 3 years. I guess it all depends on how much money they have.

Andy

 

[sawnazi]

Right now i am charging a bid job of 2 guys at 40/hour per person and i give the land owner .2 cents per bf for the usable market timber that we harvest off the property. The tops are chipped back onto the floor to turn into mulch so there are no brush piles left in the woods. some of the land owners have the tops chipped on to a pile too make walking trails.

 

[joesawer]

Right now i am charging a bid job of 2 guys at 40/hour per person and i give the land owner .2 cents per bf for the usable market timber that we harvest off the property. The tops are chipped back onto the floor to turn into mulch so there are no brush piles left in the woods. some of the land owners have the tops chipped on to a pile too make walking trails.

How much are you getting per hour for your 4 wheeler?
For their logging capacity 4 wheelers are very expensive. Both initially and parts. And logging will wear and break parts fast!

 

[sawnazi]

Its not really that tough on the equipment the logs most of the time are suspended and we do have surge brakes on the arches for going down hills we donot have that steep of slopes around here it is mostly flat with some little ridges the price of the wheelers are included in the price of persons. Ive been doing this for about a year now part time with my buddies and my wheelers which are honda 350's and friends wheeler which is a suzuki 300 still run great and have plenty of power to move logs 30" in diamiter and 10' long. for the long sticks we use two arches.

 

[D&B Mack]

I do low impact as well here in PA. There is a niche for it, but I don't think it is going to die out, especially with the "being green" surge coming. (As a note, a group of us do this on the side, not full time) Most of what we do is winched from an open access point, occasionally we will pull through the woods with a small tractor. However, for us on the side it is profitable, but I don't think we could do it full time for a profit.

 

[2dogs]

I work for a horse logging outfit here and I can say that horses "can" be lower impact than some mechanised logging but not always. Anytime you are skidding logs there is impact. Lifting one end of the logs off the ground with an arch still means you are dragging them through the woods. Using a balancing arch or two arches so the log is completely off the ground greatly reduces the impact. Just because you are using a quad doesn't mean much, you have to make more trips than larger machinery. If the width of your machinery is a factor in the job only the will you have a real advantage.

Horses and quads a very slow and this can only be appreciated after the job is through. If I were you I would take only very small jobs until you learn how fast you will be working. Also when anything breaks you are out of business until it is fixed. Good luck.

 

[John Ellison]

There is a lot of good points here. Low impact might mean different things to different people. Discuss everything you will and will not do with the landowner before hand.

It matters not what is used to log it if a poor felling job is done. A helicopter would'nt make it look good.

 

[joesawer]

Its not really that tough on the equipment the logs most of the time are suspended and we do have surge brakes on the arches for going down hills we donot have that steep of slopes around here it is mostly flat with some little ridges the price of the wheelers are included in the price of persons. Ive been doing this for about a year now part time with my buddies and my wheelers which are honda 350's and friends wheeler which is a suzuki 300 still run great and have plenty of power to move logs 30" in diamiter and 10' long. for the long sticks we use two arches.

I don't care how you slice it- The $ per ton moved ratio is not very favorable. What you are doing sounds more like a clean up/yard service than logging.

 

[Gypo Logger]

Low impact logging pays, only under special circumstances. That is how close you are to the timber and how close you are to the market, and what you're getting for the product.
I'm salvaging standing dead with an ATV and trailer. The landing is 5 minutes from where I live and delivering firewood blocks @ 200/crd. This takes 4-6 hrs per cord. I can live doing this full time as I am. The wood sporaticly exits on the lower benches of Spruce mountain and my furthest customer is 10 miles away and I may have the whole town as they like my wood product and how I produce it.

My production costs are 7$/crd if I don't include the cost of the truck, ATV and saws, but I had all these required recreation items already.

I'm not getting rich, but it beats working 7am- 5pm in a job you hate for the same money.

Could I make more if I went bigger? Probably, but it's better to stay small and keep it all. You can't put a price on freedom.

John

 

[dancan]

Low impact logging pays, only under special circumstances....

They like my wood product and how I produce it....

I'm not getting rich, but it beats working 7am- 5pm in a job you hate for the same money....

Could I make more if I went bigger? Probably, but it's better to stay small and keep it all....

You can't put a price on freedom...

John

Those are some proud words to live by .
Well said John .

 

[Gypo Logger]

Those are some proud words to live by .
Well said John .

Thanks Duncan, would I have driven myself for myself as hard as I'm willing to drive myself for others, I might have gotten ahead.
It's a rush out here and a gold rush for some, but I still think the trees are green gold. I so love trees, especially when their still on the stump. When they grew those, they grew alot of them.
Gypo

 

[ithica]

Check this out

http://www.tremzac.com

 

[dozerman37]

low impact

ive done some low impact logging, its really a great thing to save all of the little saplings that will grow big one day and make it down the road. but when im working full time with our timberjack and caterpillar cable skidders, lots gets squished and unsaved but we have bills to pay and mouths to feed. two thumbs up for sustainable forestry.

 

[Gypo Logger]

ive done some low impact logging, its really a great thing to save all of the little saplings that will grow big one day and make it down the road. but when im working full time with our timberjack and caterpillar cable skidders, lots gets squished and unsaved but we have bills to pay and mouths to feed. two thumbs up for sustainable forestry.

The good side to ground disturbance with the bigger equipment is that the scarification is good seedlings and other understory species.
Soil compaction around roots of residual trees is not so good though.
John

 

[PB]

There is a low-impact logging workshop every year at the MOFGA fair grounds in Maine. Good food, people and lots of information. Look past all the hippie stuff and there are a lot of do-it yourself types that go there. Last year they had demonstrations with horses, farm tractor logging, Jonsered Iron Horse, and several others. This low-impact logging idea is taking off big here in Maine for small land owners.

http://www.mofga.org/Default.aspx?tabid=297

Here is some more info:

http://www.swoam.org/