Milling and woodworking forum???

[BobL]

I had an offer of a free scroll saw (from a guy who bought one and used it for a few weeks and the moved on to some other hobby) but there is unfortunately no where I can squeeze it into my shed. A couple of weeks back I managed to shoehorn a metal working lathe onto the drive way and covered it up with a sheet of plastic but SWMBO found it and I got the dagger looks again!

Yeah I guess scroll saw work needs a scroll saw, just like pen makers and turners need a lathe of some kind so different folks will need different machines but what I see is nearly all of them can make a lot of use of a bandsaw.

. . . . .Here's a few pics of the stuff I do and a link to my website if you want to see my CSM

Not really my kind of thing but I can still see the effort and craftsmanship in your work there TJB! and BTW welcome aboard the milling fun house

I checked out your cool website and I really like your CS carriage mill - I can see lots of craftsmanship there to. Unfortunately I don't have room for a carriage mill at my place but I can see some ideas in your set up that may even be useful on an alaskan mill.

I also saw on your website that you found 0.035" raker depths helped you cut faster. If you learn about progressive raker depths you'll find that fixed raker depths ) whether they're 0.025" or 0.030" or 0.035) are not the most efficient method for cutting thru the whole life of the chain. The most efficient raker depth will change constantly and substantially during the life of the chain. When the chain is new a raker depth of 0.025" will work fine but as the cutter wears, the depth needs to be increased even more, some of my chains are now running rakers of 0.045". What should not change is the cutting angle (not the same as top plate filing angle)

This can be achieved to some extent by using a Carlton File-O-Plate (FOP). There is a geeky discussion about the effectiveness of FOPs and "Cutting angle" in the chainsaw forum sticky http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=114624

 

[BobL]

I don't feel so bad about using my $50 yard-sale tablesaw as a workbench anymore!

Thing are so crowded in my shop I've started using the outdoor eating area table. It seats 12 people and makes a great CSM service bench. I have convinced SWMBO that bar oil will be a good preservative for it!

If I had to make a choice between a radial arm saw or a tablesaw, I'd take a good radial. I have a Craftsman professional radial (still sells for ~$1000 CDN new) that I got for $80 at a yard sale a couple years back, and it's a pretty nice tool. I had to put $50 into parts for it, but it was still a steal.

This one cost me $0!

Unfortunately I have to keep this at the milling yard because its so big and its 3 phase.
Its a very good machine though.

 

[Cannon51]

The last few years all the solid wood I have used in woodworking have come from rough sawn air dried lumber from the local band sawmill. The last project I did I used 4-3x6x10" pieces of poplar. I don't think you should start at the bandsaw or table saw but at the jointer, either hand or power. Any time I have tried to saw without establishing one flat side I have had trouble. I like to establish 2 flat/square sides at the jointer, one on the saw table and one against the fence. I then saw the desired thickness and make another pass over the jointer and back to the saw. That way each board has one true surface to work off of at the planer.
Cannon

 

[Andrew96]

Well guys...many good points I agree with and could quote. Choosing your set of first tools is a personal thing. After the first item (below) I'd say a GOOD, Almost big band saw, jointer, planer, then fill in the rest, but that's just me.
However...I'd suggest my most important 'tool' in my shop...I would think it should be Everyone's first addition so we can live a long long time. Dust collection! I noticed no one mentioned that. I won't breathe all the crap I can cut. I capture at the source and have a very clean shop (a full time one man area). Step into this millennium, realize the health risks and start off right. Collect from the source from day one.
I'd also suggest making any of your purchases your last. Buy the best quality you can afford so you only buy it once, it's cheaper that way..and you get good stuff from day one. Crappy tools are...well...just crap.

 

[Sawyer Rob]

The last few years all the solid wood I have used in woodworking have come from rough sawn air dried lumber from the local band sawmill. The last project I did I used 4-3x6x10" pieces of poplar. I don't think you should start at the bandsaw or table saw but at the jointer, either hand or power. Any time I have tried to saw without establishing one flat side I have had trouble. I like to establish 2 flat/square sides at the jointer, one on the saw table and one against the fence. I then saw the desired thickness and make another pass over the jointer and back to the saw. That way each board has one true surface to work off of at the planer.
Cannon

I "kind of" agree, and that's why i listed a jointer as my second tool. But a good router can be used for a jointer, and it does a decent job at it, so the tablesaw beat it out for the first spot...

A "quality" table saw is just so useful! It will last your entire wood working life, getting you started, allowing you to build your shop while you learn woodworking.

This thread seems to be turning into "name your tools"......so for dust collection: I have two in my shop, a 3hp and a 4hp and i do consider dust collection important. But, there are dust mask that work pretty well for that, so DC wouldn't be in the first 3 big purchases for me... Perhaps a good dust mask would though...

I'd get a quality table saw, because it will do so many things well, and allow you to get started... There's an amazing amount of things a good table saw will do...

A jointer for all the reasons Cannon stated. It's an important tool, as it will get that piece of wood flat, with a good straight edge on it... Good quality projects start out with quality square cuts with a good surface.

And a Woodmaster planer, as it's a GREAT planer that will also sand and make moulding. Most importantly it will take that rough stock and quickly make it into some useful, either smooth and flat or if needed, just make it thinner. The knives are easy to access for sharpening too... Also, did i mention that it's American made?

Rob

 

[BobL]

However...I'd suggest my most important 'tool' in my shop...I would think it should be Everyone's first addition so we can live a long long time. Dust collection! I noticed no one mentioned that.

Try post #4.

 

[Andrew96]

Yup, missed that BobL. I'd like it higher on the list though it is sort of a given...even if it's a mask, or a system.

 

[Manuka Jock]

Plenty of goodies but unfortunately no time to use them

I used to post a lot on the Milling forum on the OZ WWF but the scene there seems now to be dominated by Swing millers and I apart from being envious about it have little to contribute in that area.

Yeah , swing-millers who operate a particular manufacturer's mills .
I attribute it to misplaced nationalism.

 

[BobL]

Yup, missed that BobL. I'd like it higher on the list though it is sort of a given...even if it's a mask, or a system.

Wow dust - my favorite subject.
I agree a dust handling system of some kind should be a given significant priority and ideally should come with any first power tool and increase in capacity as your shop grows.

Dust is a significant part of my day job where I'm in charge of a 4500 sq ft ultraclean laboratory/facility, used amongst other things to handle and analyse space dust, polar ice and snow and other environmental samples. I was on the team that designed and supervised the building of this facility starting some 10 years ago. The whole area is about 10 times cleaner than a normal hospital operating theatre and parts of it are 100 times cleaner. This is what part of it looks like.

Why am I telling you all this? What I'm trying to say here is I have a well developed "sense of dust" just like some people have a well developed sense of smell. When I look at a scene whether it's inside or outside I can visualize the possible dust involved. Paint and finishes constantly decay, fabrics and bare wooden surfaces, even stone and bricks constantly decay and make dust just sitting there. Then where there is human activity, like just walking or sitting there's dust just pouring off people (the USA airforce have measured that the human body alone makes around 100,000 bits of dust each hour), then we ratchet up a notch to internal combustion engines where the dust just pours out of them, and finally to very dusty activities like mining, agriculture and building.

The sort of dust I'm referring to is not just the stuff you can see but the stuff humans cannot see. This turns out to be very significant for wood workers and CS operators because the human eye cannot see the very fine dust that can harm our health. There is some benefit in not being able to see all dust because normal suburban air contains around 10 million particles of dust per cubic ft and if it was all visible we could not see more than a distance of several ft. We constantly breath this stuff in and fortunately again we breathe it out again. Dust direct from humans (mostly bits of skin) and most natural materials our bodies can cope with as we have been living with this stuff for millions of years. More modern domestic and industrial dust is something we have not thought about too much.

When I look a CS miller in action I can of course see the dust from the wood and if any, the blue smoke from the CS exhaust, but also visualise the invisible dust particles pouring out from it that others cannot see. The 2 stroke lubes of today make the exhaust look less smokey than old school lube but it's not actually that much less dusty, it's just turned more of the visible particles (ie smoke) into invisible particles. This is why I do not advocate the use of low ratio mixes because the operator is effectively constantly sitting in a cloud of invisible dust.

In a wood workshop the bare wood just sitting there is very slowly decomposing makes dust, Sawdust has a greater surface area than wood so it makes more dust again. Different activities in a shop make different ranges of dust. Hand tools tend to make bigger (less dangerous) dust whereas power tools make finer dust and machines make finer dust still. Blunt tools make more fine dust than shap. Different woods and materials make different ranges of dust. eg sanding MDF makes a lot of invisible particles.

Most shop dust collectors are not dust collectors at all they are sawdust collectors. They collect visible dust and continually recycle the invisible dust back into your shop effectively continually increasing the level of invisible dust inside your shop. The simplest solution to this is to put the dust collector outside the shop. Now I know this does not work for you guys in colder climates otherwise you lose your heated air in winter. In this case if you want to keep low levels of dust in your shed then a device like a cyclone with an industrial grade HEPA filter is about the only way to do it (see http://www.billpentz.com/woodworking/cyclone/index.cfm). While those (supposed HEPA) air filter units that hang from your ceiling are better than nothing, they simply do not have sufficient directed air flow to keep up with the rate of dust generation of any power tool. You can't see it but every time you fire up a power tool it creates a cloud of invisible dust that hangs in the air for many hours or even days so dust collectors wired direct to machines that go on and off accordingly are also not a good idea. As soon as I start a machine I start my DC and then leave it on for at least 20 minutes afterwards so that it empties the shed of invisible dust.

BTW I have lost my sense of smell twice, once for 6 weeks and another time for a few days, from using MDF and it was almost certainly the dust and chemicals in the MDF dust that did. All beer and most food tasted foul, it was horrible. Now when I handle MD I use a dust mask that supplies finely filtered air to a fully covered head shroud. Even with this filter for several days after using MDF I have this constant faint lingering smell of BBQ sauce in my nose.

 

[Andrew96]

I can only say Wow. You really get yourself into some interesting projects, thanks for sharing.

 

[gemniii]

Well I looked for a thread that discussed planers, and ran across this one.

I'm about to purchase/search for a small planer and as always want the best for the buck.

I don't presently have a lot of room in the shop or wallet so I'm looking for something portable in the sub 15" range, sub- $1000, 15amp or less.

I'm figuring after I retire I can get something larger so this wiil be a secondary one eventually.

Any recommendations?

 

[mtngun]

I've got the Rigid 13" planer from Home Depot. Price was right, and it does the job for a weekend warrior like me. I doubt if it would hold up to constant use, so if I ever have time to do lots of woodworking, an upgrade may be in order.

 

[Timberframed]

As far as planers go I favor this 1981 6" x 13" over my 1959 9" x 18" wedgebed for it gets used more often than the other. Triple belt drive 220 volts and just try and stop it for a machine in this class. 617 lbs so long boards 20' or < need not be supported.

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