Montgomery Ward chainsaw (TMC24060A - 88cc)

[cdahl383]

Picked up an old Montgomery Ward chainsaw today from the antique store. My daughter actually found it in a booth while she was looking at some dolls. It's a big old heavy thing. I couldn't find too much information on it online other than it appears to be a rebranded Remington saw, built in 1965, with a 88cc engine. The model number on the tag says TMC24060A.

Checked the vitals on it when I got it home. Compression is a little low. Only 100-110psi. Light scoring on the piston. Has spark. Fuel tank is dry and clean. Fuel lines look okay. Carb will definitely need a cleaning and rebuild. Air filter is there but will need to be cleaned. I don't plan on using this saw for serious cutting, so I may just try to get it running as is for now. I doubt I'll be able to find a piston for it anyway. Looking through the exhaust port the piston appears to have three rings on it. The chain is in good shape, it's sharp with lots of meat left on it. The bar seems kind of short for the size of the saw. Appears to be a 16-18" bar. It's a manual oiler.

I cleaned it up really good and got it looking much better than when I first picked it up. One thing I noticed was it's a pain to get the spark plug out with the way the rear handle is designed. Not the best design in my opinion. But it's a cool 60 year old saw, it'll look nice in the garage with all of my other saws!

Here's some photos...

 

[cbfarmall]

Parts won't be terrible to find. Look for Remington 754 stuff. Won't be able to match the color that way but you can get an old saw running.

 

[cdahl383]

Well I looked at the piston a little closer today and it's scored up a little more than I thought. I don't think I want to run it with that piston in there looking like that. Can't seem to find any pistons anywhere for a 754.

It appears Remington used the same cylinder/bore for a lot of saws at 2.06" or 52mm. I found a couple used cylinder/pistons/connecting rods on Ebay for Super 65 and Bantams that appear like they would fit. I'd have to strip the saw down all the way pretty much, but it looks like I would have the parts at least.

I'd have to get new crank seals, new bearings, gaskets, etc. as well. Not sure I want to go through all that, but if I don't it'll just be a shelf piece. Guess I'll think about it over the winter since I have some other saws I'm still going through. Would be cool to get this one running again though.

 

[cbfarmall]

You say your saw has a 3 ring piston? A 754 only had 2 and is 88cc. Earlier 82cc Remingtons used 3 rings. Fortunately, both bores are 2 1/16". The extra displacement came from from a longer stroke which means the cylinders and crank are different. Piston likely will swap over after careful comparison of skirt length, pin diameter and pin height. What I am not sure of is if the 754 piston is a flat top vs domed like that S65 piston on ebay. Look on the bottom of saw cylinder for a 5 digit part number. Maybe you'll see 60887 or 63584.

Still, you said it: your smartest bet is to tear the saw down to measure and compare. Crank seals are easy, some gaskets can be found, make the rest, crankcase is sealed with orings. The biggest problem to me is the godforsaken Carter carburetor.

Chris B.

 

[cbfarmall]

Keep an out at auctions for 754 parts saws. Remington made a lot of those, the last of the Bantam style saws.

 

[cdahl383]

You say your saw has a 3 ring piston? A 754 only had 2 and is 88cc. Earlier 82cc Remingtons used 3 rings. Fortunately, both bores are 2 1/16". The extra displacement came from from a longer stroke which means the cylinders and crank are different. Piston likely will swap over after careful comparison of skirt length, pin diameter and pin height. What I am not sure of is if the 754 piston is a flat top vs domed like that S65 piston on ebay. Look on the bottom of saw cylinder for a 5 digit part number. Maybe you'll see 60887 or 63584.

Still, you said it: your smartest bet is to tear the saw down to measure and compare. Crank seals are easy, some gaskets can be found, make the rest, crankcase is sealed with orings. The biggest problem to me is the godforsaken Carter carburetor.

Chris B.

Yes, it appears to have a three ring piston in it. The piston is domed as well, not a flat top. This is a Montgomery Ward saw though, so who knows what they swapped back and forth, maybe they used a piston from the 82cc saw when they built it? Or maybe it's been replaced by someone else in the past? Who knows at this point.

From what I read a lot of the 82cc and 88cc saws have the same 2.06" or 52mm piston. Like you said, they just used a longer stroke.

I'll see what the saw says on the bottom and let you know.

There was a 754 cylinder for sale on ebay but it was just the cylinder, no piston or anything else. Looks like it sold now. There are a couple other piston/cylinder combos up there now, just trying to see if the parts cross between models.

The piston is part number 63622 according to the parts diagram I found online for the Super 754 chainsaw. The cylinder part number is 63584. I'm assuming they used the same cylinder/piston in a lot of the saws, just the crank was different on the "super" models maybe?

My saw has a Tillotson carb on it. Those are easy to find parts for and rebuild. I've rebuilt several of those now with all the other vintage saws I've gone through.

 

[cbfarmall]

See if that part number is on the bottom of your saw. It is in a circle on a raised square if memory serves.

 

[cbfarmall]

Also, the chainsaw website could be wrong on the displacement. Mike Acres site has more than it's share of inaccuracies.

 

[cdahl383]

Ok I went out to the garage and looked at the saw again. Looks like the bottom of the crankcase says 35254. That differs from the Super 754 cylinder part number. But it appears to be the same as the Bantam cylinder. From what I've gathered they are the same bore. I would think I could swap in a cylinder from either a 754 or a Bantam and it would fit.

 

[cbfarmall]

So, it's 82cc then with that part#. That 65 cylinder and piston you saw will all swap in. Color won't match. If you try to use a 754 cylinder you will also need the crankshaft and rod.

 

[cdahl383]

Looking at the Remington Bantam, I think this Montgomery Ward saw might be modeled after that saw not the Super 754. The Bantam has no rear loop on the handle and it shares the same cylinder part number. It's hard to say what the stroke is though without tearing into it obviously. But for my purposes, that really doesn't matter. I just need a new piston and possibly cylinder. My current cylinder might be okay, hard to say until I tear it apart. But I know I for sure need a piston/rings.

I'm guessing if the cylinder is still alright, I could just use the rod/piston assembly from the Ebay parts cylinder/piston so I don't have to screw around with breaking circlips and stuff. Otherwise I could just use the other cylinder if it's fine. But it looks like I should be looking for Bantam parts to match up to this saw rather than Super 754.

 

[cdahl383]

So, it's 82cc then with that part#. That 65 cylinder and piston you saw will all swap in. Color won't match. If you try to use a 754 cylinder you will also need the crankshaft and rod.

That's what I'm thinking too. Might "only" be the 82cc version haha!

I think I'll look at that Bantam piston/cylinder up on Ebay right now and maybe grab that for now. Who knows if I'll find another one anytime soon if I pass on this one.

I'm not too concerned about the color matching part. If I really wanted to I could go to Painters Supply near me and have them match up some paint to the color of the rest of the saw. They have a camera that can take a close up picture of a section of painted metal and then match it up perfectly. It's kind of expensive though. Not much of it is really exposed, only the underside and the clutch side of the cylinder. I could just get some silver high temp engine paint to paint the cylinder/crankcase up and call it a day. That would only cost about $10.

It's possible though the current cylinder is usable. I'll have to see how bad it looks first. I know some guys have had luck cleaning them up with light sandpaper. I believe these were chrome plated cylinders? If I could get rid of the transfer from the piston I might be able to just reuse that cylinder.

I guess for now I'll just accumulate some parts and then when it warms up I'll tear into it. I still have to finish up my Pioneer 620 that I tore apart. It's getting below zero here for a few days so I won't be going out to the garage until it warms back up again. I have an electric heater out there but when it gets that cold it can't warm it up that good.

 

[cbfarmall]

Don't read too much into how a saw is configured by Remington. I have nearly every Bantam series saw and there is no rhyme or reason to how Remington built and marketed them. It's too easy to swap parts.

I ran out to look and everyone of my 82cc saws have 35254 unmistakably cast in like yours. My assumed 88cc saws (754, 770D x2, 770G) don't have anything cast but instead have what might be 63584 stamped. It's hard to read because it's so light.

 

[cbfarmall]

That slit exhaust on your saw isn't on any Remington I've ever seen. Either that's a Wards modification or someone slapped it on there.

 

[cdahl383]

Don't read too much into how a saw is configured by Remington. I have nearly every Bantam series saw and there is no rhyme or reason to how Remington built and marketed them. It's too easy to swap parts.

I ran out to look and everyone of my 82cc saws have 35254 unmistakably cast in like yours. My assumed 88cc saws (754, 770D x2, 770G) don't have anything cast but instead have what might be 63584 stamped. It's hard to read because it's so light.

Ok cool. Just wanted to make sure I get the right parts. This is already turning into more of a project than I originally anticipated haha! Now I'll be tearing this thing down all the way.

According to the parts diagram I found online for the Super 754 the cylinder part number is 63584, so that makes sense with what you said above.

 

[cdahl383]

That slit exhaust on your saw isn't on any Remington I've ever seen. Either that's a Wards modification or someone slapped it on there.

Yeah it's a weird looking cover. Could be homemade I guess. I'll have to see if I can find another Wards saw like mine online and see if there are any pics of the underside. I think that saw will be pretty loud though if I ever get it running haha!

 

[cdahl383]

Looked online and found another saw like mine. Looks like it has some sort of muffler attached to the bottom.

 

[cbfarmall]

Like this

https://www.ebay.com/itm/3050400836...3VGR0obRKC&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

 

[cbfarmall]

Sorry. This is complete.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1662108773...3VGR0obRKC&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

 

[cdahl383]

Cool thanks! I added that to my watchlist. Might pick that up as well.

I just bought that Bantam piston/cylinder on Ebay. The piston looked pretty good and it was a three ring piston with a domed top like the one I have currently. I know I'm taking a chance buying used stuff but there are no NOS parts out there that I could find. It has to be better than the piston I have currently which is scored up.

I'm going to just swap the rod/piston assembly into whatever cylinder I decide is best. Not going to try and remove old rod and put the new piston on the old rod. I'm sure the little circlips will break in the process. I will try to get new bottom end rod bearings though while it's apart. I should probably do new crank bearings and seals too. I hope those o-rings are okay. Otherwise I guess I need new o-rings too.

I guess this will be a good project for me to learn on. I haven't torn one down this much yet.