MS180 Aftermarket Cylinder Issues

[Aggie 2012]

Hello Arborist community,

This is my first post so please bare with me.
I was given a chainsaw that had been run with straight gas (MS 180). I know this is just a homeowners saw and not worth the trouble.....but none the less I decided I needed another weekend project to waste money and time on.

I purchased a new cylinder, piston, and rings online (NWP). This is my first purchase of aftermarket main components (I've bought plenty of carb kits, fuel lines, and other small parts) so I wasn't quite sure what to expect.
Problem is that this cylinder has none of the holes tapped out for the T-27 torx screws. I did not even have guide holes drilled in place of where the bolts should be.
Is this normal?
I ended up tapping these out which wasn't that big of a deal being that the material makeup of the cylinder is pretty soft but was somewhat time consuming.

After I had the saw back together for the most part I then noticed that the ignition coil would not allow the magnetic section of the fly wheel to pass. (Not enough play in the 2 slotted screw holes of the coil that hold it in place on the cylinder)
So I guess I will have to grind this section of the coil down some to allow for the fly wheel to turn?
Just curious to see if anyone else has had fit up issues due to aftermarket cylinders......or maybe it is something that I have done wrong?

Once again, I will continue to keep in mind that this is a homeowners saw that 99% of normal people would have just junked for parts. Maybe this is part of the reason why the manufacture may have decided to cut some corners on this cylinder?

(P.S. Looking forward to having my MS461 sent to Randy next month for a little work)

 

[Mustang71]

I would have fixed it. I fixed a poulan worth 50$ in working condition just because I could.

I recently bought a hyway cylinder kit it was good quality but had some issues also. Muffler bolts didn't fit so well must have had some issue when casting it. The bolts holding the case together stripped out by hand and the stihl ones grabbed and worked. I'm not sure if the companies have the original molds to make cylinders so they get really close.

 

[Aggie 2012]

Thanks for your input Mustang. Glad to hear I'm not the only one that enjoys spending money to make more work for myself.

Is your 290 making good compression with you Hyway rebuild? Dad has Stihl 026 that's seized up so I may be shopping for another cylinder/Piston for that saw depending on how it looks once I get it apart. I'd like to think I could just clean up the cylinder with Muriatic acid but will have to do some more research on that process.

Wife thinks Im crazy since I now have a fleet of 6 saws and counting (Can't hardly blame her)
What's more is that I dont even have a fireplace to burn wood................

 

[brandonstc6]

I had a MS170 once, the compression was 125 psi so I replaced the piston and rings with oem stihl. The compression went up to 150. I put a new carburetor on it, it was idling too fast and I couldn't adjust it (non adjustable carburetor). I ended up selling it to a guy and he messaged me less than a day after getting it. He said all he had to do was replace the crank seals. After running a shindaiwa 360 I decided it was better than the ms170. I really despise ms170s but special props to you for fixing it. You should be proud of it after fixing it. Good luck


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[brandonstc6]

I would have sent the cylinder back for an exchange. It sounds like they made some errors manufacturing it.


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[Mustang71]

I didn't do a compression test on it after. I've only run it once since the rebuild and that was to tune it but it's definitely got a good amount of compression and you can bury the 20 inch bar in oak now and it pulls right through. Also did a muffler mod on it.

I'd say the 026 is worth the rebuild I believe it's a totally different animal with out the clamshell crank case.

I thought mine was dry gassed until I got it apart and only the cylinder and piston were bad I believe they ran it to hard on a dull chain I still changed the seals though.

I've got the 4 saws. An 046 or something similar is next on the list but the wife says I don't "need" any more saws.

 

[I'm stihl crazy]

Hi,, did a ms290 aftermarket cyl,, all went well besides noted the intake port was a little different.
Over all it ran good. I have heard of some things not being the greatest quality on aftermarket cyls,

I try to go good Oem used first now!!

 

[Mustang71]

If I get another one I want to try one of the cheap Chinese cylinder kits and see what the difference is.

 

[Aggie 2012]

Thanks for all of your replies. Looks like a used OEM cylinder wouldn't be a bad route if a person was trying to save some money.
Correct me if I am wrong but unless a 2 stroke was run with straight gas, the cylinder should go much longer than pistons and rings when looking at wear/longevity???



I've got this 180 back together but she bogs down when I throttle hard. If I go easy I can slowly work the RPM's on the high side to where they should be but as soon as the chain hits wood it loses complete power and basically dies out.

I also pressure and vacuum tested to make sure the crank seals were not leaking. (I have replaced fuel line, filter, intake boot which has a built in impulse line, and rebuilt this none adjustable carb)
I believe the tank vent is working correctly but I am not certain on how to check this other than turning the saw on its side and cracking the fuel cap, (Same throttle issue persists)
Compression is not great, around #125 ish according to my gauge (First time posting photo so tell me if you cant see it)

I did have to take a bench grinder to the magnetic section of my coil to allow for the flywheel to pass. (Coil sits much closer on this aftermarket cylinder). I feel like its set correctly after the modification because its about the width of a business card.
Maybe this mod is what's messing up the saw on the high side?

Your thoughts/criticism is much appreciated.

 

[I'm stihl crazy]

Thanks for all of your replies. Looks like a used OEM cylinder wouldn't be a bad route if a person was trying to save some money.
Correct me if I am wrong but unless a 2 stroke was run with straight gas, the cylinder should go much longer than pistons and rings when looking at wear/longevity???



I've got this 180 back together but she bogs down when I throttle hard. If I go easy I can slowly work the RPM's on the high side to where they should be but as soon as the chain hits wood it loses complete power and basically dies out.

I also pressure and vacuum tested to make sure the crank seals were not leaking. (I have replaced fuel line, filter, intake boot which has a built in impulse line, and rebuilt this none adjustable carb)
I believe the tank vent is working correctly but I am not certain on how to check this other than turning the saw on its side and cracking the fuel cap, (Same throttle issue persists)
Compression is not great, around #125 ish according to my gauge (First time posting photo so tell me if you cant see it)
View attachment 563852
I did have to take a bench grinder to the magnetic section of my coil to allow for the flywheel to pass. (Coil sits much closer on this aftermarket cylinder). I feel like its set correctly after the modification because its about the width of a business card.
Maybe this mod is what's messing up the saw on the high side?

Your thoughts/criticism is much appreciated.

Yeah should be around .008 on Clarence if it's putting the coil in a different position that may affect the timing but may not be noticeable .
In theory the cylinders should last a lot longer than the Pistons with the coatings they have usually just a good scotch bright scratching on the cylinder walls will do a good on a good OEM you cylinder unless it had a massive failure

 

[Aggie 2012]

I didnt think about the coil really being in a different position. Hopefully that is not the case. If it is I will have to try to find a used coil somewhere and put this new piston/ring combo in the old cylinder (if it is not too scared up) and see if that solves my problem.
I certainly have better things to spend my money and time on but getting this saw running would help clear my mind (and work bench)

I may try the scotch bright cleanup that you've suggested unless my OEM cylinder is too far gone.
Im going to try to take a picture tomorrow morning and post it on here to if yall might think it's salvageable.

 

[I'm stihl crazy]

I didnt think about the coil really being in a different position. Hopefully that is not the case. If it is I will have to try to find a used coil somewhere and put this new piston/ring combo in the old cylinder (if it is not too scared up) and see if that solves my problem.
I certainly have better things to spend my money and time on but getting this saw running would help clear my mind (and work bench)

I may try the scotch bright cleanup that you've suggested unless my OEM cylinder is too far gone.
Im going to try to take a picture tomorrow morning and post it on here to if yall might think it's salvageable.

Sounds great!! Like to see some pics of it

 

[I'm stihl crazy]

I didnt think about the coil really being in a different position. Hopefully that is not the case. If it is I will have to try to find a used coil somewhere and put this new piston/ring combo in the old cylinder (if it is not too scared up) and see if that solves my problem.
I certainly have better things to spend my money and time on but getting this saw running would help clear my mind (and work bench)

I may try the scotch bright cleanup that you've suggested unless my OEM cylinder is too far gone.
Im going to try to take a picture tomorrow morning and post it on here to if yall might think it's salvageable.

I have saved quite a few cylinder that have had aluminum transfer to the nicasil wall


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[Aggie 2012]

Okay, I wasn't able to get great pics of the oem cylinder but it certainly has some scaring near the exhaust port.

Do y'all think this is salvageable?



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[Aggie 2012]

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[Aggie 2012]

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[I'm stihl crazy]

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I believe that can be saved,, looks to be all transfer from piston.

Be a good one to try to practice to save,

Get a sand paper flapper similar to this

The coating is very very hard and will not be affecting it!!

Take your time an go by feel,, for no raised areas left.. it may take time to get there I'm 100% u can save it

I may get ridiculed for this by others,, but I'm no rookie on repairing.

I knw it's just a 180 but get into the bigger hard to get cylinder that are not aftermarket avail,, or even used for sale, time to try if not gouged past the coating

If u want send it to me and I will do it for u??

I have saved lots of cylinders!!!!


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[Aggie 2012]

Your the man! I appreciate the advice.
I may take a wack at it using your wheel method and see how how I fair.
I'll take some pics after I'm done.
Thank you for offering to fix it for me.
Would this wheel work best on the end of a die grinder I assume?




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[I'm stihl crazy]

Your the man! I appreciate the advice.
I may take a wack at it using your wheel method and see how how I fair.
I'll take some pics after I'm done.
Thank you for offering to fix it for me.
Would this wheel work best on the end of a die grinder I assume?




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Yes a die grinder

I believe 120 grit aluminum oxide,

When finished take some fine 400 Emory by hand,, and go over the whole cyl to de glaze and wash hot soap and water,, wipe clean of all dirt inside,,

The best way to test before getting it together is take new piston with rings and slide it in and push in by hand slowly!!!! Feel for any catching, if none your ready to rock

 

[LoveStihlQuality]

Hello Arborist community,

This is my first post so please bare with me.
I was given a chainsaw that had been run with straight gas (MS 180). I know this is just a homeowners saw and not worth the trouble.....but none the less I decided I needed another weekend project to waste money and time on.

I purchased a new cylinder, piston, and rings online (NWP). This is my first purchase of aftermarket main components (I've bought plenty of carb kits, fuel lines, and other small parts) so I wasn't quite sure what to expect.
Problem is that this cylinder has none of the holes tapped out for the T-27 torx screws. I did not even have guide holes drilled in place of where the bolts should be.
Is this normal?
I ended up tapping these out which wasn't that big of a deal being that the material makeup of the cylinder is pretty soft but was somewhat time consuming.

After I had the saw back together for the most part I then noticed that the ignition coil would not allow the magnetic section of the fly wheel to pass. (Not enough play in the 2 slotted screw holes of the coil that hold it in place on the cylinder)
So I guess I will have to grind this section of the coil down some to allow for the fly wheel to turn?
Just curious to see if anyone else has had fit up issues due to aftermarket cylinders......or maybe it is something that I have done wrong?

Once again, I will continue to keep in mind that this is a homeowners saw that 99% of normal people would have just junked for parts. Maybe this is part of the reason why the manufacture may have decided to cut some corners on this cylinder?

(P.S. Looking forward to having my MS461 sent to Randy next month for a little work)

NWP are decent am. Would not expect to have to drill out holes??

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