My First Decent Sized Tree

[Lumberjack]

I finished cleaning up my first decent sized tree today. It measures 59" at DBH. Kinda makes me feel good. Let me see if I can add a pic.

P.S. It might be huge. I nocked off the tip of my index finger and it sucks to write, cut a steak, or click a mouse, much less type. Oh and what is the best way to resize?

 

[rborist1]

:Eye:

 

[Lumberjack]

The top of the bar in a chainsaw got pinched slightly and I opened it up with a screwdriver, but the metal was mighy stiff and the screwdriver slipped, knocking off the tip of my finger, the pad part (skin and a little meat).

 

[Lumberjack]

Originally posted by RockyJSquirrel
I'm not trying to pick, just attempting some constructive criticism. I've been told repeatedly that I come across as abrasive and insulting so deal with it. It ain't you.

1- DBH means Diameter at Breast Height. This will be about 4' off the ground (even with your nipples when standing next to the tree). From your picture it looks like your stump cut was about 59" but DBH appears to be less than 36". Still a decent size tree but it isn't 59" DBH.

2- No hinge wood, you cut through it when cutting your notch. Simply cutting out a V shaped chunk will not steer the tree. The hinge is created by the wood you DON'T cut. By cutting through your hinge wood, you were basically freefalling the tree and it went in the direction gravity pulled it. You had no control over the direction of fall.

Anyway.

1. I did measure the tree at my nipple height (DBH=4.5') It measured 4'11" of 59". I cut it under may anus (around there) and measured it and it was right at 4.5'

2. Look again, the wood is there for the hinge, it just snaped like a mis match cut b/c the wood was so dry. Also I cut the two leaders off and sent that piece over (it was only 10-12' long)

 

[rborist1]

:Eye:

 

[Gord]

resize

second resize

I can never figure out how people have the ability to post a pic but not to resize it.

It is a big tree, good for you to have the wherewithal to get it on the ground safely.

As the squirrel already pointed out never underestimate the importance of a proper undercut/backcut. Never cut your holding wood and always make sure you have a clean V - it appears you may have a wee dutchman in your undercut.

 

[Lumberjack]

Zoom in, it is a proper cut, the hinge snapped. If anything the hinge it to big, but I poped it over with a pry bar, it was sitting on the hinge before I sent it over. The wood in the center was to brittle to hinge. I did make a proper cut.

I figured out, I was just askin how to resize. I didn't like paint, so I used Microsoft Image Editor.


Carl

 

[NeTree]

Originally posted by Lumberjack
Zoom in, it is a proper cut, the hinge snapped. If anything the hinge it to big, but I poped it over with a pry bar, it was sitting on the hinge before I sent it over. The wood in the center was to brittle to hinge. I did make a proper cut.

I figured out, I was just askin how to resize. I didn't like paint, so I used Microsoft Image Editor.


Carl

Carl,

That's not a hinge in yer pic, but a snap-cut. There is a distinct and very important difference.

Anytime your backcut goes beyond your notch (and in your pic it does, by about 2"), you no longer have a proper notch, but a "snap-cut".

In a proper notch, the holding hinge wood fibers are working on tention, in a snap-cut, they are only holding by fiber shear adhesion, a weaker hold.

Not trying to break yer balls, but it's important.

 

[murphy4trees]

It looks to me like there is no hinge, though the stump is not completely visible. I've seen even world class climbers make bypass cuts and have hinges seize. Learning the mechanics of good hinging seems a lot more important than measuring the DBH accurately. When a bypass occurs on the facing cuts, as the tree begins to move slightly, the kerf of the bypass will close and cause the tree to stop moving... usually the only thing that will start it moving again is when the holding wood fails... At that point the hinge has no effect on the fall of the tree...
The below pic shows a good notch with no bypass... Good luck and stay safe...

 

[Lumberjack]

Agreed good notch.

I noted the cuts on this one. The top should say "End of back cut"

 

[NeTree]

Nice notch Murph, no toenail.

The backcut should be made level with the apex of the notch cut, and shouldn't bypass it.

 

[NeTree]

Did you at least have fun and learn a few things Carl?

 

[Lumberjack]

I admit I made a mistake. I looked back in other pics and it was a glorified snap cut. I wasn't concered with the direction (because of the length). The bottom cut of the notch extended past the diagnol one, thereby making it a snap cut. I do however undersnand hinges, and should have clarified that earlier and relized what had happened. I am always carful to cut the notch without getting to the hinge or leaving a kerf behind the notch, but I didn't check this time.

That being said I recant what I said earlier and agree that that was a snap cut, and I understand why. I want to emphasize that I do understand hinges and this was in no way a critical cut.


Carl

 

[Lumberjack]

Originally posted by netree
Nice notch Murph, no toenail.

The backcut should be made level with the apex of the notch cut, and shouldn't bypass it.

I thought (read know, but more politely as to not be an abbrasive @$$) that on a 45 degree notch the cut should be made approx. 2" above the apex to decrease the chance of the butt of the log kicking back over the stump and striking the feller.

 

[Lumberjack]

The veiw counter must be off this thread has been up for a little over an 1:30 and it has 1600+ views!?!


Carl

 

[NeTree]

Originally posted by Lumberjack
I thought (read know, but more politely as to not be an abbrasive @$$) that on a 45 degree notch the cut should be made approx. 2" above the apex to decrease the chance of the butt of the log kicking back over the stump and striking the feller.

That's common in books, but it's BS as far as I'm concered, and everybody I've ever worked for/with. It has no basis in reality.
Make your back-cut level with the bottom of your notch.

It makes it alot harder to bypass, since your cuts matching are more plainly apparant.

If the tree really wants to kick back, it will easily jump that 2" shelf anyhow, due to the nice little ramp you cut as part of your notch, assuming the butt isn't still 3 feet in the air from the jump.

And why would you be close enough to get hit, anyways? Once the tree is going, you don't need to be there. You should already be headed off on your retreat path, and well out of harms' way.

 

[NeTree]

on that note:

We get a little heavy with eachother in our critiques sometimes, but we all mean well for eachother.... even Rocky!

Like any family, there will always be feuds.

By all means, keep posting yer pics and asking yer questions.

 

[Dobber]

bad notch

I think the point everyone is trying to make is this as you can see by my attachment the Red shows where your notch should stop, the purple looks to me like you cut about 6 to 8 inches further into your notch (Dutched) and what is circled in blue is the wood that snapped when you cut it. this is not holding wood this is a snap cut that just happens to have a notch in front of it. hope you take this for what it is, not talking down to you would just rather not hear about you in the news killing or hurting yourself or someone else.

 

[Dobber]

better pic

sorry better pic here

 

[Gord]

That's common in books, but it's BS as far as I'm concered, and everybody I've ever worked for/with. It has no basis in reality.

I disagree here. In many (most) cases it's true that there is no need for the back cut to be above the undercut. However it's a practice that I adhere to as well as most fellows I have ever worked with because it can at times prevent serious oopsies.

Consider felling a large top on a single stem plumb tree. I often feel the top pushing the tree back opposite the direction of fall as the top begins to lean and then rebound back as the top is breaking off, pushing the top well ahead of the tree. It's very clear that there is some forward momentum imparted as the top often lands as much as 15' away from the tree. So it also follows that if the holding wood breaks earlier than expected or circumstances dictate that there is only a thin strip of holding wood the butt of the top could end up in your lap. Which is not something I want.

Another situation is felling trees that have the potential to get hung up in other trees. If a falling tree strikes a stationary one the shock/twist may be enough to break the holding wood while the tree is still relatively upright. Without a shelf to hold the butt in place it is much more likely to kick past the stump and do all sorts of wild and wonderful high speed maneuvers. It may not always be necessary, but I still always do it.