My next saw, Mastermind???

[ElevatorGuy]

Hey guys, I’m new here and looking for some insight. I’ve been talking with randy at mastermind about a new saw. I originally started looking at used ms440-ms461s. Looking for something strong enough for the occasional need for a 25” bar in hardwood, mostly oak and beech. A 20” will work 90% of the time. I currently have an echo 590 20” and an echo 303t 16”. Randy says 462 for 25” in hardwood but I also asked about a ms362 from him. I’m not sure which route to go and from what I’ve seen here much like my John Deere group you guys will have no issue helping me spend money.

I almost bought a husky 372 last year but didn’t like the answers from the seller on the saws history. I also wasn’t impressed with the speed cutting cookies off a 20” red oak round with the 24” bar on the 372.

Should I just buy a used pro saw or have mastermind build me a 362 or 462? I’m really wondering if I should fool with the 362 as the echo I already have is the same size but I know Randy’s will cut circles around my echo. I’m not really worried about the money but I’m interested in a used pro saw if I can get it for half the price. Thanks guys.

 

[Del_]

Never heard of the guy.

 

[svk]

I would port your 590 long before I would buy a 362 in any form. There are a few saw builders who have done crazy powerful builds of the Echo 590/600/620.

If you have the extra $$, 462 stock or ported would be a great saw. Skip the 362 IMO.

Also, if you watch the classifieds you can often find a like new ported saw from one of the reputable builders for a fraction of what a new ported saw would cost. Some guys have a ported saw done up then loose interest and sell it.

 

[ElevatorGuy]

I would port your 590 long before I would buy a 362 in any form. There are a few saw builders who have done crazy powerful builds of the Echo 590/600/620.

If you have the extra $$, 462 stock or ported would be a great saw. Skip the 362 IMO.

Also, if you watch the classifieds you can often find a like new ported saw from one of the reputable builders for a fraction of what a new ported saw would cost. Some guys have a ported saw done up then loose interest and sell it.

I’ve been checking the classifieds everyday since I joined this week. This site is also how I found mastermind and since I’ve watched tons of his videos. My tree guy (good buddy) offered me a ms880 that needed some work. That’s too much for what I needed so he’s the one that told me start looking in the 440-462 range.

 

[svk]

If you are buying any used saw, be sure to get as much background info as possible. And be absolutely sure to get a look at the piston through the exhaust port.

 

[svk]

I’ve been checking the classifieds everyday since I joined this week. This site is also how I found mastermind and since I’ve watched tons of his videos. My tree guy (good buddy) offered me a ms880 that needed some work. That’s too much for what I needed so he’s the one that told me start looking in the 440-462 range.

Put @chipper1 on the case to find you some gently used ported saws.

 

[ElevatorGuy]

If you are buying any used saw, be sure to get as much background info as possible. And be absolutely sure to get a look at the piston through the exhaust port.

Yes, absolutely. I found a guy that sells a bunch a few hours from me. I asked about doing compression tests and pulling the muffler. He seems fine with it but isn’t much cheaper than buying new. He’s asking 850 for a 461 25”, I know stihl holds value well but for another 300 or so I think I would just buy new unless he would take a lower offer.

 

[cuinrearview]

Shoot @Red97 a message about doing your 590 if you like the way it handles. Ask for videos. Joe has been doing some cool things with those Echos.

 

[svk]

Yes, absolutely. I found a guy that sells a bunch a few hours from me. I asked about doing compression tests and pulling the muffler. He seems fine with it but isn’t much cheaper than buying new. He’s asking 850 for a 461 25”, I know stihl holds value well but for another 300 or so I think I would just buy new unless he would take a lower offer.

That is a lot of $$. I would not buy used unless there is a decent discount to reflect that fact.

I guess it depends on the market but CLEAN used pro saws here run about 1/2 to 2/3 of the MSRP.

 

[ElevatorGuy]

Shoot @Red97 a message about doing your 590 if you like the way it handles. Ask for videos. Joe has been doing some cool things with those Echos.

I would be interested in that too, MM doesn’t do used saws.

That is a lot of $$. I would not buy used unless there is a decent discount to reflect that fact.

I guess it depends on the market but CLEAN used pro saws here run about 1/2 to 2/3 of the MSRP.

I’ve read that here and actually asked him about the pricing. Normally I would’ve done that cash in hand in person but he’s a good ways away. I didn’t throw any offer out but he said it’s very negotiable.

 

[cuinrearview]

I would be interested in that too, MM doesn’t do used saws.

d /QUOTE]Oh. Yah, forgot to mention Joe also built a freaking chainsaw dyno!

 

[svk]

I would be interested in that too, MM doesn’t do used saws.

Wouldn't hurt to talk to a few builders. Any builder still operating on the major saw forums has definitely been through trial by fire so the chance of you being "taken" by someone on here is pretty low.

 

[svk]

If you should happen to choose a builder other than one of the major guys ie Huskihl, red97, mastermind be sure to drop that name here before sending them your saw or your $$. If they have skeletons, you'll find out quickly.

Or if some guy messages you "hey man I'll build your saw" and he has very little data to back it up, beware.

Unfortunately there have been many fly by night builders over the years.

 

[ElevatorGuy]

If you should happen to choose a builder other than one of the major guys ie Huskihl, red97, mastermind be sure to drop that name here before sending them your saw or your $$. If they have skeletons, you'll find out quickly.

Or if some guy messages you "hey man I'll build your saw" and he has very little data to back it up, beware.

Unfortunately there have been many fly by night builders over the years.

I sent red a pm about building my 590. I still think I want another one though!

 

[chipper1]

If you should happen to choose a builder other than one of the major guys ie Huskihl, red97, mastermind be sure to drop that name here before sending them your saw or your $$. If they have skeletons, you'll find out quickly.

Or if some guy messages you "hey man I'll build your saw" and he has very little data to back it up, beware.

Unfortunately there have been many fly by night builders over the years.

Hey man, I'll build your saw .

 

[chipper1]

Why waste any time on a 362 when the 462 is right there in weight, although I do get the financial side of those decisions.
Also why have a 60cc saw ported in order to cut with a 20" 90% of the time.
Now if you want me to spend your money just buy a brand new 462 and have it ported.

 

[BonScott46]

If I was running a 20 inch 90% of the time I would port a 60cc, a little lighter and a little more compact than a 70cc. A 462 is nice and all but with all the talk about the weight I can't tell any difference between it and my 12mm 044. Full of fuel/oil a 361 is noticeably lighter and more compact IMO. I would wait for a ms400 if you are thinking about a 362, although I don't know when they will be released over there.

 

[ElevatorGuy]

Why waste any time on a 362 when the 462 is right there in weight, although I do get the financial side of those decisions.
Also why have a 60cc saw ported in order to cut with a 20" 90% of the time.
Now if you want me to spend your money just buy a brand new 462 and have it ported.

Seems to me a more powerful saw will speed up the 10 cords of firewood yearly. It’s just something I want and I’d throw purpose or usefulness on the one paying for it. A bunch of my friends told me I didn’t need my John Deere 1025r either but it’s sure made firewood among a bunch of other things a lot easier.

If I was running a 20 inch 90% of the time I would port a 60cc, a little lighter and a little more compact than a 70cc. A 462 is nice and all but with all the talk about the weight I can't tell any difference between it and my 12mm 044. Full of fuel/oil a 361 is noticeably lighter and more compact IMO. I would wait for a ms400 if you are thinking about a 362, although I don't know when they will be released over there.

I haven’t heard about the 400, I’ll look it up.
That’s a very expensive saw if they’re priced the same way here. Looks like the 462 would be $200 cheaper and be able to handle the 25” setup.

 

[Derf]

I see you live in Maryland. I’m guessing you are thinking about cutting hardwood in the 20” range. A 70cc saw can easily handle that, porting it isn’t even necessary. Now, if you want to get more use out of your 60cc Echo, I could see why you’d port that.

If you buy a new saw in the 70cc range, you should see how it cuts before deciding if you need to have it modified. Often you can do a muffler mod yourself for some gains as well, before going full tilt.

And although you’re eyeballing Stihl, I wouldn’t write off the Husqvarna options. A good used 372 or a new 572 are very good choices. If you buy a 372 from someone who has gone through it you might pay more, but you’ll know it’s solid. Just cuz one old ape doesn’t want to work on used saws shouldn’t discourage you from going that route.

 

[ElevatorGuy]

I see you live in Maryland. I’m guessing you are thinking about cutting hardwood in the 20” range. A 70cc saw can easily handle that, porting it isn’t even necessary. Now, if you want to get more use out of your 60cc Echo, I could see why you’d port that.

If you buy a new saw in the 70cc range, you should see how it cuts before deciding if you need to have it modified. Often you can do a muffler mod yourself for some gains as well, before going full tilt.

And although you’re eyeballing Stihl, I wouldn’t write off the Husqvarna options. A good used 372 or a new 572 are very good choices. If you buy a 372 from someone who has gone through it you might pay more, but you’ll know it’s solid. Just cuz one old ape doesn’t want to work on used saws shouldn’t discourage you from going that route.

Yes I am in md and some of my oaks are huge. I actually had my buddy that runs his own tree company drop the last huge white oak i wanted down. I was gonna process the whole tree, just have him drop it. The tree truck was one thick run up to about 35’ and split into 2 18”ish across main branches. He asked when it hit the ground if I had enough saw to cut the truck up and I told him I had my 20” echo. He said that’s a no, I’ll section the trunk for you lol. I’m going over his house this afternoon to get some insight from him.