Newbie's First Project- 365 special

[RyanTowry_81]

First off i would like to say thank you for everyone out there making this site the wealth of knowledge it is! I have been lurking on here for some time before just recently becoming a member. I wont tell my wife that this new found addiction is all your guys fault...lol

A little background.
I am a process engineer by trade, a grease monkey at heart and as a son of a life time diesel mechanic and fellow gear head i have been tearing apart anything with a motor trying to make it faster since i could walk. I have been cutting fire wood with small homeowner saws most of my youth but never tore into them much, just enough tuning to keep the saws getting firewood. I have currently been cutting fire wood with a husqvarna 445 which was fine for me when i lived up in alaska and the biggest trees i ever cut were birch in the 12-18" range. now that i live in northern California cutting black oaks, fir and cedars she seems a little anemic. only mod i have done to the 445 is a muffler mod and bought the special splined tool to be able to richen her up.

so i wanted a bigger saw, like we all do, and started researching and since i already have a husky and there is a couple good local husky dealers i decided to stick with them. My search had me drooling over a 372 but it was out of my price range new so i decided to put the grease monkey skills to work and started looking for a project saw.

While looking on ebay i found this 365 special and it sounded like it needed a carb rebuild and possibly a top end so i threw in a low bid and walked away assuming it would go alot higher only to finjd out later i had won.

So the story from the seller is it has 120psi comp on his gauge and it would only idle for 5-10 minutes till warm then die. if you gave it throttle it would die. here is what i received:

and yes he did ship it in a Stihl box, that was kinda funny.
here is the name plate:

I am assuming this tag means it is a 2001 model?
also had this sticker on it:

 

[RyanTowry_81]

so first thing i did after receiving it was pull the muffler and check the cylinder for scoring. the piston looked pefectly shiney and then i pushed on the ring with a brass punck and i could feel it still had some spring to it so that was a good sign. i threw the muffler back on and filled the bar oil and some fuel and it acted just as reported, started after a couple pulls and idled till warm then died, fired right back up and idled then died. Tried throttle and it bogged and died. So i pulled the top cover off and started to tinker. first thing i noticed is while it was running it was smoking pretty good and both L and H were set as far rich as the limiters would allow so i pulled the limiters off with some needle nose and set both to 1.25 turns out from closed. fired up and ran a little longer and now i could feather into the throttle to get her to rev up shortly then bogged out.
here is a picture with the limiters removed:

the slot for the adjuster screw is pretty small under those limiters so i took one of the plastic limiters and shoved it on the screw driver i was using and took it over to the belt sander and knocked down the OD a little. this worked well to hold the blade screw driver on the adjuster while the saw was running. here are some blurry pics to give you a better idea of what i am talking about:


i know this sounds trivial but it made tuning that much easier when the screw driver wont fall off the adjuster.

so back to diagnostics, next step after the air filter was off was to drain the gas back out and pull the fuel lines off the carb and blow them out and clean the fuel filter. the fuel filter was really dirty. put her all back together and now it idled alot longer. after playing with the low setting i got her idling indefinately on the shop floor. It was 10PM so not too much high adjust ment but i did a couple rips and got her to respond well and run decent on the top but further testing in wood will be required.

Seems to me the top end is fine. i did notice only one ring on the piston. I thought i had read only the non EPA and older 365's had one and the newer ones had 2 is that right? do the 2 ring pistons do better on compression? i did my own compression test but with an old gauge like i have with no schrader valve and a not perfect seal at the head i got her to 120 after about 10 pulls so i am guessing it is probably more in the 125-130 range. this does not seem too bad from what i have read so i think i will let her be until i can gather some parts and do a rebuild this winter.

one issue i noticed was some serious excessive oiling:

here is the shop floor after playing with the tuning, seems like alot.
then i noticed this:

nice big puddle under the saw, looks like i need to look into where it is leaking from. i did take some time and the oiler adjuster was all the way counter clockwise which i assume is full open, and with only a 20" bar i think that is a little excessive. i turned the adjuster all the way closed and backed it out 1-1/2 turns, but still need to see if that helps.

any good go by's for adjusting the oiler properly? this is my first saw with an adjustable oiler so this is new to me.

 

[zogger]

You got a good handle on things so far I think. Most likely the inside of the carb is a bit dirty, wouldn't hurt to clean it out. New fuel filter won't hurt, or lines, they are cheap. Oiler half way should be cool for a 20. sitting idling you'll get some oil I think. If the screw tab dealie is stripped for the oiler I don't think it will ever adjust correctly, but not sure on that.

Sometimes oil will leak out past the bar if the oiler hole is plugged and junk is preventing the bar from snugging up good.

 

[RyanTowry_81]

Thanks, I have a carb kit on order but it has not arrived yet. I took the top cap of the carb to look at it and it looked really clean already but i figure it cant hurt to throw a kit at it as they are cheap.I plan on ordering a air filter, fuel filter, a couple bolts that are missing as soon as payday comes also. i am also planning on pulling the muffle off and opening up the stock port for now and doing a full blown muffler mod on it soon.

I am really debating on a 24 or 28" bar as the 20 that is on there is pretty worn and i think this saw could benefit from a bigger bar. Right now i am running a 20" on my 445. Granted the 445 will bog out pretty easy with it buried but most of the wood i cut is fir, cedar and black oak, and the black oaks are usually not that big. the economically minded person in me is voting 24 but the bigger is better part of me wants the 28 for those bigger firs and cedars especially because this is my biggest saw.

before i saw how nice the piston looked I was planning on doing a big bore kit and trying my hand at porting it but i think that is put on hold now since it looks good. I think i am going to keep collecting info and parts and get to it this winter if work allows.

i have a lot of clean up to do but i am going to go out and cut some wood on Saturday morning so hopefully i will get to try her out.

any advice on a fair priced tach for tuning? i am not the best at by ear tuning and i think a tach could really help. i have a blue point digital tach that is optical i was thinking of trying on the flywheel side and see if it works but i would prefer to have an electronic one.

 

[RyanTowry_81]

another question for the masses. When i had the top cover off i noticed when i pulled the throttle all the way in the carb never reached full throttle, is there any way to adjust the throttle to get it to wide open throttle? i looked at my IPL but did not see an adjuster anywhere.

 

[Bluefish]

In to subscribe. Russ

 

[rattler362]

The 365 special has one ring.

 

[RyanTowry_81]

Yeah after all the reading i had heard some EPA regulated saws had 2 i just want sure if this saw would fall in that category.

also rattler thanks for your porting thread on the 365 i learned alot reading that about the timing and degree wheel. i need to get one of those before i try my hand at porting this girl.

 

[rattler362]

Yeah after all the reading i had heard some EPA regulated saws had 2 i just want sure if this saw would fall in that category.

also rattler thanks for your porting thread on the 365 i learned alot reading that about the timing and degree wheel. i need to get one of those before i try my hand at porting this girl.

Hi Ryan the 365 is one of my favorite saws and the first saw I ever ported I had a bunch of help learning how to read a degree wheel . When you start to port your saw if can help you in any way just let me know.

 

[RyanTowry_81]

Thanks, I will have to take you up on that when the time comes. Don't know yet when that will be though, just found out today I might be going to Las Vegas for a project for 6 weeks.

 

[bigG]

I just picked up a great running 365 special from the pawn shop for $150. It's a really strong running saw.

I've actually been finding myself taking that one out of the barn instead of the 346 when I go cutting.

I'm curious about that first number on the tag and whether or not that's the year it was made or not.
You will love it.

 

[Mastermind]

If it doesn't want to rev up.......it's likely not getting enough fuel.

Go ahead and find out way before you try to run it more.

 

[RyanTowry_81]

G,
That is about the same as i got this one for off Ebay, i figured that was a really good price seeing the new price of the 365xt, i bought it knowing i could practically rebuild the whole saw and still be under the new price, and easier to explain to the wife as a bunch of smaller purchases than one large one. haha

Master,.
That was the same thought process i had when it did not rev up, and proved to be the case after blowing out the fuel lines and fuel filter and now she runs great.
As far as running it more to tune the high speed i think i see what you are saying, dont run it lean and burn it up. I have always tried to set the High rich to start then keep leaning it out until i hear it rev up and clear up then turn it back a little rich. does that sound like a sound practice? i am no expert at 2 stroke tuning so it usually takes a couple tries to get it unloaded then i keep the screw driver in pocket when cutting wood and fine tune between cuts as needed.

 

[Mastermind]

Yeah......I think you've got it.

 

[marcy-m]

I just wanted to say thanks for posting this. Getting ready to look at my first carb, fuel lines, filter etc. I learned a lot by reading what you did. Congrats on your saw, too.


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[RyanTowry_81]

I just wanted to say thanks for posting this. Getting ready to look at my first carb, fuel lines, filter etc. I learned a lot by reading what you did. Congrats on your saw, too.


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Thanks but I am no expert. I did ALOT of reading on here to know what approach to take. Keep searching the site, there is lots of good info to be had. I think I have taken about 3 pages of notes so far on this saw alone.

Also I did order up a new air filter, fuel filter, and oil filter to throw on to make sure and start new.

I have also read that these saws can develop air leaks to make them run lean and if not careful the lean condition can burn up your top end.

Next step after the carb rebuild and filter changes is a new bar and chain hopefully and then I am contemplating porting the stock jug with a new piston and rings or splurging on a big bore kit, either aftermarket or a 361w kit. I think the financially responsible thing is just throw a piston and rings and port job on the stock top and down the road go big bore but being a guy I can't help but want to go for more power. Haha. Sounds like I am leaving for Las Vegas for work here shortly and then the saw will become my only tinkering outlet so it might get some good attention in the next couple months. Too bad their are no trees around there to try it out on.

 

[RyanTowry_81]

Anyone have any experience with the woodland pro bars? Baileys has a screaming deal on a 24" with chain I might throw on for 44.99 and wait till I can save up for a real nice 28" for later.

Also are the light weight 28" bars really that big of a difference? Looked like it was only really shaving about 3/4 of a pound.

 

[RyanTowry_81]

Also anyone have any experience with wolf creek saw shop or this big bore kit they offer on flea bay:
http://m.ebay.com/itm/171358615031?nav=SEARCH

 

[RyanTowry_81]

Well time to update.
I just ordered a 32" gb titanium bar from left coast with Oregon chain for 67.50. Only wanted a 28 but I could not pass up that deal.

Figured since it was such a big bar I should go ahead and get the big bore kit so I ordered up the class A kit weedeaterman had on sale for 85 bucks. Great guy to deal with.

Also bought a zama c3m-el8a carb for it to mod at the advice and knowledge of terry and poleman.

Now that my wallet is burning I figured I should get the saw running well stock for a good base line.

I rebuilt the stock walbro carb and put on a new impulse line and new fuel filter. The saw idled really well and runs at WOT great but as soon as I cut it leans out and dies fast even with light pressure. I tried cutting with the top of the bar and it ran strong and did not die so I think something is getting pinched by worn anti vibes like the fuel line or a wire for the ignition is getting pulled or something. I am going to investigate further and try to replace the fuel line too and see how that goes. I was going to do it last night but it seemed to hold pressure fine so I got lazy. I also have oil seals to install to try and see if that is why the gear oil is leaking. That will take back seat to getting her running right first though.

Edit:
Just for my cost tracking I think I will add cost to date here:
Saw purchase -175 after shipping
Carb kit- 6.99 after shipping
Fuel line, impulse line, fuel filter, oil filter and seals-10 after shipping
32" bar and chain - 78 after shipping
Big bore kit- 85 with free shipping!!
Zama carb- 31 after shipping

Total to date: 385.99

Starting to add up but still cheaper than a new stock 365, and way more fun to play with.

 

[RyanTowry_81]

Well I got it figured out. Looked between the body and the handle where the fuel line ran and it was bent in a S shape, pulled the excess fuel line into the body next to the carb, got her warmed up and in wood and no more stalling. Easy fix. The chain it came with is still disappointing, cutters are sharp but looks like the PO never adjusted the rakers, there is almost no depth to the cut. Hopefully I can throw the new bar and chain on soon and see how it does. I could not push on the saw hard enough to make it big though so with a little more fine tuning in the wood she will be a strong runner. Give me a good base line to start modding off of.