I think through every cut and and am very aware of kickback repercussions. Also have 50+ tanks through various pro saws so consider myself far and above the average homeowner in experience. I recently put a 20” power match bar and matching Oregon non-safety chain on my 620p and it just turned it into something different than when I ran safety chain, it’s just a new beast and I love it. But in the back of my mind is always kickbacks, how much more risky is it?
Non-safety chain, how much more dangerous?
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More, but not much more, IF you are mindful of using the tip. Keep the tip from doing risky cuts and you'll be fine.
Please put the exact chain that you are calling safety chain and the one you got recently and think it is more dangerous. Same 3/8 standard and same nose radius? Safety chain isn't a term the manufacturers use there is a test to achieve reduced kickback status. The shape of the depth gauge comes into play and Oregon exl and exj in 3/8 have a larger different shaped depth gauge than say the HIPA which is likely a copy of earlier designs.
If you were to get a different 60cc class saw that can run the small spline .325 7 tooth drive, I think you will find the chain choices even the ones without bumper drive links are "safer". The bumper drive links can be there to reduce vibration perhaps make "safer" but not score low enough on the kickback test to be "green".
If you were to get a different 60cc class saw that can run the small spline .325 7 tooth drive, I think you will find the chain choices even the ones without bumper drive links are "safer". The bumper drive links can be there to reduce vibration perhaps make "safer" but not score low enough on the kickback test to be "green".
Both can be dangerous and attention and caution should always be paid to it. However, One cuts great and the other not so much.
When I regrind dull teeth, I just 'adjust; the depth gages to 'non-safety and I remove the interim bumpers too.
Old (safety): 72V066G
New : 72EXL070
That is the vanguard chain with the kind of folded over depth gauge. I got a loop with my Dolmar 6100 and it still is in the orange tool pouch that also came with the saw. I have my doubts a lot of folks on here use it much. It is the chain choice Oregon uses in the letter coding system.
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I use the same chain but in Skip-Tooth (exj if I remember correctly). Just stay off the tip, unless you are doing things like bore cuts and know what you are doing. You'll be fine.
I don't see much performance difference between Stihl anti-kickback and regular chain. Other than bore cuts of course. Until the teeth are worn about 60% between new and the wear limit mark. Then I can grind the heck out of the rakers including profiling them and I still only get dust.
There's also not a huge difference in safety. The "safety" chain will still kick back. It probably kicks back slower and not as hard but that's not something I test.
There's also not a huge difference in safety. The "safety" chain will still kick back. It probably kicks back slower and not as hard but that's not something I test.
I accidentally bought the safety chain. It was more dangerous for me because it made me upset that I bought it. I went back to the saw shop and got my usual full skip chain and the saw cut nicely again, and all was well.
As far as danger??? Hold the saw correctly and pay attention.
As far as danger??? Hold the saw correctly and pay attention.
Consensus seems to be, keep on safely sawing and don't sweat it. Thanks all
I hate so-called safety chain. Worthless crap, imo…always has been.
Mipe
ArboristSite Lurker
It also depends on what you intend to cut with it. On my smal saws (dolmar 100 and electric Bosch), I intentionally put on such a "safety chain" as I cut mainly small limbs and kindling like wood pallets. Using non safety chain has a tendency to "grab" excessively, making it hard to control the saw sometimes. Especially when I occasionally use my bigger non safety chain saws (husky 60 or Stihl ms290) for small stuff like this. Using these bigger saws with non safety chain, cutting bigger branches or stems for firewood is not an issue at all, and I will not put on this lesser kickbach chain on these saws, as it there is no need, and good cutting performance in this larger wood is required.
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You are absolutely correct. I cut my firewood on my own woodlot so I tend to get all I can out of the branches as I have to deal with the brush after and less is better. I have a small Jotul cookstove in my kitchen so branches 1.5 inches to 3 inches by 12" long are perfect for that. These are hazardous to cut with a "Yellow" chain. Now I had the same opinion as most about "Safety Chains"......a brand new one came on a parts saw I bought and I tossed it in the metal pile with the rest of the junk. Then later trying to cut up branches with a 630 Super and regular chain I was going crazy trying to not get beaten to death by this grabby setup in small wood. Taking a break I got to thinking about the double bump chain I tossed......I went and dug it out of the recycling, threw it on the grinder and then installed it on a 521E.....this made cutting up small stuff a breeze. It has remained on that saw as they now both are my dedicated branch cutting equipment. If you don't have a real need cut small stuff I understand why guys hate them but I found a need that they actually fill very nicely. So......it boils down to "the right tool for the job" kinda thing.
Gratewhitehuntr
Wood and Steel. Yep.
this
Never thought I'd use bumper chain for anything but, there it is. OMG... no... not a nail... in a pallet!
Otherwise, think of semi-chisel as advanced safety chain
I'm on The Committee to Bring Back Natural Selection, or Accelerate Mechanized Darwinism.
Have you ever shot yourself in the face with rattlecan? Do you align the disc grinder so that the blade hits your face when it frags? Chop your own foot with the axe? Glue yourself TO things? Back your own cars into each other? Untied shoes on the escalator?
Do you own a skateboard, or drive a Prius in FL traffic? You're our kinda guy!
Very true, and I salvaged a bit of "bumper chain" to make a loop for a Milwaukee M12 Hatchet, which is a cool tool but grabby in cured dimensional lumber. The chain speed and tension are too low for conventional depth gauges to work properly. Soft wood I use the original chain.
Never thought I'd use bumper chain for anything but, there it is. OMG... no... not a nail... in a pallet!
Otherwise, think of semi-chisel as advanced safety chain
I'm on The Committee to Bring Back Natural Selection, or Accelerate Mechanized Darwinism.
Have you ever shot yourself in the face with rattlecan? Do you align the disc grinder so that the blade hits your face when it frags? Chop your own foot with the axe? Glue yourself TO things? Back your own cars into each other? Untied shoes on the escalator?
Do you own a skateboard, or drive a Prius in FL traffic? You're our kinda guy!
What do Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, and anti-kickback saw chains have in common? They don't exist.
The chain makers call them kickback-reducing, but I also think they are a pain. If you have to bore cut, they don't work as well.
1. Keep the chain sharp
2. Run the saw full throttle, it is less likely to stall and kick back
3. Don't stand in line with the bar
4. Watch the tip
5. Stiff-arm it if you can't watch the tip
6. Don't cut it if your spidey sense is tingling (if your gut says it's not safe)
The chain makers call them kickback-reducing, but I also think they are a pain. If you have to bore cut, they don't work as well.
1. Keep the chain sharp
2. Run the saw full throttle, it is less likely to stall and kick back
3. Don't stand in line with the bar
4. Watch the tip
5. Stiff-arm it if you can't watch the tip
6. Don't cut it if your spidey sense is tingling (if your gut says it's not safe)
hacskaroly
ArboristSite Member
I dislike calling the reduced-kickback chains "safety chains", it gives people the false sense of security that there are bumpers and padding around this chain and you won't get hurt using it. All chains will cut your leg off, even dull ones...it just may take a little longer.
Usually when people come in looking for chain and don't know the difference between the green and yellow chain (in the case of Stihl chain), I try to get a sense of how much experience the person has and guide them towards the appropriate chain, reduced-kickback for less experience and yellow chain for those who have experience and understand what kickback is.
I do get the occasional customer who comes in, buys a full-skip chain and then immediately files down all of the depth gauges...I tell them good luck and to make sure to wear chaps and a helmet!!
Usually when people come in looking for chain and don't know the difference between the green and yellow chain (in the case of Stihl chain), I try to get a sense of how much experience the person has and guide them towards the appropriate chain, reduced-kickback for less experience and yellow chain for those who have experience and understand what kickback is.
I do get the occasional customer who comes in, buys a full-skip chain and then immediately files down all of the depth gauges...I tell them good luck and to make sure to wear chaps and a helmet!!
As others said, keep the tip of the bar away from stuff, particularly the top half of the tip of the bar, and you should be OK. OTOH, if you DO hit the tip, so-called "safety chain" may not save you from a kickback in the face.
Although full-chisel "non-safety" (yellow) chain seems to cut faster for me in green wood, the green ("safety") chain seems to hold up a little better to grit on the logs. If cutting "dirty" wood, I will often pull out one of my green chains so I don't have to sharpen as often.
One other thing -- if you start dikking around lowering the depth gages, go slow at first. If you take them down too far, that will make the chain "grabby" (too aggressive) and create a lot more vibration because the teeth will be engaging the wood at too much of an angle.
Although full-chisel "non-safety" (yellow) chain seems to cut faster for me in green wood, the green ("safety") chain seems to hold up a little better to grit on the logs. If cutting "dirty" wood, I will often pull out one of my green chains so I don't have to sharpen as often.
One other thing -- if you start dikking around lowering the depth gages, go slow at first. If you take them down too far, that will make the chain "grabby" (too aggressive) and create a lot more vibration because the teeth will be engaging the wood at too much of an angle.
Cutting up wood pallets can be real dangerous. I do it, but I'm always real careful, and always try to cut the boards in such a way that they're right up against the saw dogs, so that you don't get a "grab/pull" situation that either rams the tip of the bar into another board (potentially causing kickback), or throws the freshly-cut board into your shin at about 100mph. I've had that happen and it HURTS!
Gratewhitehuntr
Wood and Steel. Yep.
Safety
Safety
Safety
Safety
I dislike the
safety culture, and mock it to it's face.
